Moderator: Peak Moderation
Were you ?stumuz1 wrote:And I was right!Mark wrote:
I remember you posting a countdown clock to the March 'deadline', quoting primary legislation etc.
Brexit minus 10 days, Brexit minus 9 days etc.
You then went very quiet for a few months.
Did not think the premier would bottle and grovel
I don't usually agree with Eurointelligence, at least not in entirety, but I think they're spot on with this one.Lord Beria3 wrote:Eurointeligence latest...
Five years down the line we are more likely to see the Euro defunct and the EU on the ropes as a consequence and LB3 and other Leavers dancing in the streets because we got out in time. Remainers will probably still be moaning that we left even as the rotten institution collapses!cubes wrote:And 5 years down the line you'll be regretting you ever supported it.Lord Beria3 wrote:Agreed.
Hopefully will be out by 31st Oct.
I will be dancing on the streets!
CANZUK does have great appeal except that Australia has a pretty nutty right wing government at the moment and Canada has had same in recent years.Lord Beria3 wrote:Nope - I'm a Greerist and will remain a Brexiteer.
The EU is finished long-term.
Greer has written that trade deals with the Commonwealth will happen once we leave the EU which will be good news for the UK.
https://business.financialpost.com/opin ... atching-on
This is an interesting post on that subject.
That's not how it works. When he loses the VonC, parliament has 14 days to try to find a new government. Boris doesn't go to the Queen to request an election unless those 14 days pass without a new government emerging.RevdTess wrote:I don't usually agree with Eurointelligence, at least not in entirety, but I think they're spot on with this one.Lord Beria3 wrote:Eurointeligence latest...
A lot rides on the procedure for selecting a new govt-of-national-unity after failing a confidence vote. I have no idea how this would work. Say Boris loses his two confidence votes and the govt has to resign. Boris goes to the Queen and requests an election date, oooh, I don't know, November 1st.
Intra-opposition horse trading and brinkmanship, behind closed doorsHow does parliament even choose someone to go to the Queen and ask to try to form a govt?
Because he gets to fight an election.And why would Corbyn support them if that leader isn't him?
So why wouldn't he back a government of national unity whose only remit is to ask for an extension and call an election?He'd surely prefer a GE at any point regardless of the implied Brexit outcome.
It will happen before brexit.I don't know what he think he'll achieve with 20% vote vs the Tories' 35%+ bounce from getting Brexit done and the end of the Brexit Party....
I'll be astonished if it doesn't.Well, anyway, I'd be quite surprised if someone manages to pull off a national unity govt including Corbyn, the SNP, LibDems, Green, all the independents etc before October 31st.
That's actually much harder. It is too complicated and risky.The easier route must surely be to make a new law that forces the PM to revoke A50 before October 31st if a new deal has not been agreed in the meantime.
That would be very much a consitutional crisis, of the highest order.BORIS Johnson would REFUSE to quit if he lost a no-confidence vote in a desperate bid to force through Brexit.
The determined Prime Minister has plans to ignore any potential challenge by Tory rebels and Remainer MPs before October 31.
There is no bigger constitutional crisis possible under the UK system. For the tory brexiteers, this is now a fight to the death, and they could take the monarchy down with them.If Boris refuses to resign, the Queen may be called to get involved in the matter.
Horsetrading.RevdTess wrote: How does parliament even choose someone to go to the Queen and ask to try to form a govt?
Labour and the SNP moved towards a pact last night that would seek to oust Boris Johnson as the parties prepared for an autumn election.
John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, said that Labour would not block a second referendum on Scottish independence, in a significant shift of policy.
Nicola Sturgeon, the Scottish first minister and SNP leader, opened the door to a “progressive alliance� with Labour if the two parties were able to form a majority after a general election.
Ms Sturgeon said she was “no great fan� of Jeremy Corbyn, especially on Brexit, but that she would sign up to a pact that “could lock the Tories out of government�. Westminster is on high alert for Labour to table a vote of no confidence in Mr Johnson when MPs return next month.
