Are we on the brink of an electric car revolution?

[BritDownUnder]

I once worked for the “Continuous Mortality Index Bureau” in the Uk whose yearly death statistics reports were eagerly awaited by Life Insurance Actuaries who should really get out more.

There were around 25,000 causes of deaths that they coded for but the Actuary in charge’s party quote was that there is only actually one cause of death for humans - Lack of Oxygen to the Human Brain.

[Mark]

Jaguar Land Rover-owner to pick UK over Spain for giant car battery plant:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-65698529

Maybe the UK is finally about to have a giga electric vehicle battery manufacturing plant ?
Of course...., it all depends on HMG transferring hundreds of millions of pounds to Tata...

Any idea why Bridgewater has been chosen ?
Seems an odd location and far from the major car production plants...
Would have thought that a location nearer to the Jaguar Land Rover plant on Merseyside would have made more sense...?

[kenneal - lagger]

Cornish sourced lithium?

[BritDownUnder]

Let's hope the EU allow all those payments to Tata to build the factory. Given Spain will benefit if they don't allow them gives me a good idea what will happen.

From memory the electric Jag SUV (iPace?) that they have had for sale for a while is built for them in Austria of all places.

[adam2]

New factory for EV batteries to be built in Somerset. Good news, less reliance on imported batteries and more incentive to build the EVs here if a major component is made locally.
And manufacturing jobs in the UK.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66237935

[Ralphw2]

Whilst the building of a battery factory is important, it is unfortunate that it is to supply batteries principally for the Jaguar and Landrover brands, luxury vehicles that are very large and expensive, and use disproportionate amounts of raw materials and energy for the function of taking their occupants on the daily commute or weekly trip to Waitrose. (Or mowing down children at the school gates whilst chatting on the phone)(probably unfair, I don’t know why the vehicle was driven into the children)

The government is refusing to say how big a bung they gave to Tata to build the factory here.

[BritDownUnder]

I think new technology always follows this path. The rich people were the first to get video recorders and CD players as well.

Same with Tesla bringing out the roadster and Model S first before the 3 and Y, made in China, at least for the Australian market.

I think the UK car manufacturing industry, or at least the part that is sustainable, is heading towards luxury brands so you might be stuck supplying Land Rover and Jaguar, maybe even Rolls Royce. Perhaps in the future the rich will have electric cars and the poor will be waiting in their ICEs in gas lines for their petrol ration.

Don't forget that the UK is a very elitist country - at least it is probably the only country where social elitism is so entrenched - economic elitism is a worldwide phenomenon. You don't realise until you have left.

[emordnilap]

The Irish government has mooted the possibility of taxing vehicles by weight. Is this sensible, do you think? Would a heavy vehicle with good aerodynamics beat a lighter one with poor design in terms of energy required?

[Ralphw2]

Taxing cars by weight would heavily penalise Evs as they are (currently) heavier than a similar sized ice vehicle. Yet their carbon footprint is far smaller, mile for mile. Their production has a somewhat higher carbon footprint, and how quickly they are overtaken in total emissions by the equivalent ice car depends on how the electricity is generated. I am currently getting the majority of my ev electricity directly from solar panels, so my emissions are very small.

That said, within each category, ice or ev, generally speaking the heavier the vehicle, the less efficient it is. Some Evs are especially efficient, two noticeable ones being the Tesla model 3 and the original Hyundai ionic . These get very good ranges with smaller batteries than is usual for their larger and heavier car bodies, but the smaller batteries also reduce their overall weight.

Weight is less of an issue in Evs also because of regenerative braking, recovering a large fraction of the energy used to overcome the inertia of their extra weight. All energy used by an ice car to accelerate is lost as heat during braking.

As a simple tax regime, weight would approximate quite well to environmental impact, provided there were separate rates to ice cars and Evs.

[Default0ptions]

This doesn’t look too good for EVs:

“ LONDON/DETROIT, March 20 (Reuters) - For many electric vehicles, there is no way to repair or assess even slightly damaged battery packs after accidents, forcing insurance companies to write off cars with few miles - leading to higher premiums and undercutting gains from going electric.

And now those battery packs are piling up in scrapyards in some countries, a previously unreported and expensive gap in what was supposed to be a "circular economy."

"We're buying electric cars for sustainability reasons," said Matthew Avery, research director at automotive risk intelligence company Thatcham Research. "But an EV isn't very sustainable if you've got to throw the battery away after a minor collision."

Battery packs can cost tens of thousands of dollars and represent up to 50% of an EV's price tag, often making it uneconomical to replace them.”

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos- ... 023-03-20/

[Ralphw2]

Strange, I saw a report a few days ago that a new ev battery recycling centre in Europe was struggling to find battery packs to recycle. All the packs from accident damaged cars were being snapped up for either upgrading smaller battery versions, or as home made house battery systems

[Default0ptions]

Strange, I saw a report a few days ago that a new ev battery recycling centre in Europe was struggling to find battery packs to recycle. All the packs from accident damaged cars were being snapped up for either upgrading smaller battery versions, or as home made house battery systems

Home made house battery systems made from damaged batteries doesn’t sound like a great idea. Adam 2 probably has something to say about that!

The battery recycling centre struggling to find batteries doesn’t change the problem of insurance companies having to write off EVs because of the risk of damage to batteries in minor accidents

[adam2]

Indeed ! I would strongly advise against re-use of potentially damaged EV batteries for home use. I do not entirely trust lithium batteries, and as for damaged ones, no way.
Unless in a distant and expendable shed.

[kenneal - lagger]

What is required is a standardised battery pack that can be swapped out easily and swapped between makes of cars as well. It's a similar situation to sustainable housing where generally a house is designed to look nice in the architects eye and then is sent to someone else to "make it sustainable." Cars, like houses, need to be designed from the first to be sustainable and we are not yet designing sustainable cars.

A sustainable car is not built from steel; is lightweight; is designed for a lower speed which will save weight as well as collision speeds are lower and weight can be saved from collision damage provision; lower speeds and lighter weight mean a smaller battery is required and weight is again reduced.

And why do so many cars require 4WD? 4WD cars should be subject to a additional tax, reclaimable by those few people who can show a need for one such as farmers and foresters.

[Potemkin Villager]

..... 4WD cars should be subject to a additional tax, reclaimable by those few people who can show a need for one such as farmers and foresters.

drug dealers, general gangsters, politicians and of course members of the royal family.