Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

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kenneal - lagger
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by kenneal - lagger »

clv101 wrote: 01 Aug 2021, 23:55 I've always thought one of the advantages of being 'collapse aware' for 20+ years is the mental side of things. As things go south a lot of folk simply aren't going to cope with their world view collapsing around them.
Once you get over the shock of the realisation that the future won't be better than the past the actual panning out of the problems as they come along isn't such a problem. Having come to that realisation nearly fifty years ago now it is hard to see other people struggling with the speed of the changes, and that speed of change is increasing by the year. Having come to the realisation so many years ago the speed of change then was quite slow and did revolve around resource depletion and then Peak Oil then, for me, The Limits To Growth in 2000, and finally adding Climate Change to the mix as part of Limits to Growth.

Also having seen a path forward, house insulation and self sufficiency among other things, and been able to act on those things gives one a sense of acting for the best and achievement. Helping people achieve some of their goals is also a great help.

Watching others just carry on as usual, and having a few rejecting your advise, doesn't make life any better though and does engender some feelings of anger towards the dull sods!!
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by Catweazle »

Even the normally upbeat Moneyweek spam email is talking about books on collapse.

https://moneyweek.com/books/603655/disa ... ay-reading?

Not their normal fodder.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by clv101 »

"This article was first published in the Financial Times"

Disappointingly I've only read one of them! Bunker.

On a similar vein, can recommend this book, well written by an Irish guy with a sense of humor:
'Notes from an Apocalypse' by Mark O’Connell
He travels the world, talking to doomers, trying to figure out who they are, why they think the way they do and considers their responses. He's a recovering doomer. Includes quite a bit on billionaires and NZ.

'Bunker: Building for the End Times' by Bradley Garrett, covers similar material but spends more time with some crazy Americans, not as sharply written.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by Potemkin Villager »

clv101 wrote: 03 Aug 2021, 15:57
On a similar vein, can recommend this book, well written by an Irish guy with a sense of humor:
'Notes from an Apocalypse' by Mark O’Connell
He travels the world, talking to doomers, trying to figure out who they are, why they think the way they do and considers their responses. He's a recovering doomer. Includes quite a bit on billionaires and NZ.
He sounds like a gas man possibly inspired by Hunter Thompson! Must read.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/ ... ell-review

" This project began for him toward the end of 2016, that disabling year, when his therapist suggested to him that “it might be helpful not to spend quite so much time following the news”. His response to that suggestion was a kind of personal aversion therapy: he would not shut himself off from the portents of end times that buzz-alerted his phone, but follow them to the ends of the Earth."
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by Catweazle »

clv101 wrote: 03 Aug 2021, 15:57 "This article was first published in the Financial Times"
I don't read it any more, not since I ceased working for them and couldn't get it free.
( Not as a journalist I hasten to add ).
If you're looking for a paper to put down in the guinea pig hutch I wholeheartedly recommend it, very absorbent.


Perhaps I'm getting too doomerish, it's probably going to work out OK for my generation, but I have kids and grandkids. Can it possibly be "OK" for them too ? Is the orchard I'm planting and the soil I'm building worth the effort ?

I'm thinking of drilling a borehole, even though I'm on mains water, as a backup against mains failure or summers dry enough for my garden to need more water than I can afford to buy. Is that doomerish ? A bit too "prepper" ? Or just a reaction to a heatwave and lots of news about climate change.

Honestly, I don't know any more. It seems that my plans were clearer when the future seemed less clear, now I read more and more predictions of collapse I feel less certain what to do about it. Perhaps the advice to see less news might be good for me.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by Stumuz2 »

Catweazle wrote: 03 Aug 2021, 20:50 Perhaps the advice to see less news might be good for me.
Absolutely!

Do not watch the news, it's getting more dumbed down by the day, I listen to the world service news. Quick peruse around the worlds newspapers over breakfast, telegraph, guardian, new york times, Irish times, la monde.

And definitely no social media. It's a time thief and alters the way you think.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by emordnilap »

A separate borehole thread would be good. Admins?
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by adam2 »

emordnilap wrote: 07 Aug 2021, 14:27 A separate borehole thread would be good. Admins?
Agreed, I have moved the posts about wells and boreholes into a new thread in the preparations forum.

