Labour Party/government Watch

Snail · Post by **Snail** » 15 Sep 2015, 21:00

johnhemming2 wrote:I remember sitting in the house of commons with the left wing rebel group being quite visible and now a lot of them are on the front bench.

I thought his selling point was being on the left of the Labour Party.

Whether that is described as extreme or not is another question. He is, however, hard left.

In the end there are people like me who believe plans to print money to fund government spending are risky and can cause all sorts of havoc. I accept that many of the contributors here disagree with me on this, but a lot of people across the country agree with me.

I know they're not exactly the same, but quantative easing to bail out banks vs printing money for corbynomics.

The labour party moved right while Corbyn stayed still. Now its started to move left. But saying extreme left or hard left is similar to the language used for terrorists etc. Its intentionally emotive . Anyway, I'd prefer him to be lefter! And he's against Scottish independence! But apart from that, he'll do.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 15 Sep 2015, 21:03

Or as Petra Kelly said, a frighteningly long time ago, "Left or right, the Greens are ahead".

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 15 Sep 2015, 21:50

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... eader.html

Mr Corbyn, who was dressed in non-matching jacket and trousers and had failed to properly button his shirt...

cubes · Post by **cubes** » 15 Sep 2015, 22:18

The national anthem is a boring dirge, can't blame him for not singing it.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 15 Sep 2015, 22:38

Just thought I'd share. Made me laugh and I don't know about you, but I felt like I needed a laugh today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keAfx78i83U

oobers · Post by **oobers** » 15 Sep 2015, 22:44

UndercoverElephant wrote:http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... eader.html

Mr Corbyn, who was dressed in non-matching jacket and trousers and had failed to properly button his shirt...

During the service, Mr Cameron gave a reading from the Bible, recounting the story of Jesus's disciples arguing about who was the most important.

The Chaplain-in-Chief returned to the story during his address: 'This idea of sacrificial service for the common good is as important today as it was 75 years ago but it has always been a difficult one to learn. Even the disciples of Jesus struggled.

'When they started a quarrel as to which of them was the greatest follower, Jesus needed to remind them true leadership is not about power but rather service. If anyone wants to be great he must first be the servant of all.'

Brilliant - Cameron lecturing Corbyn about the need for non hierarchical, co-operative consensus building as suggested by another JC

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 16 Sep 2015, 09:05

Pathetic bastards at the BBC. These wankers just don't get it. Or, they don't want us to.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34262126

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 16 Sep 2015, 09:51

I get the feeling corbyn would be doing what merkel is doing in germany,

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 16 Sep 2015, 10:56

Nice to see a couple of vegetarians in top jobs too (Corbyn and Benn).

And best of all, the shadow minister for food, environment and rural affairs - with the lovely Irish name of Kerry McCarthy - is vegan and vice-president of the League Against Cruel Sports. She's a more likely candidate for assassination than Corbyn.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 16 Sep 2015, 11:16

Little John wrote:

Pathetic bastards at the BBC. These wankers just don't get it. Or, they don't want us to.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34262126

And nor did it have much to say to those who did not already consider themselves part of the Labour movement, believes Tonge: "There was no indication of how he was going to win back the 11.3m people who voted Conservative."

He doesn't need to win back the 11.3m people who voted conservative. If you are on the left of British politics, why do you need to "win back" the 25% for the electorate who voted tory? This is plain silly. The tories only have a majority of 9 seats. All Corbyn needs to do is mobilise a significant number of non-voters on the left, win the support of most of the young people coming through and do a deal with the greens (and possibly the libdems, who might be desperate enough to say yes to it as a way of apologising to the electorate for Clegg's Betrayal) and he would win. I keep seeing claims that he needs to take 90 seats off the tories in England. No he doesn't. He needs about 20 to end up leader of a coalition of the centre-left, assuming the LDs can pick up 10 in seats where a labour candidate doesn't stand.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 16 Sep 2015, 11:25

jonny2mad wrote:I get the feeling corbyn would be doing what merkel is doing in germany,

Maybe, but Corbyn isn't in power and a lot is likely to change in the next few years. I suspect what is happening in Germany at the moment is going to cause such a backlash that it is the last time it happens. Merkel was expecting two things. Firstly that her lead would be followed by other European countries. It hasn't happened. Secondly that all of the the German people would get behind her and accept what she's decided to do. And that has happened either. In effect, I suspect it is going to end up being a demonstration of why Merkel's policy is unsustainable and politically suicidal, and with a bit of luck, Corbyn and sufficient other dreamers on this topic will get a rude enough awakening that they finally cave in to reality.

