If you want to know what kind of hell our world has become

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 17 Dec 2014, 17:22

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUaxyhRfqyk

mass beheading video I havent watched that one but Ive seen others and you get the kind of idea even if you see the begining

http://www.frontpagemag.com/2014/dawn-p ... l-madness/

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 17 Dec 2014, 20:17

biffvernon wrote:
stevecook172001 wrote:
biffvernon wrote:I see the Pakistan prime minister has reintroduced the death penalty. So that's a result for the bad guys.
What do you expect him to do?
I don't have expectations but I would hope that Pakistan would develop a similar approach to that agreed by all EU nations and consign capital punishment to history.

EU nations do not, currently, have mass atrocities happening on a daily basis.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 17 Dec 2014, 20:19

emordnilap wrote:
biffvernon wrote:
stevecook172001 wrote:What do you expect him to do?
I don't have expectations but I would hope that Pakistan would develop a similar approach to that agreed by all EU nations and consign capital punishment to history.
It's possible we have reached some high point of humanitarianism and empathy and now our masters wish to put a stop to it. This is the Shock Doctrine era, after all.

Civilisation is the cherry on the top of the resource cake. Peak resources means peak civilisation.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 17 Dec 2014, 23:11

I am at a loss as to how to deal nicely with people who have sworn to kill me or convert me.

Should I die or live as a religious slave ?

Or should I kill every ************ who tries to kill me ?

Make no mistake, given half a chance ISIS will be in your village giving you that choice, and no amount of hand-wringing or blaming the Yanks will make them go away.

Islamic fundamentalism is a cancer in your little toe, you can cut your toe off and survive or you can pull your socks up high until it reaches your knee, and die.

It isn't an "alternative lifestyle", it's a barbaric disease and it needs stamping on hard.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 18 Dec 2014, 00:13

Firstly, can we dispense with the specious argument that we should be fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here. The fundamental truth is and always has been that we are fighting them over there because we are over there, Or, if not us, then some local puppet proxy our governments have put in place. As it happens, one of the few nations over there that is not one of the USA's/West's puppets, namely Syria, was being being routinely bombed by either the USA/UK or by guerrillas armed to the teeth with weapons that we supplied, who were provided with strategic military information by us and whom our governments and compliant media were more than happy to call "freedom fighters" little more than one year ago. Those same fighters who, by the way, are now being routinely bombed by us and who now go by the name of ISIS (among other names). I mean, you really couldn't make this shit up could you C.

Secondly, nobody sensible is going to disagree with the argument that religious extremists of the likes of ISIL, Al-Qaeda and others are dangerous people that have to be defeated. However, fish need water in which to swim. The water in which these fish are swimming is created by the perceived injustice of the West's policies towards the Muslim world, towards the Israel/Palestine question, towards the propping up of the corrupt kings and puppet presidents of the Arab world and towards the unholy mess that is Iraq;

This is the water in which these extremists swim and until it is dried up they and their ilk will persist.

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 18 Dec 2014, 02:01

ISIL is swimming in the water of a civil war between Shia and Sunni Muslims. It would have happened eventually as dictators like Saddam Hussein and Assad died, in fact the war in Syria started when Assad started killing his own people at an otherwise peaceful protest. Nothing to do with the west. Syria is a proxy war between Iran and the gulf States and is fed by money and arms from those sources. The West didn't have to intervene in any way at all.

As the Western economy dies it will destabilise the whole world economy and probably lead to the end of the world civilisation. This will lead to unrest worldwide and the danger in this country is that places with a predominantly Muslim population will be taken over by the nutters who currently go to Syria to fight: Sharia Law will be declared in Southall, Slough, Bradford and a few other places and we will have Jihad waged across the country as those nutters with no jobs and food become mainstream and seek to put us infidels to the sword.

Whether they win or not will come down to who is best organised to supply energy, food and security to their own side. Let's hope its not the Jihadies. We must also hope that the winners of the Sunni/Shia civil war, which will probably be the Sunnis based on numbers, will have weakened themselves enough that they can't set off on Jihad westwards because they will blame us for the breakdown of he world economy and come seeking revenge. Their religious fervour is the only force in the world at the moment which could set the whole world ablaze. A widespread loss of wealth could be the spark required to set off large numbers of disaffected youth. The US has the power to do it but I don't think they they would have the will.

