New coronavirus in/from China

[Little John]

With all this talk of "taking it on the chin" and "letting rip" I find it comforting that given the circumstances of possible mass deaths from a global pandemic most world leaders, including our our Conservative leadership, have erred on the side of humanity over economics; lives over greed.

When the economy is totally thrashed, where do you think we'll find all the money for hospitals and social care? And how about all those self employed people who's lives are now being destroyed as the businesses they've worked hard to build are utterly smashed by government dictat?

Agreed

[vtsnowedin]

HMG data as at 14th April

As of 9am on 14 April, 382,650 tests have concluded, with 14,982 tests carried out on 13 April.

302,599 people have been tested, of whom 93,873 tested positive.

As of 5pm on 13 April, of those hospitalised in the UK who tested positive for coronavirus, 12,107 have died.

Thankfully that 31% positive rate is undoubtedly due to concentrating scarce tests where there is a high probability of a positive result. Those choosing who to test appear to be using good judgement based on other indicators.

[boisdevie]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -warns-obr

I think they are being way too optimistic and the idea that the economy will bounce back is ludicrous and an insult to those losing their jobs and livelihoods.

[Mark]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -warns-obr

I think they are being way too optimistic and the idea that the economy will bounce back is ludicrous and an insult to those losing their jobs and livelihoods.

What (I think) we can all agree on, is that the economy won't look the same after this.
Anybody wanting/expecting things to return exactly as before, is likely to be disappointed.

Maybe I'm dreaming, but I see this as an opportunity to 'reset' certain things.
Transition to a low-carbon economy, more UK manufacturing, more local agriculture, stricter controls on financial services, better ways to dispose of our own waste etc. etc.

For some people, this would present an opportunity.
For others, it might signal hard times, but maybe also a chance to reassess ?
It very much depends on what people do for a living, and what skill sets they have ?
Many people will need to consider a career change ?

[kenneal - lagger]

With all this talk of "taking it on the chin" and "letting rip" I find it comforting that given the circumstances of possible mass deaths from a global pandemic most world leaders, including our our Conservative leadership, have erred on the side of humanity over economics; lives over greed.

When the economy is totally thrashed, where do you think we'll find all the money for hospitals and social care? And how about all those self employed people who's lives are now being destroyed as the businesses they've worked hard to build are utterly smashed by government dictat?

It's been said here many times before that our money is a construct of the imagination so just as has been done in bailing out businesses we can print the money to rebuild businesses and pay for the NHS. The political will is there according to the Chancellor in the briefing today.

[boisdevie]

It's been said here many times before that our money is a construct of the imagination so just as has been done in bailing out businesses we can print the money to rebuild businesses and pay for the NHS.

Do you really imagine that we can just print money without any adverse consequences?

[vtsnowedin]

It's been said here many times before that our money is a construct of the imagination so just as has been done in bailing out businesses we can print the money to rebuild businesses and pay for the NHS. .

That may have been said many times but it has never and will never be true. Without real useful economic activity like producing food , goods and services which can be obtained with the money it would have no value. Without something of value you can buy with it it is just very poor TP.

[kenneal - lagger]

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -warns-obr

I think they are being way too optimistic and the idea that the economy will bounce back is ludicrous and an insult to those losing their jobs and livelihoods.

What (I think) we can all agree on, is that the economy won't look the same after this.
Anybody wanting/expecting things to return exactly as before, is likely to be disappointed.

Maybe I'm dreaming, but I see this as an opportunity to 'reset' certain things.
Transition to a low-carbon economy, more UK manufacturing, more local agriculture, stricter controls on financial services, better ways to dispose of our own waste etc. etc.

For some people, this would present an opportunity.
For others, it might signal hard times, but maybe also a chance to reassess ?
It very much depends on what people do for a living, and what skill sets they have ?


Many people will need to consider a career change ?

Agreed.

The safety net is getting more comprehensive by the week and politicians want to keep as many businesses going as possible. The Chancellor reiterated that today. It is far too early to be making predictions on what might happen when this is over:we don't even have any idea how long this will take.

Also we needed to make huge changes in the way that we do things to address climate change and this crisis will make those changes easier. The shutdown of airlines, for instance, is a massive opportunity for a change of direction. Will the Heathrow expansion go ahead now? Highly unlikely for a few years, hopefully.

At least our leaders aren't losing it like Trump seemed to be as seen on the news just now. His psychopathy seems to be overtaking him.

[kenneal - lagger]

It's been said here many times before that our money is a construct of the imagination so just as has been done in bailing out businesses we can print the money to rebuild businesses and pay for the NHS. .

That may have been said many times but it has never and will never be true. Without real useful economic activity like producing food , goods and services which can be obtained with the money it would have no value. Without something of value you can buy with it it is just very poor TP.

You could say that the essential activity is still going on. We have food, water and shelter, or at least we do at the moment in the UK, and we are seeing just what is surplus to those basic requirements. We can decide just what is necessary for our future and dump the rest.

[Vortex2]

Office for National Statistics said death rate for week to 3 April is 6,000 more than five-year average

So is the true virus death rate around 6000+ a week???

[kenneal - lagger]

It's been said here many times before that our money is a construct of the imagination so just as has been done in bailing out businesses we can print the money to rebuild businesses and pay for the NHS.

Do you really imagine that we can just print money without any adverse consequences?

No.

It's all a matter of degree and what it is used for.

[PS_RalphW]

Office for National Statistics said death rate for week to 3 April is 6,000 more than five-year average

So is the true virus death rate around 6000+ a week???

More or less, yes. The figures are already 10 days old. Current official figures are about 800 a day but are underestimated up to 30%. or even more. this current week the real toll will be significantly more than 6000. Possibly some of the additional deaths are non-covid patients who had life saving treatment deferred or cancelled because of the emergency

[PS_RalphW]

our acquaintance with covid who went to a and e is back home and recovering.

[Vortex2]

Apparently our max deaths count will be 4700 ...

An international comparison of the second derivative of COVID-19
deaths after implementation of social distancing measures

W. T. Pike1 and V. Saini2
Department of Electrical and Electronic Engineering, Imperial College London, Exhibition
Road, London SW7 2AZ, UK

Lown Institute, Brookline, Mass 02138, USA

Correspondence: w.t.pike@imperial.ac.uk

Submitted: 20/3/2020
Revised: 24/3/20

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... l.pdf+html

[vtsnowedin]

Office for National Statistics said death rate for week to 3 April is 6,000 more than five-year average

So is the true virus death rate around 6000+ a week???

Not seeing the source document I have to guess that is cumulative extra deaths January first thru April 3rd. Your current deaths attributed to Covid19 is 12,129 which comes to 3000 a week not sorting out those already at deaths door.
So I read that as about 50 percent of Covid-19 deaths as they are recorded now are extra above the normal level.
What say you?