New coronavirus in/from China

[boisdevie]

Meanwhile the Bank of England predicts a 25% drop in GDP for the 2nd quarter. That makes the Great Depression look like a lovely old time by comparison. Does everyone still think the lockdown was such a great idea when most healthy people aren't dying or needing the NHS?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... y-covid-19

I'll put my hand up and admit I got caught up with the emotional doom-graphs. Despite being initially skeptical, fear got to me.

Don't give yourself a hard time. They got me as well for a week or two.

Me too. I panicked then it slowly dawned on me that the real risk to me was very very low.

[Little John]

Truth be told, the risk to me and my missus is quite high, due both to our jobs and the fact we have both had health problems in the last few years.

But, systemically, the facts are the facts.

People just need to stop being so bloody emotionally and morally incontinent and start acting and thinking like adults.

Meanwhile, we have a government who initially mindlessly locked down the entire country, including the 80% for whom this virus is not lethal, in turn completely f***ing the economy - as if it was not already in enough bad shape.

Now, they are telling folks to go back to work - or not - with no exemptions for the 20% who still need protecting

Meanwhile, all of the draconian limits of freedom of movement and freedom of assembly are still ongoing

Well, they can go and F--k themselves is what they can do

[adam2]

I agree that the risk to most individuals is low, unless already sick or otherwise particularly vulnerable.

I remain very concerned at the potentially serious effects on food and fuel supply.

BTW, I suspect that I MIGHT have had the virus and recovered. About 2 weeks ago I felt very ill for 24 hours and somewhat unwell for a few days afterwards.
Severe joint pain, almost unable to move.
Felt cold in warm conditions.
Slightly elevated temperature.

At the time I discounted coronavirus as no coughing or difficulty in breathing.
With hindsight though, I now wonder if I had it ?

[fuzzy]

I agree that the risk to most individuals is low, unless already sick or otherwise particularly vulnerable.

I remain very concerned at the potentially serious effects on food and fuel supply.

BTW, I suspect that I MIGHT have had the virus and recovered. About 2 weeks ago I felt very ill for 24 hours and somewhat unwell for a few days afterwards.
Severe joint pain, almost unable to move.
Felt cold in warm conditions.
Slightly elevated temperature.

At the time I discounted coronavirus as no coughing or difficulty in breathing.
With hindsight though, I now wonder if I had it ?

Yes Adam, those same symptoms back in March. I worked a couple of nights with a lad from Birmingham. He reckoned he had had it for a month. I think UE described it as well a few weeks ago. The insanity is the gov is/was not recording any of these details. And according to the NHS gurus I shouldn't catch it!

[kenneal - lagger]

Meanwhile the Bank of England predicts a 25% drop in GDP for the 2nd quarter. That makes the Great Depression look like a lovely old time by comparison. Does everyone still think the lockdown was such a great idea when most healthy people aren't dying or needing the NHS?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... y-covid-19

That's good. We have sustainable growth at last or are you one of those strange people who believe we can have infinite economic growth for ever!! The problem is not with negative growth but with a system which can't live with it. We need to change the system not the direction of growth as the previous growth was destroying the ecosystems upon which our life depends.

[Little John]

Meanwhile the Bank of England predicts a 25% drop in GDP for the 2nd quarter. That makes the Great Depression look like a lovely old time by comparison. Does everyone still think the lockdown was such a great idea when most healthy people aren't dying or needing the NHS?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... y-covid-19

That's good. We have sustainable growth at last or are you one of those strange people who believe we can have infinite economic growth for ever!! The problem is not with negative growth but with a system which can't live with it. We need to change the system not the direction of growth as the previous growth was destroying the ecosystems upon which our life depends.

Ah, I see.

So, this virus is, for someone like you, just a useful tool to usher in a world you wish to see. As for the actual dangers of this virus, real or otherwise - that is irrelevant since it serves the purpose of enacting the change you wish to see... right?

[kenneal - lagger]

Meanwhile there are people who have had it, ostensibly recovered and continue to have huge problems weeks later. This was posted on Facebook by Candy who has had the virus and later these same symptoms for several weeks. The professor is a fit man "from years of running and military fitness" not someone with comorbidities.

[Little John]

Meanwhile there are people who have had it, ostensibly recovered and continue to have huge problems weeks later. This was posted on Facebook by Candy who has had the virus and later these same symptoms for several weeks. The professor is a fit man "from years of running and military fitness" not someone with comorbidities.

So, do you have the actual statistics on long term commodities following this virus? I do not mean anecdotes

[Snail]

Meanwhile there are people who have had it, ostensibly recovered and continue to have huge problems weeks later. This was posted on Facebook by Candy who has had the virus and later these same symptoms for several weeks. The professor is a fit man "from years of running and military fitness" not someone with comorbidities.

