I fear the red beast... yup communism

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 22 Jan 2012, 17:48

I fear communism may rear its red head sometime in the future, when I look about me I see the seeds of socialism and communism Marxism and suchlike ways .

Anyway thats my worry in the future, I feel people have forgot how pesky communists are .

last century they killed millions of people far more than the Nazis are claimed to have killed, yet somehow people are still taken in by their trickster ways.

Really I ought to move to Idaho or somewhere anti communist

When I see a communist I have the urge to chase him down the street whomping him with a large wet fish

woodburner · Post by **woodburner** » 22 Jan 2012, 18:05

A bit irrational. All people who have designs on power are just as untrustworthy.

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 22 Jan 2012, 18:32

Slight quibble over the Nazi reference, remember if Hitler had won the war he planned to murder roughly 30 million Slavs and who knows where he would have ended?

I recommend reading 'Africa Reich' which is based on apparent Nazi plans to occupy Africa and there genocidal plans to starve to death tens of millions of blacks. So if Hitler and his ilk had had there way, I would not be suprised if they had reached Communist levels of deaths.

Saying that, the Communists were a barbaric bunch which the Left still haven't got to grips with.

Regarding your fears of the future, I think there is some ground for them. I think the far-right have a better chance than the far-left in the coming decades but there will certainly be neo-Communistic revolutions in certain parts of the world as global capitalism starts to implode in the new era of Scarcity Industrialism.

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 22 Jan 2012, 20:12

Point of order: 26 million people in the USSR died during the war, so not that far from the 30M you mention. As for Africa, tens of millions of people have in fact died in famines in the recent past.

In other words, what's actually happened is not that much better than what people were fearing the nazis might do

.

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 22 Jan 2012, 20:15

If you add up the number of people killed in the soviet union from Lenin till its collapse and the number killed in the eastern European commie governments and red china I'd guess 100 million .

Even if Hitler had killed 30 million Slavs thats less than the commies killed, and he did have Russian slavs fighting on his side during the war, we British handed back I think it was a million or so cossacks balts etc who had fought on the German side against the commies and Stalin killed them .

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 22 Jan 2012, 20:57

RenewableCandy wrote:Point of order: 26 million people in the USSR died during the war, so not that far from the 30M you mention. As for Africa, tens of millions of people have in fact died in famines in the recent past.

In other words, what's actually happened is not that much better than what people were fearing the nazis might do .

Yes but many of those 26 million died as a result of Stalins total contempt for human life as much as the brutality of the German war machine.

Himmler planned to exterminate many more, so there would have been tens of millions more Slavs dying as a direct result of Nazi policy in the East.

Regarding the tens of millions who have died in recent years, a very small proportion of the near billion people in Africa.

The Nazis planned to starve to death the bulk of the African black population circa 1950s - comparing that to now would mean the death of half of BILLION blacks so no, you are plain wrong.

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 22 Jan 2012, 20:58

jonny2mad wrote:If you add up the number of people killed in the soviet union from Lenin till its collapse and the number killed in the eastern European commie governments and red china I'd guess 100 million .

Even if Hitler had killed 30 million Slavs thats less than the commies killed, and he did have Russian slavs fighting on his side during the war, we British handed back I think it was a million or so cossacks balts etc who had fought on the German side against the commies and Stalin killed them .

My point being that both sides, Hitler and Stalin (and Mao) are diabolical - I don't think either side are better or worse at the end of the day.

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 22 Jan 2012, 21:03

The Nazis planned to starve to death the bulk of the African black population circa 1950s - comparing that to now would mean the death of half of BILLION blacks so no, you are plain wrong.

only if that were actually the case. And indeed if it were doable. It's unlikely their machinations would have resulted in worse than what's seen in Africa now. Look at their life-expectancy figures.

