Hi probably another previously answered question from a newb but having gone through the site I cant find a string, so I'll ask of what seems a pretty educated biofuel membership.
Given that the successful production of algae fuels are so reliant on the sun, can it be done commercially in the UK?
Algae fuel?
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Algae fuel?
Last edited by algae on 17 Oct 2008, 08:08, edited 2 times in total.
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adam2
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A sunnier climate would certainly be more productive than the UK.
Algae could be grown here, as to whether it would be financialy viable there is no simple answer, it would depend on the cost of the required land, plant and machinery, interest rates, and the price of the fuel being displaced by the algae.
Common sense suggests that is probably not viable, or someone would be doing it already on a large scale.
Most biofuels have the drawbact that they often displace food crops, this need not be the case with algae since they can be grown in shallow tanks etc placed on roofs, or on the ground in regions unsuitable for agriculture.
Algae can be used as human or animal food, which has been proposed, or can be processed in liquid fuel, its quite an innvolved process though, and unless liquid fuel is essiential, solar thermal or PV, may be more effective.
Algae could be grown here, as to whether it would be financialy viable there is no simple answer, it would depend on the cost of the required land, plant and machinery, interest rates, and the price of the fuel being displaced by the algae.
Common sense suggests that is probably not viable, or someone would be doing it already on a large scale.
Most biofuels have the drawbact that they often displace food crops, this need not be the case with algae since they can be grown in shallow tanks etc placed on roofs, or on the ground in regions unsuitable for agriculture.
Algae can be used as human or animal food, which has been proposed, or can be processed in liquid fuel, its quite an innvolved process though, and unless liquid fuel is essiential, solar thermal or PV, may be more effective.
"Installers and owners of emergency diesels must assume that they will have to run for a week or more"
Thanks for this Adam and while I agree with most of what you say there are just too many positives in this field. I have several brand names ready-to-go and I’m hoping to build a great team. A mix of engineers, microbiologists and sales people with a common bond i.e. the entrepreneurial flair to create a new and potentially leading brand.
Algae is seen by experts as the most promising source of green fuel for the future. Where the world's most abundant plant life can via photosynthesis be super efficient using sunlight and carbon dioxide from the air to make organic material such as sugars, proteins and of course oils.
Couple this with added advantages that algaefuel does not have contaminants such as sulphur, nitrogen and benzene contained in standard crude oil.
Most importantly for us in the (United Kingdom) algae could produce 100,000 litres of biodiesel a year per hectare of land, compared to 5,000 litres for rapeseed currently the most productive British option.
Displacing food crops nationally per hectare is not long-term or sustainable in the UK, especially when we balance this against micro-algae by a factor of 8 to 25 for palm oil and a factor of 40 to 120 for rapeseed (UK preferred) it is evident this is by far and away the highest potential energy yield?
Our plan “ will not use valuable farmland” to grow the basic resource and prove that the process could and “we believe should” use non-arable land and non-potable water which will still deliver 10 to 100 times more energy per acre than cropland biofuels.
Our options:
Algae can be grown in open ponds, but low-density blooms are an inefficient way to produce a lot of fuel. Alternatively technologically advanced photobioreactors are extremely expensive. - So how do we make the successful leap to commercial production??
????????.co.uk is an exciting project at various levels. Significant additonal revenue streams from the process will be created, byproducts such as fats, sugars and proteins, can be used for animal feeds or replacements for other petroleum products from cosmetics to plastics.
Algae can produce solid fuels, methane gas, or bio-ethanol, and can even be used to supply electricity.
As far as the biodiesel (v) arable crop argument is concerned, farming algae will not eat up the limited arable lands. Algae can even be fed on liquid human or animal sewage or on areas where waterways are being polluted by fertilizer run offs. We also have plans to source algae from sewerage ponds located in various regions. So the potential possibilities for the team for micro cultures are endless.
The bottom line is algae grows incredibly fast, is biodegradable and produces lot of oil.
This whole area ‘is of interest to anyone - interested in the environment’ I personally have been involved in anything eco-friendly since the rechargeable battery. On a more serious note though, I live at Heathrow so outside of putting together a team to create a lucrative business I have a vested interest i.e. the health and well-being of my family.
I want to create a business that can cut pollution in marked and meaningful way.
Before anyone pipes in “the big boys will gobble up this market and all you do will be for nothing” - I don’t believe this. I have raised funds over the years for many start-ups who had a simple concept, a business plan, or a prototype aligned to a market that is set to go ballistic.
I believe technology over the last 20 years has been suppressed by petroleum companies who had no interest in their core market being diluted. So there are many advantages (for a team of innovators) to become market leaders and with that team in place I know there are certainly lots of investors that I can tap into for the same.
The key questions are the efficiency, plant and cost to make this comercially viable. What process makes it happen. – Is it ponds or photobioreactors.
I believe that algae farms will become the main source of oil in biodiesel production.
Additionally: I would like to see the UK lead in this sector and I would love to be part of a team that brought new jet fuel to the UK aviation industry, instantly cutting our worldwide carbon footprint.
