Are we on the brink of an electric car revolution?

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 17 May 2016, 08:57

Most of the fuel used in F1 racing is used by the spectators travelling to the track, some of them in helicopters. The 22 little cars on the track don't use much.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 18 May 2016, 10:31

I remember being told (on a school visit to a milk bottling plant) that amongst the many good reasons to use an electric milk float was so as to not disturb sleeping people. There is no such consideration by anyone these days.

What's more, I also clearly remember being woken up the first time milk was delivered in a diesel-powered van. I wondered what the racket was.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 18 May 2016, 11:08

Surely the noise of clanking empties is greater, the advantage of electric is that it was better on the frequent stop-starts and only needed a short range as dairy distributions points were locally frequent.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 18 May 2016, 11:51

I did say 'amongst the many good reasons'.

A diesel van, left running, is to me more offensive than a few clanking empties. Others may differ.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 18 May 2016, 14:04

I liked it when we had the horse. No noise, no on and off, the horse knew for itself when to move on to the next house.
I loved going out with bucket and shovel for the benefit of mum's roses.

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 19 May 2016, 03:06

biffvernon wrote:Most of the fuel used in F1 racing is used by the spectators travelling to the track, some of them in helicopters. The 22 little cars on the track don't use much.

That applies to all "sports". They are ultimately all unsustainable in the medium term. Changing my mind - No! They are all unsustainable now. They contribute to the mass of supposedly essential travelling which we do. According to Peter Harper, one of the founders of CAT, "It is easier for a rich man to pass through the eye of a needle than to live a Zero Carbon lifestyle" because we all have these "essential" things that we must do such as visiting relative who live the other side of the country or supporting our team at a game the other side of the country.

All that will change!

Post by **clv101** » 19 May 2016, 07:17

I'm not totally convinced about the problem of 10,000s people visiting major sporting events. 10,000,000s are sitting at home watching on TV - a pretty low impact activity compared to what they might otherwise be doing.

Lurkalot · Post by **Lurkalot** » 21 May 2016, 12:39

I think the point I was trying , and seemingly failing , to make is one of influence. Motor racing is seen as exciting , glamorous and sexy whereas to many electric vehicles are seen as the preserve of milkmen and tree huggers , sorry if anyone finds that term offensive. Take a look at motoring programmes on TV , they concentrate on sports and luxury vehicles as something to aspire to. Go into any newsagents and you'll see a fair number of magazines devoted to racing cars , rallying and magazines to help Kevin turn his one litre corsa into something akin to a rocket powered hot rod . Ok an exaggeration I know but try counting the number of magazines devoted to turning Kevin's heap into a safe hypermiler .
Are we on the brink of an electric car revolution ? I would say that it's going to be a very slow and subtle revolution as long as there is still a lot of focus on ICE vehicles .

woodburner · Post by **woodburner** » 21 May 2016, 16:58

Are you calling me a milkman??? I'm disgusted!!!

I think eletric cars will replace only a small proportion of today's ICE cars. Once the oil is gone, so has the fuel. Whatever other fuels there may be, the power they can provide will be nowhere near a replacement for oil. Fossil fuel and equivalent activity is compared to 146,000,000 Hiroshima bombs per year. Where is the equivalent going to come from to run BAU. Cars will be way down the list of important things to have.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/1 ... ima-bombs/

I can hear the counter arguments to these figures, they are not intended to be literal, but to try and get over the magnitude of the problem that most people think (or pretend) doesn't exist.

Lurkalot · Post by **Lurkalot** » 21 May 2016, 18:25

woodburner wrote:Are you calling me a milkman??? I'm disgusted!!!

You really shouldn't be , it's not all trundling around in a float,
http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/confess ... 1113991616

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 22 May 2016, 04:23

woodburner wrote:Are you calling me a milkman??? I'm disgusted!!!

I think eletric cars will replace only a small proportion of today's ICE cars. Once the oil is gone, so has the fuel. Whatever other fuels there may be, the power they can provide will be nowhere near a replacement for oil. Fossil fuel and equivalent activity is compared to 146,000,000 Hiroshima bombs per year. Where is the equivalent going to come from to run BAU. Cars will be way down the list of important things to have.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2013/1 ... ima-bombs/

I can hear the counter arguments to these figures, they are not intended to be literal, but to try and get over the magnitude of the problem that most people think (or pretend) doesn't exist.

I agree with you on this Woodburner but I still think it is worth the effort in getting as many people as possible to change as soon as we can so that as many of the vehicles that remain are EVs.

EVs can make a contribution to the usability of renewables by increasing the storage capacity for renewable energy. Most EVs will have surplus capacity in the battery over a 24 hr cycle most of the time so this can be used to store energy which can be put back into the grid. there are schemes coming online to facilitate this.

But, as you say, for how long these will last, or BAU will last, I have no idea.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 24 May 2016, 10:53

If people insist on using cars, then EVs would make great sense over here in Ireland, mainly because of the size of the place but also because the average journey length for females is around 11 kilometres, the average for males around 15 kilometres. It means that most journeys are shorter, a distance easily walked or cycled.

Considering that the majority of cars use diesel, the engine is efficiently warm only at the average journey's end.

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 24 May 2016, 14:23

This weekend for anyone in the area -

PS_RalphW · Post by **PS_RalphW** » 24 May 2016, 15:16

I would like to come, an ideal first long run in my Leaf. However, I am in charge of a recalcitrant 12 yo this w/e, and I very much doubt I could get her in the car with the prospect of 5 hours in the car and 1 1/2 at charging stations just to go and look at a load of cars and bikes.

woodburner · Post by **woodburner** » 24 May 2016, 16:30

I bet you could if you told her she couldn't go and had to stay home.