Peak Power Switch

extractorfan · Post by **extractorfan** » 23 Jun 2013, 22:19

clv101 wrote:
Lord Beria3 wrote:Where I disagree is the idea that peak oil has gone mainstream.
"Peak oil" the term, Hubert, the relationship between discovery and extraction, EROI... that's not mainstream.

However, the concept that the period of cheap energy is over is mainstream, EIA forecasts are falling year on year... less than a decade ago mainstream projections were for 130 million barrels a day at $30 by 2020. That thinking is no more. Energy security is now seen as a major challenge.

Peak oil has entered the mainstream - but not the simple cartoon Hubert first drew for us.

Yeah, but that's what peak oil is isn't it. If you google peak oil [there are other search engine providers available] you "get the idea", if you talk about energy security you can cover it all up by talking about pesky Arabs, or environmentalists, or whatever. To me, peak oil is not mainstream although I know of some people who are aware now of the possibilities of energy decline who were not about 10 years ago. Most though are still into gadgets, gizmos, and making sure they don't lose their jobs.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 23 Jun 2013, 22:27

extractorfan wrote:
clv101 wrote:
Lord Beria3 wrote:Where I disagree is the idea that peak oil has gone mainstream.
"Peak oil" the term, Hubert, the relationship between discovery and extraction, EROI... that's not mainstream.

However, the concept that the period of cheap energy is over is mainstream, EIA forecasts are falling year on year... less than a decade ago mainstream projections were for 130 million barrels a day at $30 by 2020. That thinking is no more. Energy security is now seen as a major challenge.

Peak oil has entered the mainstream - but not the simple cartoon Hubert first drew for us.
Yeah, but that's what peak oil is isn't it. If you google peak oil [there are other search engine providers available] you "get the idea", if you talk about energy security you can cover it all up by talking about pesky Arabs, or environmentalists, or whatever. To me, peak oil is not mainstream although I know of some people who are aware now of the possibilities of energy decline who were not about 10 years ago. Most though are still into gadgets, gizmos, and making sure they don't lose their jobs.

Then there is the added "noise" from the "Fracking will save us" proponents, creating a head-wind against the wider understanding and awareness of the peak oil idea.

RevdTess · Post by **RevdTess** » 24 Jun 2013, 09:13

This is still the online forum on the website which feels like 'my community'. You guys are the ones I'd enjoy sharing a beer or three with. Sometimes I roll my eyes at the way Steve and Biff torment each other

but all in all I've been reading this board almost ten years now which is longer than I've ever lived anywhere and longer than any of my relationships either

. PS is home-on-the-web for me. It's not about peak oil for me any more, it's about living a good life. And I still come here almost every day, even if I don't post much. I love to see how everyone's thinking is evolving.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 24 Jun 2013, 09:49

Tess wrote:This is still the online forum on the website which feels like 'my community'. You guys are the ones I'd enjoy sharing a beer or three with. Sometimes I roll my eyes at the way Steve and Biff torment each other but all in all I've been reading this board almost ten years now which is longer than I've ever lived anywhere and longer than any of my relationships either . PS is home-on-the-web for me. It's not about peak oil for me any more, it's about living a good life. And I still come here almost every day, even if I don't post much. I love to see how everyone's thinking is evolving.

I can't deny my half of that charge Tess and so I'm not going to try. We all have our little demons and mine are a deeply ingrained and sometimes (yes, I'll admit it) overinflated problem with authority (real or imagined) and hypocrisy as I see it. I also have a knee-jerk inclination to justify and defend the actions of the otherwise weak and disenfranchised, sometimes even when there is demonstrably no defence for those actions and will take instinctive exception if I see their actions criticised from the position of anyone who has more power than them.

I'd just like to state that all of the above characteristics are born of deeply thought out and well constructed philosophical positions

I'd like to state that.

But the truth is, as is usually the case with these things, such characteristics are merely the result of the hidden and then re-expressed emotional and irrational psychological responses born of a set of clichéd childhood formative experiences which I do not intend to recount here.

That is all

RevdTess · Post by **RevdTess** » 24 Jun 2013, 10:07

stevecook172001 wrote:I can't deny my half of that charge Tess and so I'm not going to try. We all have our little demons and mine are a deeply ingrained and sometimes (yes, I'll admit it) overinflated problem with authority (real or imagined) and hypocrisy as I see it. I also have a knee-jerk inclination to justify and defend the actions of the otherwise weak and disenfranchised, sometimes even when there is demonstrably no defence for those actions and will take instinctive exception if I see their actions criticised from the position of anyone who has more power than them.

