General Election May 2015

[biffvernon]

Every vote for the Green Party will be counted and widely reported in national statistics, both in absolute numbers and percentages, and will have an influence on whoever is in power.

[nexus]

Should I vote green or not?

In my constituency, Calder Valley, the pitiful tory MP could get back in if those minded to vote green do so in sufficient numbers split the labour vote.

On the other hand, I could see it as a long game and accept that the tory might get back in but that I will have hopefully added to a massive swell in green share of the vote nationally and that when they join a coalition, they use this share of the vote to bargain for a better voting system next time round??

Or I could vote labour to keep the tory out.

Or I could do a Russell Brand.

I'm torn between voting green and not voting. A labour vote just feels bowel movingly uncomfortable these days.

Vote with your conscience. I have been voting green now for many years. I nearly voted LibDem tactically last time to keep the Tory out, I didn't, he got in anyway and then the LibDems climbed into bed with the Tories, so I was mighty glad I hadn't vote LD and had voted in line with my conscience.

I think there is going to be a massive swing to the greens. One day last week 6000 people joined the party. The combined UK Green Parties now have more members than UKIP and than the LibDems and we regularly poll ahead of the LibDems. There is a definite shift underway and a Green vote is definitely not wasted.

[emordnilap]

Or I could do a Russell Brand.

Do not do that. Not voting sends one message only to those competing for power: you and your opinions don't matter even the tiny little bit most other people do.

But take note and adopt of RB's general philosophies - that's extremely important. He's in the enviable position of not needing to vote because he has a massive influence anyway.

You could also campaign or put up posters or distribute leaflets or do something to help the greens get in - that will help assuage any misgivings over splitting the labour vote, as you're actually involved; you never know - you may try harder next time.

I got Irish citizenship with one of the express purposes being to acquire the ability to vote in all ballots across the board (another was to get a passport - an Irish passport is always useful if you find yourself somewhere like Beirut or whatever )

In Ireland, we also have the satisfying system (a transferable vote) of being able to put the worst candidates most definitely last in our preferences and the least worst first.

[PS_RalphW]

Greens and nationalists to join TV election debate

http://www.theguardian.com/media/2015/j ... laid-cymru

Now watch the NI parties kick off.

[AutomaticEarth]

The SNP voting on English affairs?

Makes you want to vote UKIP to get the Tories back in

[oobers]

Or I could do a Russell Brand.

No idea how old you are,

I'm 42. I have no idea what proportion of my age group choose not to vote?

Every vote for the Green Party will be counted and widely reported in national statistics, both in absolute numbers and percentages, and will have an influence on whoever is in power.

Sure, I get that. My hope is that if the Greens do get an MP or two, they may find themselves invited into coalition and that those votes will help in influencing larger coalition partners when it comes to policy. On the other hand, I fear that Greens in coalition will simply help to prop up larger coalition parties as they carry on with their own brand of politics, in much the same way the libdems have done for the tories (although I suspect they did act as a brake on some more outrageous toryism)
Russell Brand's main argument as I understand it is that whatever party or parties get into power, they are immediately trapped in an old narrative, an outdated way of conducting government that moves too slowly to address the most pressing problems facing humanity, notably climate change. Naomi Klein and others make a convincing case that choosing this BAU politics is not viable. Voting therefore just adds to the mandate to carry on in this way. A mass social movement actively not voting and demanding alternatives is the other way..?

You could also campaign or put up posters or distribute leaflets or do something to help the greens get in - that will help assuage any misgivings over splitting the labour vote, as you're actually involved; you never know - you may try harder next time.

A good idea. I have been re-reading green policy docs and I do agree with the vast majority of what they say so I could see myself getting behind them and trying to persuade others to do so too.
Still torn though

[UndercoverElephant]

Or I could do a Russell Brand.

Do not do that. Not voting sends one message only to those competing for power: you and your opinions don't matter even the tiny little bit most other people do.

