The rise of the far right

[jonny2mad]

Well its more likely that you would get a leader of a major party saying we need to import people, because that goes along with what the PC crowd that control the media want .

If you speak emotively about the need for stopping immigration your likely to find yourself in a jail cell,or you will be heckled your meetings will get broken up by thugs .

If your party looked to be getting successful the powers that be and the so called liberals who are not liberal at all, and certainly dont believe in free speech or free elections would nobble you .

[Mean Mr Mustard]

i've never noticed anyone having fun on here.

Why, only today, I was quoting the late and great Eric Morecombe, and referencing biting satire amongst the grim ebola discussion. What more can you ask..?

It's a morale thing, to counter the despair. Much like kindred spirits Milligan and Secombe knew when they met...

From the Goon Show wiki entry -

"Milligan's artillery unit accidentally allowed a large howitzer to roll off a cliff, under which Secombe was sitting in a small wireless truck: "Suddenly there was a terrible noise as some monstrous object fell from the sky quite close to us. There was considerable confusion, and in the middle of it all the flap of the truck was pushed open and a young, helmeted idiot asked 'Anybody see a gun?' It was Milligan."

Secombe's answer to that question was "What colour was it?"

[RenewableCandy]

He's not condescending, he's a blunt-speaking Yorkshireman.

Carry on, Steve.

On the subject of blunt speaking, what would be the election outcome if the leader of any party came clean and said "We're skint, if we don't import enough talented people now there will soon be no money to pay your pension or care bills" ?

They'd get my vote.

I can see your point, but training-up the people who are already here is probably a better bet, and would necessitate less extra infrastructure (housing, schools, roads etc). Importing more people ad infinitum because pensions would otherwise not get paid, is a problem with pensions, not with numbers of people.

When I walk through our local Uni campus, well it's full of Chinese students. It's great that our uni is seen as a good place to be by the Chinese (or indeed anybody else), BUT, in collecting the chinese students' massive fees, the Uni is also failing to train-up, or otherwise enlighten, the next generation of Brits.

[Little John]

He's not condescending, he's a blunt-speaking Yorkshireman.

Carry on, Steve.

On the subject of blunt speaking, what would be the election outcome if the leader of any party came clean and said "We're skint, if we don't import enough talented people now there will soon be no money to pay your pension or care bills" ?

They'd get my vote.

There's an even blunter truth beneath that one and that is there wont be enough money to pay for pensions or care bills at the levels required to keep us in the manner to which we have all become accustomed, no matter what we do. The only pertinent question that remains, then, is how the diminishing resources are to be shared out; equitably or inequitably?

Everything else is delusion or deception. Including believing we can keep importing labour into this territory in order to keep an unsustainable model of economic growth going. Nobody sensible would suggest that immigration of key, highly able and trained people should be hindered. But, that is not what the bulk of immigration to this country is about. It's never been what is was about.

[RenewableCandy]

"Care" (in extreme old age) is over-rated.

[jonny2mad]

Unemployment among ethnic minorities costs the economy almost £8.6 billion a year in benefits and lost revenue from taxes. Half of Muslim men and three quarters of Muslim women are unemployed.

Could you tell me how bringing in those muslims so they can live off the dole as helped this country

I mean we have more of them fighting againsta us as jihadis than we have muslims in all our armed forces, is your idea of diversity making you stronger actually making you stronger

[Little John]

....Half of Muslim men and three quarters of Muslim women are unemployed...

That's a specific claim requiring specific evidence. Furthermore, when you refer to Muslim women as being "unemployed", if they are not in receipt of benefits, then your claim is erroneous and/or misleading. In any event, as I said, such a claim requires evidence.

Link?

[kenneal - lagger]

On Question Time this evening there was a discussion about the Health service and also immigration but the panel didn't seem to see anything wrong with staffing the health service with doctors and nurses scoured from the third world where they have been expensively trained by the local government. It must save us a fortune in training and then people worry about the cost of the overseas aid budget!

