Is it really hard to fathom why many people despise the US?

[biffvernon]

We've got a young American lad come to stay with us for a few days. He's on a bit of a gap-year thing before, er, joining the Marines where his ambition is to be an aircrew gunner on a helicopter gunship.

We're in for some serious diplomacy exercises round the supper table.

[biffvernon]

US alters story for fourth time in four days

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015 ... -again#_=_

[vtsnowedin]

Whilst VT does not appear to have read the Glenn Greenwald article I posted, someone who does appear to have read and understood it (along with quite a bit of Monty Python) is Dmitry Orlov

Club Orlov: The World's Silliest Empire

So far so good, but let's get even sillier. Immediately after screaming loudly about Russians causing civilian casualties, the Americans blow up a hospital in Afghanistan that was run by Medecins sans Frontières, in spite of being informed of its location both before and during the bombing. “Don't kill civilians... like this!” Could it get any sillier than that? Of course it can: the US can start blatantly, nakedly lying about the event: “There were Taleban fighters hiding in that hospital!”—no, there weren't; “The Afghans told us to bomb that hospital!”—no, they didn't. Bombing that hospital was an actual war crime—so says the UN. Are the Russians now going to listen to criticism from war criminals? Don't be silly!

It's really hard to tell, but anything seems possible now. For example, the US no longer seems to have a foreign policy: the White House says one thing, the State Department another, the Pentagon a third, Samantha Power at the UN pursues a foreign policy of her own using Twitter, and Senator John McCain wants to arm Syrian rebels to shoot down Russian planes. (All five of them? John, don't be silly!) In response to all this confusion, America's political puppets in the European Union are starting to twitch uncontrollably and go off-script, because the nerve center in Washington is no longer sending them clear signals.

US foreign policy is one terminally sick joke that has had shocking consequences for millions of Iraqis , Libyans Syrians and others.

On the home front any attempt at regulating gun ownership is repeatedly slapped down. Result: another mass shooting - rinse and repeat.

The USA is collapsing - it won't end well

You are bringing Monty Python into this most serious debate and expect >>> What....!!

[UndercoverElephant]

You are bringing Monty Python into this most serious debate and expect...

...the resident Americans to have serious comprehension problems.

[vtsnowedin]

I don't follow, you can't be saying those hundreds of kids would be killed by other means had guns not been available? Surely you agree that the US needs far tighter controls on guns?

Actually no.I do not agree. The freedom of Americans to bear arms is their last great defense against being subjugated by some agency, either foreign or domestic. It is worth having in spite of the cost (very real)of civilian deaths from criminal acts and those of the mentally deranged.
In a population of some 300 million there are sadly enough nut jobs and criminals to keep the presses rolling about the "latest tragedy" but we must endure this (certainly spend a lot more on mental health)or else be left defenseless if invaders or a rouge government comes to power.

[biffvernon]

That any other nation would want to invade the USA is ridiculous but they already have a rogue government.

[emordnilap]

The freedom of Americans to bear arms is their last great defense against being subjugated by some agency, either foreign or domestic.

Ironic roll-over laugh of the day. Thanks VT, that (blackly) cheered me up.

[vtsnowedin]

That any other nation would want to invade the USA is ridiculous but they already have a rogue government.

Well perhaps we can change that in fourteen months?
Invade the USA?
Not now of course but post peak a disarmed America with it's remaining oil would be fought over, perhaps starting with a take over of Mexico then pushing North.
Add a weak president that draws red lines and sits and watches as enemies stride over them and before you know it we are pushed back into Canada.

[biffvernon]

You've been listening to too much Trump.

[vtsnowedin]

You've been listening to too much Trump.

I don't listen to that buffoon at all.

[clv101]

I don't follow, you can't be saying those hundreds of kids would be killed by other means had guns not been available? Surely you agree that the US needs far tighter controls on guns?

Actually no.I do not agree. The freedom of Americans to bear arms is their last great defense against being subjugated by some agency, either foreign or domestic. It is worth having in spite of the cost (very real)of civilian deaths from criminal acts and those of the mentally deranged.
In a population of some 300 million there are sadly enough nut jobs and criminals to keep the presses rolling about the "latest tragedy" but we must endure this (certainly spend a lot more on mental health)or else be left defenseless if invaders or a rouge government comes to power.

So you're saying thousands of deaths each year (far exceeding anything caused by terrorism) including hundreds of young children are a cost worth paying to protect against some hypothetical invasion or against your own government.

Have you any idea how utterly bonkers that makes you sound? Just what is the 'post peak' scenario you're thinking of where the US military has evaporated but some other country's military is still able to prosecute wars thousand of miles away from home? But for your small arms? No, your small arms kill Americans today, not some hypothetical invading army decades from now.

The US is simply wrong on the issue of guns, very wrong. If you personally aren't working locally for far tighter gun controls then, in my opinion, you are personally part of the problem and share responsibility for these thousands of killings. Sorry.

[biffvernon]

I've just been having a (polite) conversation with our American guest about guns. He assures me that you can't just walk into Walmart and buy a pistol. You have to over 21 years old. And there are some other formalities so it's quite hard. Doh!

[vtsnowedin]

I don't follow, you can't be saying those hundreds of kids would be killed by other means had guns not been available? Surely you agree that the US needs far tighter controls on guns?

Actually no.I do not agree. The freedom of Americans to bear arms is their last great defense against being subjugated by some agency, either foreign or domestic. It is worth having in spite of the cost (very real)of civilian deaths from criminal acts and those of the mentally deranged.
In a population of some 300 million there are sadly enough nut jobs and criminals to keep the presses rolling about the "latest tragedy" but we must endure this (certainly spend a lot more on mental health)or else be left defenseless if invaders or a rouge government comes to power.

So you're saying thousands of deaths each year (far exceeding anything caused by terrorism) including hundreds of young children are a cost worth paying to protect against some hypothetical invasion or against your own government.

Have you any idea how utterly bonkers that makes you sound? Just what is the 'post peak' scenario you're thinking of where the US military has evaporated but some other country's military is still able to prosecute wars thousand of miles away from home? But for your small arms? No, your small arms kill Americans today, not some hypothetical invading army decades from now.

The US is simply wrong on the issue of guns, very wrong. If you personally aren't working locally for far tighter gun controls then, in my opinion, you are personally part of the problem and share responsibility for these thousands of killings. Sorry.

So call me part of the problem.
You have to consider that some 60 percent of these Gun deaths are suicides where free people choose there own time and way out rather then submitting to the tortures of the medical profession that bankrupts their spouse and other heirs. And on top of that a very large chunk of the actual homicides are minority killing minority and not a concern of the average non minority person.
You might look at this.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/featur ... n-america/
And then compare suicide rates by all means between the USA and other countries and see that they are not that far apart except that the Americans use the effective tool that is close at hand and others have to get more creative.

[biffvernon]

n submitting to the tortures of the medical profession that bankrupts their spouse and other heirs.

Gosh! This side of the pond we tend to regard the medical profession as the good guys. That's why we get so upset when the Americans deliberately bomb hospitals and we dismiss belated apologies for the war crime and demand an independent inquiry set up under the terms of the Geneva Convention.

But if Americans regard the medical profession as torturers who bankrupt their patients' spouses and heirs, then that might explain things.

[UndercoverElephant]

But if Americans regard the medical profession as torturers who bankrupt their patients' spouses and heirs, then that might explain things.

In America, that's what the medical profession does. Why? Because it is run for profit, rather than a public service. And while it might seem that running at as public service would be a better idea that would be COMMUNISM(!!!!!!!), and that's bad bad bad....