Post by **clv101** » 16 Sep 2015, 11:26

UndercoverElephant wrote:He doesn't need to win back the 11.3m people who voted conservative. If you are on the left of British politics, why do you need to "win back" the 25% for the electorate who voted tory? This is plain silly. The tories only have a majority of 9 seats. All Corbyn needs to do is mobilise a significant number of non-voters on the left, win the support of most of the young people coming through and do a deal with the greens (and possibly the libdems, who might be desperate enough to say yes to it as a way of apologising to the electorate for Clegg's Betrayal) and he would win. I keep seeing claims that he needs to take 90 seats off the tories in England. No he doesn't. He needs about 20 to end up leader of a coalition of the centre-left, assuming the LDs can pick up 10 in seats where a labour candidate doesn't stand.

Spot on. I wish more (any?) commentators would make to point that Corbyn can win a general election without converting a single Tory or even convincing swing voters. Mobilising a significant fraction of the did-not-vote brigade can win him the election.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 16 Sep 2015, 11:38

clv101 wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote:He doesn't need to win back the 11.3m people who voted conservative. If you are on the left of British politics, why do you need to "win back" the 25% for the electorate who voted tory? This is plain silly. The tories only have a majority of 9 seats. All Corbyn needs to do is mobilise a significant number of non-voters on the left, win the support of most of the young people coming through and do a deal with the greens (and possibly the libdems, who might be desperate enough to say yes to it as a way of apologising to the electorate for Clegg's Betrayal) and he would win. I keep seeing claims that he needs to take 90 seats off the tories in England. No he doesn't. He needs about 20 to end up leader of a coalition of the centre-left, assuming the LDs can pick up 10 in seats where a labour candidate doesn't stand.
Spot on. I wish more (any?) commentators would make to point that Corbyn can win a general election without converting a single Tory or even convincing swing voters. Mobilising a significant fraction of the did-not-vote brigade can win him the election.

I hope Corbyn doesn't need the LibDems. I also hope the LibDems get wiped out completely. They should be in the Tory party really. They're simply spineless liars.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 16 Sep 2015, 12:28

emordnilap wrote:
clv101 wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote:He doesn't need to win back the 11.3m people who voted conservative. If you are on the left of British politics, why do you need to "win back" the 25% for the electorate who voted tory? This is plain silly. The tories only have a majority of 9 seats. All Corbyn needs to do is mobilise a significant number of non-voters on the left, win the support of most of the young people coming through and do a deal with the greens (and possibly the libdems, who might be desperate enough to say yes to it as a way of apologising to the electorate for Clegg's Betrayal) and he would win. I keep seeing claims that he needs to take 90 seats off the tories in England. No he doesn't. He needs about 20 to end up leader of a coalition of the centre-left, assuming the LDs can pick up 10 in seats where a labour candidate doesn't stand.
Spot on. I wish more (any?) commentators would make to point that Corbyn can win a general election without converting a single Tory or even convincing swing voters. Mobilising a significant fraction of the did-not-vote brigade can win him the election.
I hope Corbyn doesn't need the LibDems. I also hope the LibDems get wiped out completely. They should be in the Tory party really. They're simply spineless liars.

Not all of them. Clegg certainly was, and we've all seen what our own Mr Hemming has to say about things.

The fact remains that there are a few places in the UK where Labour has no chance whatsoever of winning, but the LD's might. Specifically, those seats where a LD lost their seat to the Tories in May, but still came second or third with Labour trailing a long way back in 4th, after UKIP. Labour has nothing to gain from contesting those seats, but every seat the tories lose to the LDs makes Corbyn's job easier (assuming the LD's won't repeat their suicidal decision to go into coalition with the tories - even the most bone-headed of MPs must realise now what a disastrous move that was).

The outcome of the next general election is likely to be close. A carefully constructed electoral pact might make all the difference, especially because it would also provide Corbyn with a context for watering down some of his most unpopular positions without looking like he's compromising on his principles (on the grounds that it is better to get into power and implement some of what you want than to remain in opposition and implement none of it).