This is an open opportunity by people who want to make a difference. If you would like to be part of it let us know. Everyone involved will be a ‘shareholder, if we achieve recognised brand (outside of your rising stock) that will be your payback. Everyone in the team can be wealthy and will ultimately ‘be recognised as a pioneer in the algae fuel sector.
I am trying to source people much more intelligent than I am. I am a marketing man with a modicum of what is required but when we have it – I will sell it "and" find us the corporate cash and philanthropists we need.
If anyone here has any ideas on how to make an impact, if anyone has the experience, if anyone has the enthusiasm and would like to be part of this team I would love to talk to them either in open forum or by pm.
Jim.
Algae is seen by experts as the most promising source of green fuel for the future. Where the world's most abundant plant life can via photosynthesis be super efficient using sunlight and carbon dioxide from the air to make organic material such as sugars, proteins and of course oils.
Couple this with added advantages that algaefuel does not have contaminants such as sulphur, nitrogen and benzene contained in standard crude oil.
Most importantly for us in the (United Kingdom) algae could produce 100,000 litres of biodiesel a year per hectare of land, compared to 5,000 litres for rapeseed currently the most productive British option.
Displacing food crops nationally per hectare is not long-term or sustainable in the UK, especially when we balance this against micro-algae by a factor of 8 to 25 for palm oil and a factor of 40 to 120 for rapeseed (UK preferred) it is evident this is by far and away the highest potential energy yield?
Our plan “ will not use valuable farmland” to grow the basic resource and prove that the process could and “we believe should” use non-arable land and non-potable water which will still deliver 10 to 100 times more energy per acre than cropland biofuels.
Our options:
Algae can be grown in open ponds, but low-density blooms are an inefficient way to produce a lot of fuel. Alternatively technologically advanced photobioreactors are extremely expensive. - So how do we make the successful leap to commercial production??
????????.co.uk is an exciting project at various levels. Significant additonal revenue streams from the process will be created, byproducts such as fats, sugars and proteins, can be used for animal feeds or replacements for other petroleum products from cosmetics to plastics.
Algae can produce solid fuels, methane gas, or bio-ethanol, and can even be used to supply electricity.
As far as the biodiesel (v) arable crop argument is concerned, farming algae will not eat up the limited arable lands. Algae can even be fed on liquid human or animal sewage or on areas where waterways are being polluted by fertilizer run offs. We also have plans to source algae from sewerage ponds located in various regions. So the potential possibilities for the team for micro cultures are endless.
The bottom line is algae grows incredibly fast, is biodegradable and produces lot of oil.
This whole area ‘is of interest to anyone - interested in the environment’ I personally have been involved in anything eco-friendly since the rechargeable battery. On a more serious note though, I live at Heathrow so outside of putting together a team to create a lucrative business I have a vested interest i.e. the health and well-being of my family.
I want to create a business that can cut pollution in marked and meaningful way.
Before anyone pipes in “the big boys will gobble up this market and all you do will be for nothing” - I don’t believe this. I have raised funds over the years for many start-ups who had a simple concept, a business plan, or a prototype aligned to a market that is set to go ballistic.
I believe technology over the last 20 years has been suppressed by petroleum companies who had no interest in their core market being diluted. So there are many advantages (for a team of innovators) to become market leaders and with that team in place I know there are certainly lots of investors that I can tap into for the same.
The key questions are the efficiency, plant and cost to make this comercially viable. What process makes it happen. – Is it ponds or photobioreactors.
I believe that algae farms will become the main source of oil in biodiesel production.
Additionally: I would like to see the UK lead in this sector and I would love to be part of a team that brought new jet fuel to the UK aviation industry, instantly cutting our worldwide carbon footprint.
This is an open opportunity by people who want to make a difference. If you would like to be part of it let us know. Everyone involved will be a ‘shareholder, if we achieve recognised brand (outside of your rising stock) that will be your payback. Everyone in the team can be wealthy and will ultimately ‘be recognised as a pioneer in the algae fuel sector.
I am trying to source people much more intelligent than I am. I am a marketing man with a modicum of what is required but when we have it – I will sell it "and" find us the corporate cash and philanthropists we need.
If anyone here has any ideas on how to make an impact, if anyone has the experience, if anyone has the enthusiasm and would like to be part of this team I would love to talk to them either in open forum or by pm.
Jim.
Re: Algae fuel?
There was a previous reference:algae wrote:Hi probably another previously answered question from a newb but having gone through the site I cant find a string, so I'll ask of what seems a pretty educated biofuel membership.
Given that the successful production of algae fuels are so reliant on the sun, can it be done commercially in the UK?
http://www.powerswitch.org.uk/forum/vie ... php?t=5639
but it didn't get any comments.
I thought the point about growing algae in GB is to use the excess CO2 and heat from a power station to speed up the growth (while we have fossil fuel power stations).
I've looked at algae source biofuel on and off a few times over the past 5 years or so. (I looked seriously into starting a WVO biodiesel company back in 2003). The US have been researching this for at least 30 years and there are a few start-ups there, and in the Netherlands, that are just beginning to get going on a commercial scale now.
