Migrant watch (merged topic)

[Little John]

Okay, found the original report.

http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/abou ... employment

It does indeed state that about half of Muslim men are unemployed and provides citations to the original research on which that statement in the report is based. So, again, not the original research that makes the claim, but one step nearer to it.

If true, it would be quite astounding and would cause me to wonder why the hell this is not more newsworthy.

[johnhemming2]

In the summary I find the 1/4 Muslim women figure (which does not talk about unemployment, but that only 1/4 work - this discounts housework, of course).

I don't see the half of muslim men being unemployed figure. I do see the 25% of pakistani men being taxi drivers, however. I think that, however, is an exaggeration - maybe by not that much, but an exaggeration nonetheless.

Again we need to go back to source. The figures are I think in any event 2008 figures.

[Little John]

In the summary I find the 1/4 Muslim women figure (which does not talk about unemployment, but that only 1/4 work - this discounts housework, of course).

I don't see the half of muslim men being unemployed figure. I do see the 25% of pakistani men being taxi drivers, however. I think that, however, is an exaggeration - maybe by not that much, but an exaggeration nonetheless.

Again we need to go back to source. The figures are I think in any event 2008 figures.

From that page, under the "effects of the recession/headline data" section":

"....Muslim people have the lowest rate of employment of any religious group. Only 47% of Muslim men and 24% of Muslim women are employed and figures suggest that 42% of young Muslim people are NEET....."

[johnhemming2]

This does not reconcile with the ONS report on the 2011 Census:

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/census/20 ... wales.html

Table 1: Economic activity of people aged 16-64, by ethnic group, England and Wales, 2011
Census.
Percentages
In employment Unemployed Inactive Total numbers in
thousands ('000')
ALL 71 6 23 36,274
White 73 5 22 31,055
English/Welsh/
Scottish/Northern
Irish/British
73 5 22 28,732
Irish 73 5 22 338
Gypsy or Irish
Traveller
40 10 50 36
Other White 77 5 19 1,949
Mixed/multiple
ethnic group
60 11 30 638
White and Black
Caribbean
56 14 30 225
White and Black
African
59 11 29 81
White and Asian 62 8 31 171
Other Mixed 63 9 29 161
Asian/Asian
British
60 7 33 2,937
Indian 70 6 24 1,026
Pakistani 49 9 42 705
Bangladeshi 48 10 41 275
Chinese 53 5 43 323
Other Asian 63 6 31 608
Black/African/
Caribbean/Black
British
61 13 26 1,241
African 59 13 28 667
Caribbean 67 12 22 408
Other Black 56 14 29 165
Other ethnic
group
53 9 39 403

[johnhemming2]

I am much happier with the ONS stats which have a much clearer definition.

According to the 2011 Census:
• High proportions of ethnic minority men were economically inactive due to being a student which
is consistent with the younger age profile of these groups. Chinese men (83%) and women
(64%) were the most likely to be economically inactive due to being a student. This is consistent
with recent analysis which found that relatively high proportion of Chinese born residents were
students in the 2011 Census

[Little John]

From the figures you have just quoted:

Pakistani 49 9 42 705
Bangladeshi 48 10 41 275

That's roughly 50% in employment and roughly 50% not in employment

As compared to:

White 73 5 22 31,055

Which is roughly 75% in employment and roughly 25% not in employment

I am assuming this is working age people, If it includes retirees, then it would change the picture. And, of course, Muslim students being counted as "not employed" could muddy the waters further if there is a large contingent (relative to their ethnic group countrywide) in full time education.

[johnhemming2]

True, but you need to look at the numbers that are students and why any of the others are economically inactive before coming to any conclusions.

It is working age people.

[Little John]

True, but you need to look at the numbers that are students and why any of the others are economically inactive before coming to any conclusions.

It is working age people.

I have just been digging and it appears Muslim people between the ages of 16 and 25 are significantly under-represented in terms of education. In other words, they have a large proportion of 16 to 25 year old NEETs relative to the general population. So, unless a disproportionate number of older Muslims are in education, it seems Muslim students not being counted as employed is unlikely to have a significantly mitigating effect on these employment figures.

I have found the original, non summarised section of the report here:

http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/site ... n_ch10.pdf

[johnhemming2]

There is, of course, this
https://www.ukdataservice.ac.uk/use-dat ... dy/?id=158

It needs a good analysis of the 2011 census to look at this issue.

[biffvernon]

People are on the move, not just to Europe.

http://www.unhcr.org/564200fd1e.html

[UndercoverElephant]

People are on the move, not just to Europe.

http://www.unhcr.org/564200fd1e.html

But the numbers of arrivals started rising in recent months and spiked in October and early November, when an estimated 4,000 Malian refugees crossed to Niger from the sparsely populated east. This brought the total number of registered refugees to a record high of 54,000 in early November with a further 3,000 awaiting registration.