PS_RalphW · Post by **PS_RalphW** » 18 Dec 2014, 06:53

Syria is more complicated. It is a war for resources. The population has grown sharply over many decades,and was swollen by Sunnis from Iraq after we went in and killed Saddam,and installed a shia government. Combined with climate change, Syria ran out of food. This is a war of survival for the people living in Syria. That is the underlying force driving people to fight, the ideologies are just memes that people have latched on to tell themselves that they are justified in killing their fellow humans. The more extreme fighters in isis have bred from birth in religious madrasas to be born killers, but they are a small minority.

It will get worse as resources run out, but islam is not the primary cause. When the food runs short, people will kill if they are given an excuse, any excuse.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 18 Dec 2014, 08:59

Syria, between 2005 and 2010, suffered the worst drought, possibly since the Neolithic revolution that invented agriculture in this area. ~1.5 million farmers left their land and came to the cities looking for assistance from their government. They got none so they turned to religion and guns.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 18 Dec 2014, 09:39

Ralph and Biff, yes to both of these.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 18 Dec 2014, 10:31

Not entirely unrelated, there was that little nugget from Cameron yesterday: he said welfare has to be cut - otherwise the police budget has to be cut.

Inch by inch.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 18 Dec 2014, 10:36

stevecook172001 wrote:Firstly, can we dispense with the specious argument that we should be fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here. The fundamental truth is and always has been that we are fighting them over there because we are over there, Or, if not us, then some local puppet proxy our governments have put in place. As it happens, one of the few nations over there that is not one of the USA's/West's puppets, namely Syria, was being being routinely bombed by either the USA/UK or by guerrillas armed to the teeth with weapons that we supplied, who were provided with strategic military information by us and whom our governments and compliant media were more than happy to call "freedom fighters" little more than one year ago. Those same fighters who, by the way, are now being routinely bombed by us and who now go by the name of ISIS (among other names). I mean, you really couldn't make this shit up could you C.

Secondly, nobody sensible is going to disagree with the argument that religious extremists of the likes of ISIL, Al-Qaeda and others are dangerous people that have to be defeated. However, fish need water in which to swim. The water in which these fish are swimming is created by the perceived injustice of the West's policies towards the Muslim world, towards the Israel/Palestine question, towards the propping up of the corrupt kings and puppet presidents of the Arab world and towards the unholy mess that is Iraq;

This is the water in which these extremists swim and until it is dried up they and their ilk will persist.

Double yes to all of this. And UKiP is lapping it up.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 18 Dec 2014, 11:12

A neoliberal spring

neoliberalism’s penchant for chopping to pieces basic necessities, i.e., austerity, a la Italy, Greece, Portugal, and Spain, where protests “on the streets” against neoliberal austerity are not covered by the U.S. news media, in the end, may be neoliberalism’s undoing.

Only four weeks ago: “Riot police clashed with protesters, students and unionists in Milan and Padua, in the north of the country, while in Rome a group of demonstrators scaled the Colosseum to protest against the labour reforms proposed by the government of Matteo Renzi, the 39-year-old prime minister,” Nick Squires, Rome, Italy Protests Erupt Across the Country, The Telegraph, Nov. 14, 2014. Neoliberalism always clashes with labor.

Worth reading in full. There again, most of us here are in choir.

Already, the U.S. Department of Defense is making preparations for a Neoliberal Spring by arming local police departments all across the country… with military hardware

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 20 Dec 2014, 21:41

Nafeez Ahmed, perceptive as ever:

http://www.nafeezahmed.com/2014/12/who- ... chool.html

Who is responsible for the Pakistan school massacre?
Depends who you ask.

Some real background in this article.

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 21 Dec 2014, 05:20

beslan

you could also look at loads of other attacks on schools in afghanistan and around the islamic world . you could look at the destruction of works of artas well

but hey its the wests fault .

if you go back in time a thousand years or so you see the same fundermentalists destroying the art of the ancient world but that was I imagine the fault of the CIA .

Slavery thats the fault of the CIA or MI6.

See I've actually talked to people who think destroying statues is what god wants these are so called "british" muslims, the sort of people who wander over to syria, now this isnt the majority of british muslims but part of quite a large minority http://hyperallergic.com/136800/isis-de ... and-syria/ I'm not sure how they would justify destroying a school full of muslim kids it could be they see them as unbelievers, really if they are very young I can't see how that would be justified but its all part of the whole mad death cult aspect of the religion .

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 21 Dec 2014, 05:40

I'm actually surprised they havent attacked art objects in the uk maybe they have and not got publicity but things like stonehenge would be a target statues with faces would be a target