Bugging out of London

[CountingDown]

OK, here's a fun topic.

I've just got a new job in London, will be commuting down once a week to stay Mon-Fri. Home & all that entails still in Manchester.

Not an ideal situation in many ways, but great job etc.

The dark qn is though, in event of TEOTWAWKI, what are the best suggestions on bugging out of London to get back?

Route / Attitude / Equipment ?

Just to add to the fun is this quote - "Something military planners have known for years. In a major event London could only last a few days before control was lost. The plan folks is to cordon at the M25 and let everything on the inside reach it's own eventual equilibrium. Nothing goes in. Nothing comes out. Welcome to dystopia."

(from http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jan/06/just-in-time-business-model-disaster-risk)

[DominicJ]

Its only 200miles.
My 125cc scooter got 25mpl and had a 5 litre fuel tank (125miles).
So a scooter and a spare 5L container of fuel would have the range(125+125) with a bit left over for diversions.
That was also doing "stop start" with an average speed of about 17 mph.

The M25 isnt a "sunk" motorway so crossing it perpendicular to traffic flow with a scooter would be possible, if a bit of heavy lifting.
At 117miles long its pretty long, but 234 tanks stationed every half mile could close it with ease.

Personaly, I think an overnight total collapse is unlikely.
It would have to get really really bad really really fast for the London to Manchester Train not to run one morning.
If you think its all coming down, tell your boss someones just died and your taking the rest of the week off, jump on the train home, and make sure you dont use the same dead relative next time, assuming their is one.

The Royal Marines Commando Courses final task is a 30 mile march in full kit, which they get 8 hours for (7 for officers)
So even if your hyper fit, walking home would be at least a weeks trek (you wouldnt be in fioghting kit, but you would need a weeks food)

[CountingDown]

I'm definitely thinking that awareness and heading for the first train is my primary route. Even if that only gets me half way.

I was wondering if Bike was a better option to walking, or whether it would be too high-profile a way to travel in event of colapse (as would a scooter)

Or am I being too negative

[emordnilap]

I'm definitely thinking that awareness and heading for the first train is my primary route. Even if that only gets me half way.

I was wondering if Bike was a better option to walking, or whether it would be too high-profile a way to travel in event of colapse (as would a scooter)

Or am I being too negative

Walking is brilliant and ultimately the only reliable means of locomotion, outside being injured; work on that (walking, not being injured!). London to Manchester is not impossible to walk.

[CountingDown]

I'm definitely thinking that awareness and heading for the first train is my primary route. Even if that only gets me half way.

I was wondering if Bike was a better option to walking, or whether it would be too high-profile a way to travel in event of colapse (as would a scooter)

Or am I being too negative

Walking is brilliant and ultimately the only reliable means of locomotion, outside being injured; work on that (walking, not being injured!). London to Manchester is not impossible to walk.

Damn, I knew fitness was going to come into this somewhere!

[mikepepler]

Use a bike. Either keep a folding bike at the office (or take it down with you on the train), or be prepared to beg/borrow/steal one to get away on. If you're moderately fit then 50+ miles a day is no problem on a bike.

However you travel, the thing to remember is food - you won't be able to keep up a good pace if you don't have something to eat.

Make sure you have good footwear too!

On equipment, check out http://www.survivalblog.com/g-o-o-d/

[adam2]

Leaving by train or other public transport at the first oportunity has a lot to commend it, but is no good if a disaster occurs without any warning.

If leaving by train I would seriously consider carrying a folding bicycle to facilitate onward travel if the train does not take you all the way.

A moped or lightweight petrol motorbike has the merit of speed and relative cheapness, but cant be taken on the train.
You will therefore have to ride it from Manchester to London initialy, or purchase one in London.

If some emergency prevents travel, it would be well to keep basic survival supplies in London for at least a month.
Lifeboat biscuits, chocolate bars, tinned food, bottled water, chlorine tablets, flashlight, battery lantern, battery radio, geiger counter, basic first aid kit, basic tool kit, warm blankets and clothes.
Such supplies would also help if you were in London, but some disaster befell Manchester and made return unwise.

