Brexit process

[AutomaticEarth]

So, will Japan be required to accept free movement of peoples from the EU then?

Given the Japaneses' view on immigration, that should be quite interesting to watch

[Lord Beria3]

Just shows that the EU and Britain could reach a free trade agreement (and keep border controls) if the political will existed.

Typical Brussels bollocks.

[Potemkin Villager]

Typical Brussels bollocks.

I agree, based on my personal experience, that Brussels is less than perfect, however some examples of Europolicy, e,g, 20/20/20, modest as it is, are at least trying to address many issues ground over in this forum.

The whole Britex project is typical brain dead tory bollocks, devil's spawn of the humorless xenophobia and love of lost empire of their loony back bench, backwards leaning, back woods men (incorporating now the "climate change denying, short history as described in the Bible, large car and short term personal self interest obsessed" DUP"}.

The end game will not be pretty as the Germans and the French in particular get their own back.

[Lord Beria3]

Brexit was a national security issue with the coming mega-migrations hitting Europe.

Britain, for security, social cohesion, political stability and counter-terrorist issues, needs to regain control over our borders. Otherwise our little island will be overwhelmed by migrants in the coming decades.

This is why so many working class Labour voters voted Leave. This is far more then a Tory party issue.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article55628.html

What's lost in the midst of this years migrant crisis of over 1 million migrants heading for Europe's shores, five times the number for 2014, is the consequences of the REAL MEGA-TREND, and not just of the war in Syria but the fact that Africa (North and South) is undergoing a population explosion that is literally manifesting in an exponential trend, one of MORE than doubling of Africa's population every 40 years that looks set to make today's migrant crisis look like a picnic when compared against several millions more per year who will be heading for Europe's shores in the not too distant future as the following global population graph based on UN data illustrates.

Therefore in my honest opinion the only thing that Britain can do is to ACT FIRST by LEAVING the European Union which will enable Britain to start to implement measures that will allow Britain to best cope with the population explosion climate change migration crisis storm that is heading our way and that which will worsen with each passing year, as europeans will increasingly attempt to escape a continent that will literally be drowning to life boat Britain!

[Little John]

Yes.

Beneath their political "ignorance", the proletariat's instincts are not wrong. It may be ever so easy to characterize the choice so many of them made in the Brexit referendum as coming from a place of knuckle dragging bigotry. And yes, sometimes, in terms of the limited intellectual and consequent political vocabulary available to some of them, those instincts may be expressed in a manner that does not sound too dissimilar. Which is unfortunate in the extreme.

But their instincts are still not wrong.

[Potemkin Villager]

Yes.


But their instincts are still not wrong.

The end game will not be pretty as the Germans and the French in particular get their own back even on volkfolk who follow their instincts?

[Little John]

If the German political class decide to get nasty with the UK simply for wanting to leave their little club, then the rest of Europe will finally have the veil lifted from they eyes and will see the EU as the thing it has truly become; the political vehicle of completion of the German conquest of Europe by other means.

All of which will either hasten the demise of the EU, or herald another war in Europe.

[Mark]

Typical Brussels bollocks.

Sounds even worse than Brussels Sprouts....

[johnhemming2]

Its the East Europeans (who can veto a deal) who will primarily resist changes to Freedom of Movement. The deal is not one that can be done just by France and Germany.

[Little John]

So, did they resist changes to "freedom of movement" rules vis a vis the trade deal with Japan?

If so, I wonder how that went?

[johnhemming2]

I don't think you or I know the details of the arrangement with Japan. I would assume they are not either in the Single Market or the Customs Union, but I don't know.

A new agreement with Japan is not the same as varying an agreement with the UK anyway.

However, I would assume the Japanese agreement is much like CETA or TTIP was proposed to be.

[Little John]

I don't think you or I know the details of the arrangement with Japan. I would assume they are not either in the Single Market or the Customs Union, but I don't know.

A new agreement with Japan is not the same as varying an agreement with the UK anyway.

However, I would assume the Japanese agreement is much like CETA or TTIP was proposed to be.

We are not "varying" our membership of the EU. We are leaving the EU and simultaneously seeking to negotiate a trade deal with it as is the case with trade deals with any other country outside of the EU.

Countries like Japan, for example.

[johnhemming2]

We are trying to change the agreement with EU to either not having an agreement or having a different one. Hence we are varying the agreement. Whatever the variation is requires unanimity from the EU nations. (Apart from not having an agreement)

Ukraine's agreement with the EU does not have freedom of movement because the EU nations did not want it.

It is obviously possible for the EU nations to agree whatever agreement we specify, but in practice they won't unless they get unanimity.

[Little John]

So, when all of your obfuscatory bullshit is removed, your essential position is that the EU is perfectly capable of and has indeed implemented trade agreements with countries outside of the EU without the necessity of demanding those countries submit to EU laws inside their own territories and without the necessity of demanding those countries allow open border access to the movement of people to and from from the EU. But, in the case of the UK, which is also, shortly, to be a country outside of the EU, a special exception is going to be attempted to be made whereby the EU will try and block this kind of deal as a punishment to the UK in order to serve as a warning to any other countries currently inside the EU who might consider leaving.

And you think the above represents the basis of a good argument for staying in this "club"?

[johnhemming2]

A good argument for remaining in the EU is that the difference in freedom of movement of remaining and the proposal from Theresa may is 4 years to qualify for full benefits as opposed to five years and otherwise there is considerable uncertainty, economic damage and other difficulties.