We have nearly two million unemployed who we should be training or retraining to be useful to our economy. We can't complain about dole scroungers when we find it cheaper and easier to poach ready trained people from abroad or if our education system is so bad that it turns out unemployable teenagers. Many don't have the education to find a job and they don't even have the lifeskills to find or even want one in some cases. The education system is failing on two counts.

[jonny2mad]

....Half of Muslim men and three quarters of Muslim women are unemployed...

That's a specific claim requiring specific evidence. Furthermore, when you refer to Muslim women as being "unemployed", if they are not in receipt of benefits, then your claim is erroneous and/or misleading. In any event, as I said, such a claim requires evidence.

Link?

The Daily Telegraph reported in 2012 that 75% of all Muslim women are unemployed while 50% of all Muslim men are unemployed (67.5% total)- . http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... point.html

[jonny2mad]

Actually I think the figures are worse than that http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/site ... n_ch11.pdf

its actually 53% of muslim men and 76% of muslim women with some ethnic sub groups with much higher unemployment .

They also claim a disproportion of sickness benefit

[BritDownUnder]

On Question Time this evening there was a discussion about the Health service and also immigration but the panel didn't seem to see anything wrong with staffing the health service with doctors and nurses scoured from the third world where they have been expensively trained by the local government. It must save us a fortune in training and then people worry about the cost of the overseas aid budget!

We have nearly two million unemployed who we should be training or retraining to be useful to our economy. We can't complain about dole scroungers when we find it cheaper and easier to poach ready trained people from abroad or if our education system is so bad that it turns out unemployable teenagers. Many don't have the education to find a job and they don't even have the lifeskills to find or even want one in some cases. The education system is failing on two counts.

To be fair at least one country, the Philippines, purportedly trains a higher number of nurses than it needs in the expectation that remittances to the Philippines from the country in which they work over the long term will exceed the training costs.

[biffvernon]

And Cuba trains a higher number of nurses than it needs in the realisation that sending them to places that are even worse off than Cuba is a Good Thing.

[jonny2mad]

Is it a good thing really, say they send doctors to west africa doesn't it make it less likely west africa will develop its own doctors .

Liberia as been independent since 1840 and they have more witchdoctors than doctors, that doesnt give me much confidence in the paternalist way of developing africa .

How long do you keep sending aid workers and doctors and gap year students, I mean all my life they have been doing that, they did it before during the empire, how long does it take to see its a failure of a policy

[mr brightside]

Actually I think the figures are worse than that http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/site ... n_ch11.pdf

its actually 53% of muslim men and 76% of muslim women with some ethnic sub groups with much higher unemployment .

They also claim a disproportion of sickness benefit

That's probably a result of their religious beliefs, it's another example of how Islam doesn't recognise, or work in, the modern world.

[Little John]

Actually I think the figures are worse than that http://www.equalityhumanrights.com/site ... n_ch11.pdf

its actually 53% of muslim men and 76% of muslim women with some ethnic sub groups with much higher unemployment .

They also claim a disproportion of sickness benefit

That's probably a result of their religious beliefs, it's another example of how Islam doesn't recognise, or work in, the modern world.

If, by "religious beliefs", you are suggesting the cultural practice of the women spending the bulk of their time bringing up the kids somehow does not fit with the "modern world", then I am bound to reply that I agree with those cultural practices and it's the "modern world" that needs to fit with how the vast majority of humanity operates. including how the indigenous Anglo Saxon culture operated until very recently, I should add. For reasons of sexual equality there is, of course, no good reason why this should necessarily be a woman, Though I am also bound to suggest that the different inherent psychologies of men and women are such that I do believe women are better primary caregivers of very young children and so, given a choice, most men are more than happy for women to fulfil that role and most women are happy to accept it.

That notwithstanding, a world where both parents are economically required to be absent for the majority of the time from their young children's lives due to both of them having to work full time simply make ends meet is a f***ed up world that needs to change.