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 22 Jan 2012, 21:29

RenewableCandy wrote:
The Nazis planned to starve to death the bulk of the African black population circa 1950s - comparing that to now would mean the death of half of BILLION blacks so no, you are plain wrong.
only if that were actually the case. And indeed if it were doable. It's unlikely their machinations would have resulted in worse than what's seen in Africa now. Look at their life-expectancy figures.

Really! They systemically murdered six million Jews in a matter of a few years when fighting a war against three powers, including two superpowers.

I would have thought that a victorious Nazi Germany controlling Europe and much of western Russia would have no problem in implementing its own Final Solution to the defenceless Africans.

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 22 Jan 2012, 21:30

RenewableCandy wrote:
The Nazis planned to starve to death the bulk of the African black population circa 1950s - comparing that to now would mean the death of half of BILLION blacks so no, you are plain wrong.
only if that were actually the case. And indeed if it were doable. It's unlikely their machinations would have resulted in worse than what's seen in Africa now. Look at their life-expectancy figures.

Life expectancy figures? Under the Nazis there wouldn't have been life at all!!!

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 22 Jan 2012, 23:20

Well consider Katyn Forrest Massacre (murder of the polish officer corp by the nkvd )which up until the 1990s was pinned on the Nazis using fabricated evidence confessions of German soldiers under torture .

President Roosevelt and Churchill deliberately covered up the evidence of who really committed the crime, and German soldiers were executed for something they had nothing to do with, and we and the soviets who actually committed the crime knew that.

So I would consider the possibility that these now found plans of Nazi African mass murder may be soviet or western disinfo fakes in other words .
I'm not saying they are but you have to question things when you know our side does tell quite serious lies

Beria and Stalin signed the order to kill 22,000 poles at katyn

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 22 Jan 2012, 23:42

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4Nl_Q-EjbA

worth watching thats your Beria and nkvd

another one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jekinMM1 ... re=related

shows how they were killed

woodburner · Post by **woodburner** » 23 Jan 2012, 06:53

jonny2mad wrote: President Roosevelt and Churchill deliberately covered up the evidence of who really committed the crime, and German soldiers were executed for something they had nothing to do with, and we and the soviets who actually committed the crime knew that.

So I would consider the possibility that these now found plans of Nazi African mass murder may be soviet or western disinfo fakes in other words .
I'm not saying they are but you have to question things when you know our side does tell quite serious lies

The first casualty of war (and anything else if there's a politician involved) is the truth.

How much of the truth has been covered up or distorted over recent activities in Iraq? Which political regime was responsible?

PS_RalphW · Post by **PS_RalphW** » 23 Jan 2012, 09:27

Do you remember that peer reviewed report in the Lancet which estimated the excess deaths in Iraq after 6 years of occupation in seven figures?

Not quoted much in the main stream media.
[edit]

Actually it was 6 figures. A later estimate by a polling agency of seven figures was discredited

The Lancet report has been widely vilified in the MSM but I see no evidence of it being discredited in scientific reports. I have heard it quoted as a 'statistical outlier' because it reported four times more deaths than other reports.

Either way, between 1 and 3% of the population died as a result of the war.

featherstick · Post by **featherstick** » 23 Jan 2012, 09:54

The death of millions of Russian, Turkmen, Ingush, Ukrainians, Poles etc. etc. in the Soviet Union had nothing to do with Communism and everything to do with the 1000-year old Russian tradition of regarding your own population as so much meat for the basis of your own ambitions. Over 100 thousand serfs died building St. Petersburg. Ivan the Terrible razed the city of Novgorod and slaughtered tens of thousands of its inhabitants, to quash a challenge to the power of Muscovy. Convict slave labour was well-established under the Tsars.

Some have attributed this to the influence of the Mongol franchising their rule to local overlords, a pattern of administration that continued well into the 19th century in Russia. When western European polities were introducing honest, educated, capable, and impartial state bureaucracies, Russia was still tax-farming and granting trade monopolies to imperial favourites.

Labour and life have always been cheap in Russia, that's why so many ordinary people get crushed under the wheels of its history.