Located here viewtopic.php?f=10&t=27861 Please continue the discussion in that thread
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by clv101 »

adam2 wrote: 29 Jul 2021, 17:34 For many years on these forums and elsewhere, around December, I USED to forecast that the next year would be "very similar to the last year, but a bit worse" Such predictions were generally correct.
The astute member may have observed that I made no such predictions recently.
I've been thinking about how bad things could get in the UK, in the context of how bad things have been in the past. For example, as bad as the pandemic has been, the power and water stayed on, even the Internet. The basic services, fuel, local authority etc held up, the shops did have enough food etc.

Things have been worse - the three day week in '74, rolling blackouts or the winter of discontent '78-'79. Inflation in the '70s and early '90s. The winter of '62-'63 or '46-'47, the drought in '76.

If impacts as significant as those happened next year the r/collapse crowd would the haling the end times. But actually we've seen it all before, maybe what's unusual is the incredible stability we've had over the last 30 years. Shifting baselines. Also note the 'boomer' generation who lived through all this at the prime of their lives generally came out pretty well.

I guess what I'm suggesting, is that we shouldn't be too alarmed if something seemingly extreme happens, remember history.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by adam2 »

There have been two major changes in recent years in my view.
Firstly society in general and many individuals have become far more reliant on electricity. In the 1970s power cuts most schools and most shops remained open as did many workplaces. These days almost everything would stop. Witness for example the chaos resulting from a fairly short power failure in August 2019.

Secondly there has been an increase in lawlessness in recent years, and often an apparent lack of effective police action to deal with disorder. The London riots of some years ago shocked me.
Shops and pubs looted in broad daylight and within sight of Peckham Rye police station. Not a police officer in sight.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by BritDownUnder »

I agree completely with both of Adam's comments. You could argue that we have become more reliant on electronic systems replacing human/mechanical systems. As an example. In a shop, a cash register in the 1970s may have been entirely mechanical and of course taken cash. Contrast nowadays with a contactless internet linked payment system.
Another example may be getting money from a bank. In earlier days there would have been a 'passbook' that the teller would have amended (I suspect this would have been backed with an electronic system somewhere) then got the money out of the cash drawer, and now getting cash from an electronic ATM.

Apparently it is the 10th anniversary of the England riots this month. I was on holiday in the US at the time and it was widely reported on the TV news over there with the commentators' incredulity implied that in the US the rioters would have been shot dead in short order.
My brother is in the police and was (maybe still is) allowed to travel for free on the Nottingham Tram system on production of his ID card but elects to pay and travel anonymously as the hassle of being called in to throw off fare dodgers became too much. Seems to me in the UK police service is overstretched and probably a bit outnumbered as well. In the US I would think it is a brave, even suicidal person that assaults a police officer. In the UK it is commonplace.

Assaults on UK police officers.
Assaults on police officers are sadly commonplace. Our latest welfare survey data suggests there were more than two million unarmed physical assaults on officers over 12 months, and a further 302,842 assaults using a deadly weapon during the same period. These figures estimate that an assault on a police officer happens every four minutes.
Assaults on US police officers. I am only permitted to put two links per post but it was from the FBI website.
In 2019, the FBI collected assault data from 9,457 law enforcement agencies that employed 475,848 officers. These officers provided service to more than 219.8 million people, or 67.0 percent of the nation’s population. (See Table 80.)
Law enforcement agencies reported that 56,034 officers were assaulted while performing their duties in 2019. (See Table 80.)
However, at this site...
During the 20th century, 585 police officers in New York and 160 police officers in London died while participating in law enforcement activities. New York had markedly greater intentional police mortality rates compared to London throughout most of the 20th century, but these differences decreased significantly by the end of the century. Intentional gunshot wounds comprised 290 police deaths in New York, but only 14 police deaths in London.
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by emordnilap »

adam2 wrote: 09 Aug 2021, 22:56 There have been two major changes in recent years in my view.
Firstly society in general and many individuals have become far more reliant on electricity. In the 1970s power cuts most schools and most shops remained open as did many workplaces. These days almost everything would stop. Witness for example the chaos resulting from a fairly short power failure in August 2019.
True. Very few shops can continue running without electricity. Plus more and more places don't accept cash.

In another group, one user said they have an average of 30 items using electricity 24-7-366! Possibly some are a kind of life support.

I have 2 items running 24/7, a fridge and a freezer. The freezer is so well insulated it will keep goods frozen for two weeks in a power cut.
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
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Re: Time article about the meteoric rise of /r/collapse

Post by UndercoverElephant »

emordnilap wrote: 11 Aug 2021, 12:23 Plus more and more places don't accept cash.
My local fish and chip shop only accepts cash. The exception of course, but they do exist.
We must deal with reality or it will deal with us.
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