I dont want to sound combative but that person was never tested for corona. I also see Lyme disease and me/cfs mentioned in the comments. Every time I go camping I get at least a couple of ticks, but still go camping. I used to think i had cfs... My dad was in hospital a couple of years ago. The symptoms matched corona but the doctors didn't have a clue what was wrong and even had him tested for HIV. He was told he must have caught an unknown something.

Just saying, you're going to find people posting things like this and assuming they caught coronavirus. The internet will gather these together and make it appear like something else.

[kenneal - lagger]

................That's good. We have sustainable growth at last or are you one of those strange people who believe we can have infinite economic growth for ever!! The problem is not with negative growth but with a system which can't live with it. We need to change the system not the direction of growth as the previous growth was destroying the ecosystems upon which our life depends.

Ah, I see.

So, this virus is, for someone like you, just a useful tool to usher in a world you wish to see. As for the actual dangers of this virus, real or otherwise - that is irrelevant since it serves the purpose of enacting the change you wish to see... right?

Not at all, see the post after my one quoted. I am extremely concerned by the disease and its health effects and unlike you I wish to see continued action to slow down the spread.

I think we should learn from experience and history and the experience of this pandemic shows us that exponential growth is not sustainable in this disease and that natural exponential growth either leads to a plateau in the growth rate, an S-shaped curve, or to a U-shaped curve where the growth rises quickly, briefly plateaus and then plummets. One of those two patterns will eventually be seen with this disease.

One of those two patterns will occur with economic growth whether we like it or not although there will be some bumps in the curve going up and coming down as mankind does its best to prove the logic wrong. We could, however, if we learned some lessons from history where all previous civilisations have exhausted their resource base and collapsed, accept that we can't keep growing for ever and trying for more, more more, for ever and just accept what we have, or even a little less, share out what we have more equally and enjoy our lives within the constraints of nature.

The sooner we do the latter the less of a loss we will experience and now is a good time to look at what is really important as we face this enforced pause in the way that we have lived and worked. The shut down in mass travel and tourism has called into question its necessity; we can all Skype/Zoom business meetings or watch travel programs on the box while enjoying a staycation; many people have taken up the opportunity to grow some of their own food; a lot more people are going for walks and bike rides; many more people are cooking at home instead of buying takeaways an preprepared food.

A lot of jobs will be lost as a result but that means we can either share the remaining jobs and carry on enjoying the off time or that there will be a lot more people to take up the new jobs which we have had to fill with continuing immigration in the past.

Nature was telling us that we couldn't go on as we were so we should now take note and change the way that we do things in the future before nature hands us an even greater lesson than this virus. To think that this is some right wing conspiracy to do down the working classes is an affront to people's intellect when the obvious lesson should be that the human race, by its numbers and behaviour and greed is on a road which leads off the edge of a cliff and we need to take a turn off going in another direction very quickly.

[kenneal - lagger]

So, do you have the actual statistics on long term commodities following this virus? I do not mean anecdotes

No and neither do you to support your suppositions. Leastways, at this stage of the outbreak there is nothing to support either "supposition".

[kenneal - lagger]

..............I dont want to sound combative but that person was never tested for corona. I also see Lyme disease and me/cfs mentioned in the comments. Every time I go camping I get at least a couple of ticks, but still go camping. I used to think i had cfs... My dad was in hospital a couple of years ago. The symptoms matched corona but the doctors didn't have a clue what was wrong and even had him tested for HIV. He was told he must have caught an unknown something.

Just saying, you're going to find people posting things like this and assuming they caught coronavirus. The internet will gather these together and make it appear like something else.

But you and your Dad aren't a professor of infectious diseases at Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine. Unfortunately people like him weren't being tested at the time and there is still no accurate test for having had the disease.

[Little John]

So, do you have the actual statistics on long term commodities following this virus? I do not mean anecdotes

No and neither do you to support your suppositions. Leastways, at this stage of the outbreak there is nothing to support either "supposition".

That's bollocks. I am not the one making the unsubstantiated assertion. You are. I am simply making an entirely reasonable assumption that this virus is likely to be like most/all other respiratory viruses in the history of breathing animals on this planet.

[kenneal - lagger]

So, do you have the actual statistics on long term commodities following this virus? I do not mean anecdotes

No and neither do you to support your suppositions. Leastways, at this stage of the outbreak there is nothing to support either "supposition".

That's bollocks. I am not the one making the unsubstantiated assertion. You are. I am simply making an entirely reasonable assumption that this virus is likely to be like most/all other respiratory viruses in the history of breathing animals on this planet.

You are making a supposition founded on an assumption that this disease will mutate in a certain way. You have as much proof as I do. You are saying and hoping that your assumption is entirely reasonable and I am saying that it may not be.

[kenneal - lagger]

And you, LJ, would seem to be supporting a return to the ways of old where the working classes are exploited by the Corporatist banking and economic system. "Get them back to work" you seem to be saying with no thought to the consequences or desirability of that work.