As well as TEOTWAWKI, such supplies would be handy in the event that food, water, or fuel supplies were disrupted by extreme weather or industrial disputes.

If you cant leave London BEFORE the panic starts, then it might be well to keep a low profile for a week or two, rather than join a panicking crowd.

[CountingDown]

Thanks for the advice guys,

I'd been considering a Brompton for the commute anyway - good thoughts about using a folder for multi-mode escape!

Will have a look at links and start to get my BOB ready!

[bealers]

in event of TEOTWAWKI, what are the best suggestions on bugging out of London to get back?

We can convoy back together on train/Brompton Andrew Feel free to borrow my Brompton for a few days to see if it works out for you.

Good points in this thread. I'll admit that being a part-time London worker the same scenario has crossed my mind, but for some reason it's never played a part in my resilience planning.

When the riots were happening I felt much more in control having my bike in the office, at least one train station was temporarily closed (in Hackney at least) and being on a bike allowed me to see what as going on a lot more then being part of the herd on public transport. In reality the disturbances were pretty minor and localised, that didn't stop it being a rather surreal time, though.

I think I'll start keeping my micro 1 man tent and a tiny stove in London, just in case, as well as a small bag with stuff in.

[kenneal - lagger]

I admit to being a doomer but even I don't think we would have collapse overnight. A bank collapse or a strike on or by Iran is what I think is the most likely trigger for full collapse at the moment. I would think that we would get a few day's warning of a bank collapse and the Iran problem would take a week or more to ricochet back here.

Unless, of course, they lobbed a missile on London, in which case you wouldn't be bothered about getting out!! As far as I've read, though, their missiles are of a range to hit Israel so the last point isn't really serious.

It would pay to have a bag equipped for the time of year in case of a protracted train journey home to Manchester. Water and some food would be essential. A friend of ours, many years ago in student days, got the train from Paris to Istanbul and had to endure a couple of days without food as he had neglected to take any with him. Luckily he had some water. And that was peace time. Remember the Boy Scout motto (well the official one, anyway) - Be Prepared!

[mikepepler]

Oh, the other thing is to get some training, as this is worth more than equipment. We went on a 2-day survival course:
http://peplers.blogspot.com/2010/04/sur ... vival.html The guy also does urban survival courses as well.

I've considered these issues for the same reasons as other people here - once a week I take the train from Rye into London for a day. I don't have space to store anything there really, and there's also the chance of problems occurring en-route, so I carry everything with me. My usual kit (which needs expanding, but is better than nothing) is:

- survival box, including various odds and ends like fishing line, snare ware, small knife, firelighting kit, wire saw, water purifying tablets, etc.
- compass
- leatherman tool (yes, I know it's not technically a legal blade to carry...)
- water bottle (only one, as I have the purifying tablets)
- wind-up torch using ultracapacitors (so no dead battery), which can also charge my phone.
- thermal T-shirt (to add to whatever I'm already wearing)
- decent waterproof coat (wearing/carrying it, even if no rain)
- extra food
- basic medicines, basically painkillers, antihistamines to help keep going if feeling rough.
- decent (but smart) boots, so they look fine to wear in the office
- wool hiking socks (wearing - make sure you have them on when choosing your boots!)
- 'survival bracelet', made of about 3m of paracord, which can be unravelled into strands for various uses.
- phone with map software in it that doesn't need a signal to work
- a rough plan of a route home (70 miles), including a possible stopover point (in woodland).

What I ought to do, but haven't yet:
- give more thought to my extra food, as I'm not sure I have the right stuff.
- figure out if I could store some food/water at the office, so I can have more ready without carrying it everywhere.
- actually go and visit my planned overnight stop (I've only used Google Streetview to check it out so far), and cache some food and water there.
- try out my bug-out route for real
- add a proper first aid kit

[CountingDown]

We can convoy back together on train/Brompton Andrew Feel free to borrow my Brompton for a few days to see if it works out for you.

