New coronavirus in/from China

[vtsnowedin]

Yep. Not a chance. If they try and impose this past May, there will be serious trouble.

Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

There are almost 2 million legal firearms in the UK, in a population of 67 million.

https://www.ecnmy.org/engage/the-uk-has ... ght-think/

I expect, without looking it up, that here are another two to five million illegal guns in the hands of gang members and criminals that are the ones the government has nightmares about.

[Little John]

As far as I can see we still have no proof that herd immunity can be achieved. If I've missed something could someone post a link please ?

You have no proof that it cannot be achieved but plenty of evidence that herd immunity, partial to whole, is the usual outcome of a pandemic.

It hasn't happened with AIDS. In fact we're still waiting for a vaccine.

There is a reason HIV is really quite difficult to catch and the common cold is really quite easy to catch.

[Vortex2]

Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

There are almost 2 million legal firearms in the UK, in a population of 67 million.

https://www.ecnmy.org/engage/the-uk-has ... ght-think/

I expect, without looking it up, that here are another two to five million illegal guns in the hands of gang members and criminals that are the ones the government has nightmares about.

True.

A couple of anecdotes:

1. Some years ago we had a US businessman visit my firm in Birmingham, UK. He said that the hotel was great but the machine gun fire kept him awake. wtf?

2. My daughter was living in central London. She was woken up by a major machine gun battle outside her building one night. wtf?

Neither case was mentioned in the media.

[ReserveGrowthRulz]

Yep. Not a chance. If they try and impose this past May, there will be serious trouble.

Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

There are almost 2 million legal firearms in the UK, in a population of 67 million.

Yes, I understand that your civilian populace is shockingly under-equipped. But as has been pointed out, sarcastically by myself, guns have nothing to do with a people's conditioning or ability to cause "serious trouble".

What might that be to a Brit? A quiet complaint to a friend over morning tea and crumpets? A furrowed glance at members of authority? Perhaps <gasp!> a pointed finger and scowl!

[Snail]

Riotous mayhem

[Vortex2]

Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

There are almost 2 million legal firearms in the UK, in a population of 67 million.

Yes, I understand that your civilian populace is shockingly under-equipped. But as has been pointed out, sarcastically by myself, guns have nothing to do with a people's conditioning or ability to cause "serious trouble".

What might that be to a Brit? A quiet complaint to a friend over morning tea and crumpets? A furrowed glance at members of authority? Perhaps <gasp!> a pointed finger and scowl!

You clearly don't understand the British mentality.

We will accept abuse, mocking, even unwarranted rudeness for quite a time ... but then we snap. At that point our adversaries are in deep trouble.

The world map used to be red for a reason .. the Brits owned it. You don't achieve that by being cuddly.

[vtsnowedin]

We've had many wars with the French, some we won, some we lost, we're over it.

For now perhaps but let them double the price of wine and champagne and war will be declared. Having the British isles depend on California for wine is just a state of affairs that could not stand.

[kenneal - lagger]

We regularly produce prize winning white and sparkling wines so a loss of champagne would only be noticed at the cheaper end of the market. If cheaper foreign wine wasn't available I would go back to making it myself. We have plenty of elderberries, blackberries and blackcurrants on our land to produce enough wine to keep our family in perpetuity.

Then,of course, there is beer. We have three or four local breweries so I don't expect any shortage of beer soon.

Who needs Californian wine when we can buy quality wines from Italy, Spain, South Africa, Australia New Zealand, Argentina and Chile at very good prices or make it ourselves. I forgot Port! I enjoy the occasional glass but we used to make a pretty good substitute from elderberries. Top the wine up with a bit of absolute alcohol or, as our source of that has dried up, a drop of cheap vodka and you get a very nice drink. We never made enough to keep to age though unfortunately.

[clv101]

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/ ... -one-year/

The seasonal flu kills 0.1 percent of people infected, but the new coronavirus has already killed 0.1 percent of the entire population of the state of New York.