Sounds like a lot, but a drop in the ocean compared to the number entering Europe.

Yes, it is a global problem.

[vtsnowedin]

Numbers are nice to play with but what if just one of your new Muslim neighbors thinks it is OK to capture and rape one of your daughters and convert her into the perfect Muslim wife?
Are you going to stand for this, or are you going to kill them?
Sounds absurd but many people in the middle east are facing such choices daily. What will you do?

[johnhemming2]

You should make a distinction between gangsterism and religion. A number of the people from the UK fighting in Syria for Daesh were gangsters in the UK.

We also have the LRA as an example of gangsterism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord%27s_Resistance_Army

[jonny2mad]

Numbers are nice to play with but what if just one of your new Muslim neighbors thinks it is OK to capture and rape one of your daughters and convert her into the perfect Muslim wife?
Are you going to stand for this, or are you going to kill them?
Sounds absurd but many people in the middle east are facing such choices daily. What will you do?

Clearly if your british you will stand for this in fact you will attack people trying to stop it. Nick griffin was taken to court because he talked about asian men grooming white girls, hes generally a hate figure in this country, as are anti islamic groups generally. But the far right were the main people who come out of the grooming scandal with pretty clean hands.

if what was happening in rotherham and rotherham is the tip of a iceberg was happening anywhere else in the world there would be lots of violence but not in the uk .

And I think basically its down to cowardice on a grand scale

[jonny2mad]

Take rotherham they talk about 1400 victims actulally its thousands you have also at least 300 girls pregnant .

Whats interesting to me is not one person killed any of these child rapist slavers, no riots no pogroms .

Nope they trusted the police and MP's who were siding with the abusers,


Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Exploitation in Rotherham
1997 - 2013
Experiences of Exploited Children
5.6 It is difficult to describe the appalling nature of the abuse that the victims of sexual exploitation in Rotherham have endured over the years. Victims were raped by multiple perpetrators, trafficked to other towns and cities in the North of England,
5.7 abducted, beaten and intimidated. Some of their experiences were described in
3 6
national media reports. We read three case files that had been covered by the media, and considered the reporting to be accurate.
5.8 We read cases where a child was doused in petrol and threatened with being set alight, children who were threatened with guns, children who witnessed brutally violent rapes and were threatened that they would be the next victim if they told anyone. Girls as young as 11 were raped by large numbers of male perpetrators, one after the other.
“What’s the point… I might as well be dead.”
5.9 In two of the cases we read, fathers tracked down their daughters and tried to remove them from houses where they were being abused, only to be arrested themselves when police were called to the scene. In a small number of cases (which have already received media attention) the victims were arrested for offences such as breach of the peace or being drunk and disorderly, with no action taken against the perpetrators of rape and sexual assault against children.
5.10 There are numerous historic examples (up to the mid-2000s) of children being stalked by their abusers, and some extreme cases of violent threats or actual assaults on the victims and their families.
5.11 One parent, who agreed to her child being placed in a residential unit in order to protect her, wrote to children’s social care expressing her fears for her daughter’s safety. She described her despair that instead of being protected, her child was being exposed to even worse abuse than when she was at home:
“My child (age 13) may appear to be a mature child, yet some of her actions and the risks to which she constantly puts herself are those of a very immature and naïve person. She constantly stays out all night getting drunk, mixing with older mature adults, and refuses to be bound by any rules.”
5.12 One child who was being prepared to give evidence received a text saying the perpetrator had her younger sister and the choice of what happened next was up to her. She withdrew her statements. At least two other families were terrorised by groups of perpetrators, sitting in cars outside the family home, smashing windows, making abusive and threatening phone calls. On some occasions child victims went back to perpetrators in the belief that this was the only way their parents and other children in the family would be safe. In the most extreme cases, no one in the family believed that the authorities could protect them.
5.13 Many of the victims were unable to recognise that they had been groomed and exploited, and some blamed themselves not just for their own abuse, but for what happened to other victims.
5.14 There have been a small number of successful prosecutions for offences against individual children. The courage required of children to give evidence against their attackers has been rightly commended, but the challenges cannot be
3 7
underestimated. Many other children refused to give evidence and/or withdrew statements as a direct result of threats, intimidation and assaults against them or their families. Overall, the small number of prosecutions and convictions has been disproportionate to the numbers of children abused and the seriousness of the offences committed against them .

I read the entire report. You have 8000 Pakistani or Kashmiri ethnicity people living in rotherham and they are the main group doing the child abuse. It would be interesting to know what percentage of the men in that community have been involved . Ive seen estimates of 1 in 6 muslim men between 20-40 involved nationally, but think it would be a lot higher in rotherham .

What do you do with a community like that . Can you tell me why its in my interest to import more of them