Good points in this thread. I'll admit that being a part-time London worker the same scenario has crossed my mind, but for some reason it's never played a part in my resilience planning.

When the riots were happening I felt much more in control having my bike in the office, at least one train station was temporarily closed (in Hackney at least) and being on a bike allowed me to see what as going on a lot more then being part of the herd on public transport. In reality the disturbances were pretty minor and localised, that didn't stop it being a rather surreal time, though.

I think I'll start keeping my micro 1 man tent and a tiny stove in London, just in case, as well as a small bag with stuff in.

J & I are pissing ourselves at the vision of our Brompton convoy Not quite Easy Rider

Thanks for the offer of a test - I'd be up for that! Also, what microtent / small stove have you gone for?

I'm liking the idea of the folding bike as a way to get between other, still operating modes of longer-distance transport, with the option of doing the whole trip if required.

Ken - Agreed- highly likely that keeping my eyes open, and having a stash of cash to pay for the last-minute trains, but just also getting a backup plan in place too.

Mike - blimey you are serious! Should have guessed you'd be a few steps ahead on this one. Am starting to think a bit of training might be of benefit - nice link! And that's a great BOB list. What torch have you got for that? and what map software on the phone?

[PS_RalphW]

If you get A Brompton get two strong locks. They are very desirable and easily nicked. My two were taken from my (locked) shed. My colleague's was cut from a bike rack at the back of our office in the middle of the day.

Bike thieves are blatent and almost always get away with it. Bromptons retain their value and sell for £500+ second hand.

[RenewableCandy]

Do you have any friends in London whose house/flat would tolerate a bit of extra stuff (e.g. Brompton if you can't keep it in the office)?

Also, have you thought of doing a "practice run" one weekend, just to get an idea of the distance/time/difficulty, and to suss out in advance any places to rest en route? Do you have friends on the way somewhere, e.g. outskirts of Brum, and are they "in" on your plans?

[kenneal - lagger]

Oh, the other thing is to get some training, as this is worth more than equipment. We went on a 2-day survival course:
http://peplers.blogspot.com/2010/04/sur ... vival.html The guy also does urban survival courses as well.

I've considered these issues for the same reasons as other people here - once a week I take the train from Rye into London for a day. I don't have space to store anything there really, and there's also the chance of problems occurring en-route, so I carry everything with me. My usual kit (which needs expanding, but is better than nothing) is:

- survival box, including various odds and ends like fishing line, snare ware, small knife, firelighting kit, wire saw, water purifying tablets, etc.
- compass
- leatherman tool (yes, I know it's not technically a legal blade to carry...)
- water bottle (only one, as I have the purifying tablets)
- wind-up torch using ultracapacitors (so no dead battery), which can also charge my phone.
- thermal T-shirt (to add to whatever I'm already wearing)
- decent waterproof coat (wearing/carrying it, even if no rain)
- extra food
- basic medicines, basically painkillers, antihistamines to help keep going if feeling rough.
- decent (but smart) boots, so they look fine to wear in the office
- wool hiking socks (wearing - make sure you have them on when choosing your boots!)
- 'survival bracelet', made of about 3m of paracord, which can be unravelled into strands for various uses.
- phone with map software in it that doesn't need a signal to work
- a rough plan of a route home (70 miles), including a possible stopover point (in woodland).

What I ought to do, but haven't yet:
- give more thought to my extra food, as I'm not sure I have the right stuff.
- figure out if I could store some food/water at the office, so I can have more ready without carrying it everywhere.
- actually go and visit my planned overnight stop (I've only used Google Streetview to check it out so far), and cache some food and water there.
- try out my bug-out route for real
- add a proper first aid kit

And I thought I was a doomer.

I can just imagine the look on the face of the policeman on the Xray machine at the House of Commons when I go up for the next APPGOPO meeting carrying that lot! They queried the small torch on my front door key ring last time!