Here are a few interesting links I have collected over time:
http://www.energybulletin.net/node/1330
http://thefraserdomain.typepad.com/ener ... _of_n.html
http://www.ecosherpa.com/news/algae-co2-biofuel/
http://www.algaelink.com/
http://www.greenfuelonline.com/technology.html
http://www.oilgae.com/
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea ... y?id=45323
Here are a few interesting links I have collected over time:
http://www.energybulletin.net/node/1330
http://thefraserdomain.typepad.com/ener ... _of_n.html
http://www.ecosherpa.com/news/algae-co2-biofuel/
http://www.algaelink.com/
http://www.greenfuelonline.com/technology.html
http://www.oilgae.com/
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea ... y?id=45323
Re: Algae fuel?
Thanks for this Cycloloco, I know of Oilgae and yes harvesting greenhouse gases to make fuel is an option we are looking at.Cycloloco wrote: I thought the point about growing algae in GB is to use the excess CO2 and heat from a power station to speed up the growth (while we have fossil fuel power stations).
We breathe in oxygen to make energy, algae *breathe in carbon dioxide to make energy. So if we capture carbon dioxide and feed it to the algae, theyll grow, once they’ve matured they can be squeezed to make oil and of course all of the other byproducts I've spoken of. Leftover algae can be converted to ethanol and used as feed for livestock.
* I simplified the above a little; algae actually use light energy captured through photosynthesis to turn carbon dioxide into other compounds, which can then be used as an energy source and raw materials.
But its all a question of scale, cost and a certain amount of legalise. However a 300-megawatt facility’s 2.5 million tons of annual carbon dioxide emissions could at full scale reduce greenhouse gas emissions by as much as 60% and produce 10 million gallons of biodiesel per year.
Last edited by algae on 19 Oct 2008, 09:42, edited 2 times in total.
Thank you snow hope,snow hope wrote:That was a powerful post Jim.
If indeed algae has the potential you seem to indicate then it sounds like a hell of a business proposition.
I will send you a pm.
This for me is a mix of genuine eco concern and the opportunity to build (with the right people) what could be a mega business which is needed. I am concerned for my childrens future if we dont get a grip and it would be a great legacy to be one of the people who drove this forward for the betterment of all.
I'm getting off my soapbox now and I dont think outside my last post I'll give much more away or I could be selling the family silver. Therefore I hope I've said enough to prove I have a plan and know 'a little' about this, so the people I need on this forum make contact.
I look forward to your pm and I hope the technologically savvy as well as people who share my beliefs will get in touch. I really do think there has been supressed technology/ideas/prototypes, great concepts that could/should have seen the light of day and I believe they are in Britain. Equally I believe there are new ideas that only need some backing and if anyone has knowledge - I'm listening!
Regards, Jim.
Last edited by algae on 18 Oct 2008, 18:16, edited 6 times in total.
Thanks Ted,Ted wrote:I've looked at algae source biofuel on and off a few times over the past 5 years or so. (I looked seriously into starting a WVO biodiesel company back in 2003)
I know of greenfuel and algaelink who interestingly have tie-in with KLM - the project - algaefuel for the aviation industry!. Well at least we know people are taking this seriously?
Lets hope when we get this started that BA and/or Virgin become investors.
WVO - well there's only so much of it, however if it stops it going to landfill, I'm all for it. You should have got involved in 2003 and you would have cleaned up Ted as commercial operations had to pay to get rid of it. Now collectors are paying to take the stuff. Although its still a cottage industry, there are masses of people doing it and its profitable at a local level, less HM Govs cut of course!!
Anyway I'll look through these links and thanks once again...
Hi Jim,
There was some discussion on this thread a while back:
http://www.powerswitch.org.uk/forum/vie ... ight=algae
Maybe some help to you ?
Good luck !
NB - The Search facility on this site is fantastic for finding old threads....
There was some discussion on this thread a while back:
http://www.powerswitch.org.uk/forum/vie ... ight=algae
Maybe some help to you ?
Good luck !
NB - The Search facility on this site is fantastic for finding old threads....
There was also a recent feature on Newsnight about algae.
All of a sudden......algae is everywhere:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/su ... every.html
Maybe some useful leads ?
All of a sudden......algae is everywhere:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/newsnight/su ... every.html
Maybe some useful leads ?
And the Carbon Trust has just launched a £26m project to develop transport fuels made from algae by 2020.
UK announces world's largest algal biofuel project:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... els-energy
Good to see HM Government putting some ££££ into this.
Makes a change from giving it to all those failed bankers !
UK announces world's largest algal biofuel project:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... els-energy
Good to see HM Government putting some ££££ into this.
Makes a change from giving it to all those failed bankers !
Thanks Mark...Mark wrote:Hi Jim,
There was some discussion on this thread a while back:
http://www.powerswitch.org.uk/forum/vie ... ight=algae
Maybe some help to you ?
Good luck !
NB - The Search facility on this site is fantastic for finding old threads....
Or will seaweed beat algae to the punch ?
Seaweed farms 'could fuel future':
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7690973.stm
Interesting times !
Seaweed farms 'could fuel future':
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7690973.stm
Interesting times !