And what message does voting send?

You matter a tiny little bit, for one day, at least if you live in a marginal consituency.

[UndercoverElephant]

Or I could do a Russell Brand.

Do not do that. Not voting sends one message only to those competing for power: you and your opinions don't matter even the tiny little bit most other people do.

But take note and adopt of RB's general philosophies - that's extremely important. He's in the enviable position of not needing to vote because he has a massive influence anyway.

You could also campaign or put up posters or distribute leaflets or do something to help the greens get in - that will help assuage any misgivings over splitting the labour vote, as you're actually involved; you never know - you may try harder next time.

I can't vote green. The greens are coming from nowhere in my constituency - they didn't even stand in 2010. The tories currently hold it with a 2000 majority, with nobody else anywhere in sight (LDs came third last time, 11000 behind labour, with three right wing parties on 2000 between them). In the hung parliament that is coming, every tory MP matters - whether or not we get a tory-led or not-tory-led government might spin on just 5 or 10 seats. My seat is one of those where the sitting tory could very easily be kicked out. What are those 8000 LD voters going to do? I'm guessing at least half of them will vote for somebody else, and it probably won't be the tories, but it is all still too close to call. Labour are probably going to take the seat, but it could be very close indeed. As much I think labour are disappointing, crap and too far up the arse of the establishment, I hate the tories far more and the mathematical truth in Hastings and Rye is this: every anti-tory person who votes green instead of labour makes it easier for the tories to hold this seat. Maybe some of those LD voters might not be able to bring themselves to vote labour and will vote green as a protest. If that happens and labour get in with a comfortable majority then maybe I'll vote green next time.

[Little John]

It is precisely the kind of dilemma you face that means the elected dictatoriship system we currenty use is so useless and non representative.

Sortition would go some way to resolving these issues.

[emordnilap]

On the other hand, I fear that Greens in coalition will simply help to prop up larger coalition parties as they carry on with their own brand of politics, in much the same way the libdems have done for the tories (although I suspect they did act as a brake on some more outrageous toryism)

Yes.

Russell Brand's main argument as I understand it is that whatever party or parties get into power, they are immediately trapped in an old narrative, an outdated way of conducting government that moves too slowly to address the most pressing problems facing humanity, notably climate change.

Yes.

Voting therefore just adds to the mandate to carry on in this way.

Yes.

A mass social movement actively not voting and demanding alternatives is the other way..?

Definitely not. The Tories would be in, in, in.

It is precisely the kind of dilemma you face that means the elected dictatoriship system we currenty use is so useless and non representative.

Yes. Despite our preferable (to me) system in Ireland, it still favours the establishment and I find there are lots of people I can vote against but zero I can vote for. Sortition sounds great, with local democracy and true subsidiarity.

[biffvernon]

I fear that Greens in coalition will simply help to prop up larger coalition parties

The Green Party leader, Natalie Bennett, has made it very clear that we will not enter into a coalition government, rather there will be a 'confidence and supply' arrangement whereby the Green Party will support another party where there is no policy conflict but will reserve the right to vote against that government where we see fit. The example that Natalie gave was over the replacement for Trident, where the Green Party would vote against no matter what.

[AutomaticEarth]

Apparently David Cameron may not join any televised debate. They could of course put a cardboard cutout in his place...might get more response.....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/general ... meron.html

[OrraLoon]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-e ... e-30952506

SNP win a seat in GB Central. Looks like this could be for real, oil price or no.
And the Greens might normally have expected to be where the LibDems are.

(Of course, I'll need to check this with a reliable news site. )

[biffvernon]

(Of course, I'll need to check this with a reliable news site. )

Yup, it's true
http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/ ... n-1.801656

[AutomaticEarth]

The election will be multi - way affair.

The greens, limp dumbs, cons, UKIP, and Labour, plaid cymru, and SNP (yes really).

Plaid and SNP have no place in this debate IMHO.