...

The Wall Street Journal reported that confirmed coronavirus cases in the Italian province of Bergamo (population 1.1 million) had killed 0.2 percent of the entire population in one month. The true percentage may be higher: There were 4,000 more deaths in Bergamo in March 2020 than the average number of deaths in March in recent years, but only 2,000 of those deaths were attributed to confirmed COVID-19 cases.

[fuzzy]

Odd video. I am not sure they really are the same 2 people. Hair looks more african, not just skin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdFk65psFjk

[vtsnowedin]

I have come to the conclusion that not only must we restart the economy as much as possible as soon as we can but keep it open reguardless of any resurgence of the disease or second wave. We have already spent more economic capital fighting this then we can afford and the only course now is straight through hell to the other side.

[Vortex2]

I have come to the conclusion that not only must we restart the economy as much as possible as soon as we can but keep it open reguardless of any resurgence of the disease or second wave. We have already spent more economic capital fighting this then we can afford and the only course now is straight through hell to the other side.

I suspect that messy human personalities will modulate what will finally happen.

We will end up with an untidy slow-motion half-way house between full openness and lock-downs.

The young will return to Real Life one way or the other fairly promptly. Some - but not many - will die or be damaged by the virus.

Many others - mostly dumbos rather than thinkers - will simply abandon any lock down and gather in groups etc. Many will be culled.

Sadly many decent people will have no choice - they will need to stay at work - or restart soon - in order to pay the bills. Hopefully they will be given PPE.

Others will continue to hide away - possibly because they have found they like their new way of life.

Other will ignore the lockdown but will attempt to protect themselves as much as possible when out and about.

After several months of this messy half-way house, life will be back to a semi normal state ... but in a landscape littered with closed/bankrupt firms and individuals.

(During all this companies and organisations will have be fitting transparent screens, installing gel dispensers, modifying air conditioning, fitting self-opening doors, undoing open plan offices etc)

Of course, within a year or so, we will all know people who have died ... or may be one of them.

Happy times!

[vtsnowedin]

Of course, within a year or so, we will all know people who have died ... or may be one of them.

That was always true and always will be. Probably a few extra this year but in the end we all die once.

[kenneal - lagger]

I have come to the conclusion that not only must we restart the economy as much as possible as soon as we can but keep it open reguardless of any resurgence of the disease or second wave. We have already spent more economic capital fighting this then we can afford and the only course now is straight through hell to the other side.

You'll probably have to rebuild your health system then as you are likely to lose many of the staff. There is a theory that a high initial viral load increases the likelihood of serious symptoms and death. With more people travelling together on crowded trains and in bars and restaurants you will get more people receiving high viral loads so more people hospitalised and dying.

Your ultra capitalist system where minimal help is given to the people while businesses receive socialist levels of help means that there is greater pressure from people to get back to work and ignore the increased death rate. We are likely to get a resurgence in areas where people ignore the advice and hopefully that will encourage the rest of us to go with the advice. There is less pressure on people in Europe to get back to work than in the US so our death rate is likely to be lower.

If the ECB is allowed by Germany and the Netherlands, they have so far voted against such help, to help out the southern states economically Europe should get by. We have the advantage of being able to print our own cash and as virtually the whole world is going to be in the same boat the economic damage shouldn't be too bad.

In reality, this is such a new situation that anyone's guess as to what will happen is as good as anyone else's so I don't want to lose any friends over pure speculation.

[vtsnowedin]

Yes all those costs will have be paid.People will be able to use their own judgment about what to do to reduce their personal risk level. If Europe is slow to get back to work there will be increased economic damage for them making them noncompetitive if the future.

In reality, this is such a new situation that anyone's guess as to what will happen is as good as anyone else's so I don't want to lose any friends over pure speculation.

The virus cares not what people speculate or what you want.
This is going to be a very bitter pill but swallow it we must.