Mechanical ventilation & WW3

[Vortex2]

Being a pessimist, I have been thinking of what might happen if there is any sort of nuclear incident in Ukraine.

First of all, I tried to think of friends or family with a nice deep basement.
Nope, no luck there.

However I suddenly realised that homes with mechanical ventilation have a great advantage.
All the air in the house comes via a single inlet duct.
This duct (in our house at least) includes filters.
So most of any radioactive particles can be filtered out before entering the house.

The fans don't take much power, so a small PV setup should allow the air to flow during the day in the event of power cuts.
I'm sure that during times of darkness there would be enough air in the rooms to prevent breathing problems.

You would also need to hose down the roof and walls now & then to clean off radioactive particles - but that shouldn't be too much of a risk for someone weraing a disposble decorators's overall and FFP2 mask.

[adam2]

The idea has some merit, but beware at least two caveats.
Firstly air flow into a shelter should be limited to the minimum needed for health, your system almost certainly admits a lot more air than required. More air flow means more fallout particles, since no filter is perfect.
Still better than opening the windows though. A good quality respirator offers a second line of defence.

Secondly a lightly built and entirely above ground home is very vulnerable to gamma radiation. The best defence is to be below ground. The next best is to be above ground but behind walls of concrete or masonry at least one metre thick, two or three metres would be better.
Windows offer almost no protection and are also very vulnerable to blast and to heat flash.

As a minimum I would keep white emulsion paint or whitewash to paint the windows and reduce the risk of heat flash starting fires within.
And enough timber to board up the windows.
Sandbags or concrete blocks are a more effective barrier.

[kenneal - lagger]

I've been idly wondering how good cob would be recently!!

[adam2]

Very good against radiation. very good against heat flash, Not so good against blast, unless reinforced with steel rebar which is rare.
Windows are the weak point.

[kenneal - lagger]

We didn't worry much about a nuclear strike when we first moved here because we are right next to the cruise missile bunkers at Greenham Common. In the event of a nuclear strike we would have been gone before we knew it was coming! Well we might have had an inkling that something was up because the missiles would have moved out of the base for firing but that could, of course, have been for an exercise.

Now the missiles have moved out we don't know whether the Russians have bothered to remove Greenham from their target list or whether it is still one of Putin's six targets required to wipe the UK from the face of the earth. We do have a cellar with a ventilation pipe that runs about 10 metres underground before entering the house but I'm not sure that surviving would be a good thing!! I'm sure that the flexibility of the cob would cushion the blast and help protect the cellar as long as we didn't have an airburst anywhere near overhead as that would just blow the roof straight in on us.

It's not really something that I give much thought to except when answering questions here of course.

[Vortex2]

We are a couple of miles from one of the UK's key bunkers and not that far from the main military satellite ground station.
A key arms dump is about 20 miles aay.
Ho, humm ....

[kenneal - lagger]

I don't really think that it matters where you live in the UK as, as Putin has reminded us, it only takes six nukes to devastate the whole of the UK. That is assuming they work of course which seems highly unlikely after the mess of the Ukraine invasion which has been held back by the corruption and incompetence of the Russian military. Even their elite Special Forces have been wiped out including Chechen ones.

[PS_RalphW]

I saw a report that most of the Chechen forces are being kept well behind the front lines. They are there as the Chechen leader (a Putin puppet) wants to keep on Putin's good side, but they are under direct Chechen command and do not always follow Russian orders. Also, they are needed back home more or less in one piece, because they are all that their leader has between him and open rebellion at home. They do have a reputation for ruthlessness, and Russia seems to think they are good for morale (reduction on the Ukrainian side).

[BritDownUnder]

I have read that there are also anti-Russian Chechens fighting on the Ukrainian side.

Regarding the air filtration you should be aware that EMP may damage electrical components of any filter. Perhaps a hand operated one would be better. Some kind of HEPA filter with a lot of spares might be a good idea.

It may be 6 nukes that could devastate the UK but it could be 5 or 7. What the UK needs to do now is make sure its nukes are spread out and with a variety of delivery systems even torpedos and drones and on various RN ships so in the event that the ballistic missile subs are compromised there are still options.
Also spread them around the world in UK offshore territories such as Ascension, the Falklands, Gibraltar, even Pitcairn Island. Maybe they should take a leak out the Russians book and develop ones which can be launched from shipping containers. After all imitation is the most sincere form of flattery and a nuclear attack should invariable invite a nuclear response.

[Tarrel]

This seems to be the "go to" DIY solution for fallout shelter ventilation. Info about filtration at the bottom of the article.

https://www.webpal.org/SAFE/aaasurvival ... ap/kap.htm

[kenneal - lagger]

This seems to be the "go to" DIY solution for fallout shelter ventilation. Info about filtration at the bottom of the article.

https://www.webpal.org/SAFE/aaasurvival ... ap/kap.htm

The required air flow should be specified in air changes per hour or similar so the it fits the variation in shelter size. Putting 5000cfm through a small shelter might cause a strong wind while putting the same through a very large shelter might barely ruffle a feather. I would have thought that about 1 air change per hour would be a good requirement or 1/2 AC/hr at the very least.

Putting a large flow or air that is anywhere near blood heat through an underground shelter for any length of time is going to kill a lot of people as much as putting an inadequate air flow through will as it will gradually build up the temperature to unendurable levels. If the air is pulled through a long pipe, or multiple pipes depending on the volumes required, that is at 1.5 metres below ground level or more the ground will temper the temperature of the air reducing it in hot weather and increasing it in cold weather.

Regarding the Kearney air pump I would make one with panels each side of and below the swinging panel so that more air is moved a longer distance. A lever and rod might have to be used to facilitate the movement rather than a sting and gravity. If some form of seal can be fashioned it will work even better. Another type of pump to make would be the bellows one that was shown in the film "The Great Escape" to ventilate their tunnels. The longer the air path the greater the need for a better air moving capability. Also if a filter is incorporated in the line to reduce/remove any radio active particles there is more of a need to develop greater pressure in the system.