Assange Watch

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:26

An interesting article that you can no longer read on the Guardian website: http://www.exposingthetruth.co/guardian ... in-though/

Revealed: secret European deals to hand over private data to America
At least six European Union countries in addition to Britain have been colluding with the US over the mass harvesting of personal communications data, according to a former contractor to America’s National Security Agency, who said the public should not be “kept in the dark”.

Wayne Madsen, a former US navy lieutenant who first worked for the NSA in 1985 and over the next 12 years held several sensitive positions within the agency, names Denmark, the Netherlands, France, Germany, Spain and Italy as having secret deals with the US.

Madsen said the countries had “formal second and third party status” under signal intelligence (sigint) agreements that compels them to hand over data, including mobile phone and internet information to the NSA if requested....

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:35

Meanwhile, across the Channel the French seem to be getting uppity

http://www.france24.com/en/20130630-fra ... ons-europe

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:49

So does that mean it's ok to spy on us citizens, but not ok to spy on EU bureaucrats?

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 30 Jun 2013, 17:54

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 02 Jul 2013, 15:12

nexus wrote:If you've read it what did you make of it? I am getting a lot from it, he's really fleshed out his previous arguments and thinking. I agree too with your analysis that stages one and two are overlapping and ongoing and in the last two years we've seen the worldwide start of stage three.

How're you getting on nexus?

Orlov (quite rightly IMO) sees the current shifting of wealth upwards to the 1% as being part of the collapse; this is how the economy is rigged. It is intentional and unintentional preparation by them - as they'll need their wealth to 'uphold law and order', meaning 'exterminate the brutes'.

Indeed, the militia is going to be the only guaranteed job in the near future.

nexus · Post by **nexus** » 02 Jul 2013, 17:20

I've finished it and I thought it was very good.

I agree with what you/Orlov said about the economy being rigged to funnel wealth up to the 1%, I think this is happening at a faster and faster pace. I liked that he emphasises social capital. Although for the rich, owning lots of land/hard assets is the only game in town and I agree that the security industry/army/militia will probably provide the only remaining paying jobs in the future.

I thought that the case studies were fascinating. I don't like to think that the social progress we have made may be lost, but I accept what he says about the ability to endure/abide and cohesiveness of the groups he studied.

Overall though it was a depressing read, I wouldn't give it to anyone who wasn't already pretty clued up, but for those of us who have been following events I thought it provided a lot of food for thought. What did you take away from it emordinalap/anyone else who has read it?

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 02 Jul 2013, 17:29

nexus wrote:Overall though it was a depressing read, I wouldn't give it to anyone who wasn't already pretty clued up

I would! SWISO has to read it first then I'll select my victim.

nexus wrote:What did you take away from it emordinalap/anyone else who has read it?

I love the thoughts about anarchy; pretty much chimes in with my aspirations.

I have seriously thought about the idea of a local 'labour exchange' which Orlov suggests and it's something I'm keeping in the back of my mind, for when TS really HTF and hyperinflation sets in.

We kind-of have such a network now in our area (you can easily get to know most people within a couple of square miles of my house) but cash is king. Bartering and gift are practised but not often enough.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 02 Jul 2013, 17:45

The Wikileaks party is running for election in Australia.

nexus · Post by **nexus** » 02 Jul 2013, 17:49

SWISO??? I've checked urban dictionary but no joy, I'm guessing 'she who.....something or other'? My husband is reading it now and thinks it's good too.

I agree about the non hierarchical organising and relocalisation stuff, I think what he is advocating is going to be hard for people to currently achieve, because of the very strong group bonds eg kinship/religion that he thinks are needed to sustain these groups.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 02 Jul 2013, 17:56

She whom I sometimes obey.

nexus · Post by **nexus** » 02 Jul 2013, 18:08

emordnilap wrote:She whom I sometimes obey.

like it!

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 03 Jul 2013, 16:02

Looks like Snowden is marooned in Russia for the time being. What can ordinary mortals do?

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 03 Jul 2013, 16:05

Top 10 reasons why Snowden should go to Iceland

The latest incarnation of the Alþingi may be less sympathetic though.

Nice to have the support of your father though.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 03 Jul 2013, 19:11

However

Birgitta Jónsdóttir, the rather excellent Icelandic MP, posted this on facebook this morning:

Mythbusting the fairytale of Iceland: Overwhelming majority of Icelanders elected and trusted the parties that put our new crowdsourced constitution on death row, the same parties that sold the banks to their friends that led to financial collapse in 2008. The same parties that serve the 1%, and the majority of Icelanders voted for these parties in the hope the breadcrumbs from their tables of gold dust and diamond juice might trickle down to them. The same parties that serve those that refuse to pay some of their profit of our mutual resources into our collective funds to run our infrastructure. The same f***ing parties that have been pimping our nature to the aluminium industry. The same parties that destroyed the integrity of our academia, and our media. So it is only fair to say that most of Icelanders will not support Snowden or any other truth tellers because they are so busy waiting, and waiting for the gold dust to trickle down from the top layer.

A cross woman, but probably correct.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 04 Jul 2013, 11:21

biffvernon wrote:However

Birgitta Jónsdóttir, the rather excellent Icelandic MP, posted this on facebook this morning:

Mythbusting the fairytale of Iceland: Overwhelming majority of Icelanders elected and trusted the parties that put our new crowdsourced constitution on death row, the same parties that sold the banks to their friends that led to financial collapse in 2008. The same parties that serve the 1%, and the majority of Icelanders voted for these parties in the hope the breadcrumbs from their tables of gold dust and diamond juice might trickle down to them. The same parties that serve those that refuse to pay some of their profit of our mutual resources into our collective funds to run our infrastructure. The same ******* parties that have been pimping our nature to the aluminium industry. The same parties that destroyed the integrity of our academia, and our media. So it is only fair to say that most of Icelanders will not support Snowden or any other truth tellers because they are so busy waiting, and waiting for the gold dust to trickle down from the top layer.
A cross woman, but probably correct.

Yep. Ah, the fickleness and short memories of voters...