Hours after Ms Sturgeon’s comments, Mr McDonnell, who is Mr Corbyn’s closest ally, said that the question of another independence poll should not be decided by the “English parliament�. The shadow chancellor’s intervention goes further than Mr Corbyn, who has previously said he will decide what to do once Ms Sturgeon had requested a referendum.
Mr McDonnell’s move led to a backlash from his colleagues, especially on the Scottish wing of the party. Ian Murray, Labour MP for Edinburgh South, accused him of being “willing to destroy our United Kingdom�. Speaking at the Edinburgh Fringe, Mr McDonnell said: “It will be for the Scottish parliament and the Scottish people to decide that. They will take a view about whether they want another referendum. Nicola Sturgeon said by late next year or the beginning of 2021.�
He told the broadcaster Iain Dale: “We would not block something like that. We would let the Scottish people decide. That’s democracy. There are other views within the party but that’s our view.�
Mr McDonnell’s stance contradicts the position of Richard Leonard, the Scottish Labour leader. In March Mr Leonard said that if a Labour government took power in Westminster it would refuse to grant a Section 30 order, which gives Holyrood the power to hold another independence vote.
The shadow chancellor said yesterday: “The Scottish parliament will come to a considered view on that and they will submit that to the government and the English parliament itself. If the Scottish people decide they want a referendum that’s for them.�
The No campaign won the Scottish independence referendum in September 2014 by 55 to 45 per cent. Mr Murray told PoliticsHome: “These are utterly irresponsible comments that betray our party’s values. The Labour Party is an internationalist party founded on a vision of solidarity and we should never seek to appease nationalists.�
He added: “John McDonnell has even bought into the nationalist narrative that Westminster is an ‘English parliament’ — an insult to the hard work by Scottish MPs from every party.
“We were promised that the 2014 referendum was once in a generation, and we have a duty to hold the nationalists to their promise by firmly opposing a divisive second referendum. But one of the architects of the Corbyn project that is destroying the Labour Party now appears willing to destroy our United Kingdom with thoughtless rants at the [Edinburgh] festival.�
Ruth Davidson, the Scottish Conservative leader, leapt on the remarks. “I feel for those Labour voters that stood side by side with major figures of their party and against the forces of nationalism in 2014. Know that the Scottish Tories will always stand up for our United Kingdom.�
Ms Sturgeon suggested she would join forces with Mr Corbyn against the Conservatives, although she attacked his approach to Brexit and said that a full coalition was not her intention.
After Ms Sturgeon’s party wiped out all but one of Labour’s MPs in Scotland — Mr Murray — at the 2015 election, one of Labour’s most viable paths to a majority at Westminster involves an alliance with the SNP. Ms Sturgeon told The Guardian on Tuesday: “We would always want to be part of a progressive alternative to a Tory government.�
If a vote of no confidence were passed, there would be a 14-day period for MPs to try to pass a motion of confidence in a new prime minister, although some in Downing Street believe that Mr Johnson could refuse to quit. If no new government were formed, a general election would be triggered. At present there are 247 Labour MPs and 35 SNP MPs, which combined is 29 fewer than the 311 Conservative MPs. A poll conducted by Lord Ashcroft after Mr Johnson’s visit to Scotland last week put support for independence at 46 per cent and opposition at 43 per cent.
A Labour spokesman said: “John McDonnell was clearly not advocating a second independence referendum. He made clear the huge benefit a UK Labour government will bring for the people of Scotland. Labour stands for an end to the status quo in the UK: economically, politically and constitutionally.�
What sort of consitutional crisis?UndercoverElephant wrote:
That would be very much a consitutional crisis, of the highest order.
The Queen is not going to get dragged into this. The last time it happened (Macmillan) Her Majesty basically said'UndercoverElephant wrote:
There is no bigger constitutional crisis possible under the UK system. For the tory brexiteers, this is now a fight to the death, and they could take the monarchy down with them.
