Matches or lighters, long term

[adam2]

What is the prevailing view on the best/cheapest long term arrangements for lighting fires, lanterns, candles etc ?
I refer here to the routine lighting of indoor fires and candles etc, not to severe weather or outdoor survival.

The obvious choices are safety matches, disposable lighters, and refillable lighters, petrol or gas.
All these are cheap and readily available whilst times are normal but might be unobtainable in any long term emergency.
I am also doubtful as to how well they will work after perhaps decades of storage.

I recently tried some safety matches that had been stored for about 25 years, most did not work.
Cheap disposable lighters dont appear to be very gas tight, after only a couple of years storage I found many to be empty, and NONE to be full.

Refillable petrol lighters such as the "Zippo" ones suffer from rapid evaporation of the fuel, but can be stored dry with fuel seperatly. But that means hoping that the fuel stocks will remain reliably vapour tight for decades.

Significant stashes of matches, lighters, or fuel for same make me a little nervous since by definition they are highly flamable.

If planning for the long term, large numbers of matches or equivalent are needed. Just 2 or 3 a day is 1,000 a year or say 25,000 for the long term.
Then consider that stocks could be prudently duplicated in different locations, and perhaps some extra for barter, trade, or helping others, and 100,000 matches starts looking plausible.
That many would make me nervous !

I have tried fire making with a flint and steel, with limited success, it would be very tedious in the long term.
A fresnel lens allows fire starting without consuming anything, but fire is more often wanted in the dark.

[Tarrel]

From a resilience point of view, I'd say; "All of the above"! Matches and lighters are currently cheap as chips, as you say, and don't take up much storage space. A classic example of a "ho hum" everyday product now, who's value (personal and economic) would soar after a collapse or in a time of shortage.

For matches, I wonder whether long-term storage could be improved by keeping them in an airtight container with a small sachet of silica gel (as found in electronic goods packaging)?

I find a Swedish fire steel a useful item. Takes a little bit of practice to use, but much more effective than a traditional flint and steel. Low tech and long-lasting.

[adam2]

I have stocks of all the above, but not IMHO enough to last the rest of my life.
Apart from a few for daily use I shall give up on the disposable gas lighters as I have found these to have a short shelf life.

Large stashes of matches make me a little nervous, but if in sealed metal tins and well away from sources of ignition should be OK.
I would add silica gel having ensured that this is dried out.

A few petrol lighters with some very well sealed cans of fuel seem sensible in addition.
Coleman fuel seems to keep better than lighter petrol, presumably the cans are better sealed. I found some Coleman fuel at least 25 years old and the cans still seem full.

[Tarrel]

Coleman fuel seems to keep better than lighter petrol, presumably the cans are better sealed. I found some Coleman fuel at least 25 years old and the cans still seem full.

That's useful to know.

[westcoast]

Initially probably best to cover all bases, matches, lighters cheap gas, a few zippos and flints, lighter fluid and some fire starter things (the ones you scrape steel against and get a pile of sparks).

But Post crash while we will rely on open flames more because of that it will be less of an issue for the follow reasons:-

We will have more fires, stoves, ovens etc.
we will get better at it quick through practice and necessity.
we will have neighbors who will be in the same position as us - everyone will quickly appreciate the benefits of having and being a good neighbor - how easy if your neighbors fire has gone out to give them some glowing embers/faggots it may be you next week.
we will have more 'time' to spend on tending the fire - old people can and still do in many societies fulfill an essential role through this kid of activity along with child minding etc.

So my opinion is it will be an issue in the short term but far less in the long term - it will take some time but we will adapt quick we will have to for millenia people kept the fire burning and will continue to do so. We will lead simpler lives and tending the fire will be a core task we have moved away from creating fire in the past few decades but was the wartime refrain not 'keep the home fires burning'? an indication of its centrality to life.

[Little John]

When I as a kid, my job in the winter, from the age of around 8 or 9, was to light the fire early on the morning. You get to be a dab hand at something if you do it every day. I could go from stone cold fireplace to blazing inferno in around 15 minutes flat.

[SleeperService]

Although moisture will be an issue I doubt that today's petrol will be viable in 25 months let alone years. It seems to 'decompose' fairly quickly, possibly by design?

Paraffin would be a much better bet for long tern stability I'd suggest. It can also be used for other tasks to increase it's value.

However I agree with westcoast that it won't be a long term issue. My brother picked up the knack of fire starting in about an hour on a survival course, if he can do it most people can!

My tool of choice is a gas welders spark lighter. Lots of spare sparks with every use!!

[Little John]

If you want to start a fire from scratch, all you need is a whittling knife to fashion up some hardwood dowelling, a bit of hard flat wood, some dried grass etc and one of these:

[SleeperService]

Christ! I haven't seen one of those in years. Didn't know they still got made...

[adam2]

Although moisture will be an issue I doubt that today's petrol will be viable in 25 months let alone years. It seems to 'decompose' fairly quickly, possibly by design?

Paraffin would be a much better bet for long tern stability I'd suggest. It can also be used for other tasks to increase it's value.

------

IME, petrol keeps almost indefinatly in tightly sealed metal cans, nothing can get in or out and it seems unlikely that it would chemicly react with the metal can.
Petrol does not keep in vented vehicle fuel tanks because the more volatile fractions evaporate, followed eventualy by complete evaporation.
Keeping it in a plastic can is not much better since the plastic is slightly pervious to petrol vapour.
Coleman fuel, though not identical to automotive petrol is rather similar and should keep well provided that the cans are well sealed.

Parrafin is much less volatile and keeps well and is very useful for lamps. It wont readily light from a spark and is therefore unsuitable in a petrol lighter such as a zippo.

[Lurkalot]

Large stashes of matches make me a little nervous, but if in sealed metal tins and well away from sources of ignition should be OK.
I would add silica gel having ensured that this is dried out.

When I used matches for camping , as opposed to the disposable lighter nowadays, I would dip them in candle wax before hand . Would still have the problem of a large amount of inflammable material being stored and frankly dipping 100,000 matches would be a thankless task but would it be a possibility for long term storage?

[RenewableCandy]

We have a swedish firesteel. I should practice lighting the woodburner with it more often, so I can do it when I need to.

[featherstick]

My tool of choice is a gas welders spark lighter. Lots of spare sparks with every use!!

Can you send me some please?

[featherstick]

If you want to start a fire from scratch, all you need is a whittling knife to fashion up some hardwood dowelling, a bit of hard flat wood, some dried grass etc and one of these:

I have one, but I don't think I would ever have thought to light a fire with it. I'm going to have a play with it.

Perhaps we'll see a return of the slow match?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slow_match

These were still being sold in Spain in the 80s but I haven't seen any for a while.

[PS_RalphW]

https://www.fine-tools.com/bohr1.htm

76 Euro plus delivery .