I'd just like to state that all of the above tendencies are born of deeply thought out and well constructed philosophical positions

I'd like to state that.

But the truth is, as is usually the case with such things, my positions are merely the result of the hidden and then re-expressed emotional and irrational psychological responses born of a set of clichéd childhood formative experiences which I do not intend to recount here.

That is all.

I have a lot of sympathy with all that because I am very similar and for similar reasons of childhood experiences leading to unhelpful emotional responses to authority - even legitimate authority. The fact that I don't often unleash it on the web is only because I learned very quickly that online text is a place where it's almost impossible to change anyone's minds - because it's so public that everyone feels obliged to defend their positions to the hilt. Also I realised that if I lose my temper online it tends to stick around more permanently which is very embarrassing if you've been working hard over the years to nurture a more gentle and forgiving spirit

You're very brave to admit your childhood wounds. Like you I get into a rage about injustice and then I get childish if people dare to disagree with me. I just instinctively know that I'm right and opponents are either idiots or bastards!

In case you're interested in such things, you've described yourself as a type 'eight' on the enneagram scale http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/typeeight.asp

Generally what 'eights' most want is autonomy for themselves and justice for others, and when we don't get it we get very angry, both with authority and with ourselves for being powerless in the face of it.

Bless you for being so honest. Appreciated. I feel like I understand better where you're coming from.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 24 Jun 2013, 10:24

Just did the free 10-minute test, and I come out equally as Type 1 (Reformer) and Type 9 (Peacemaker). Thanks for the link.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 24 Jun 2013, 11:27

Hmmmm.... I scored highest in Type 5 but Types 1, 7 and 8 came close seconds.
Despite the instruction, Do not over-analyze the questions... I thought most of the questions should have had a 'neither of the above' or 'both the above' option. If I did the test again without trying to remember what I did first time, I might well get a totally different result as many of the answers were not picked with much conviction.

What does it mean that I am somewhat sceptical about this test?

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 24 Jun 2013, 11:34

It is a "forced choice" questionnaire; quite common with this type of test. If there was an "either of the above", or "none of the above" option, it wouldn't expose the underlying personality drivers, but would be more of a description of how you would react in specific situations. Useful, but not effective in being able to draw conclusions about personality type.

The general idea with these questionnaires is to go with "gut feel" and not take too long to analyse each scenario. Apparently it gives more accurate results.

I too came out with several "types" nearly tied for first place (1 and 9, followed closely by 3).

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 24 Jun 2013, 11:38

Well yes, but my point is that there were so many close calls that if I did it again I would probably get a different result. That would suggest it's not reliable in saying anything useful.

Perhaps I ought to try it again in a few days when I've forgotten my previous answers and see what happens.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 24 Jun 2013, 11:40

biffvernon wrote:Well yes, but my point is that there were so many close calls that if I did it again I would probably get a different result. That would suggest it's not reliable in saying anything useful.

Perhaps I ought to try it again in a few days when I've forgotten my previous answers and see what happens.

Good idea.

Post by **clv101** » 24 Jun 2013, 11:55

I came out a 5, with 6 just one point behind.

RevdTess · Post by **RevdTess** » 24 Jun 2013, 12:07

lol - I should have expected that everyone would start doing the test!

Honestly the test is a bit useless and enneagram workshop leaders all say you'd be better off reading the summaries of the 9 'types' and see which one fits you. Even better is to listen to other people talk about themselves and see the commonalities. A lot of the types seem very similar to one another in terms of behaviours but are very different in terms of motivations. No 10 minute test is going to figure that out for you.

Also the enneagram is not really the sort of system where we're 'one type'. We tend to move around when we're in good moods or bad, so for example a type 8 (me) tend to get more intellectual, analytical & reserved when we're under stress which looks like type 5, and we get big-hearted and generous and sensitive when we're happy, which looks like type 2.

Mostly the enneagram is about understanding what triggers us - ie where our hot buttons are and why. For that reason alone I've found it pretty useful over the years. I went on a 3-day workshop about it back in Feb which was hugely enlightening. Obviously it's not everyone's cup of tea. Many people get upset with 'pigeon-holing' but personally I don't think that's what's going on here. I just quoted the 'type eight' thing because I thought it might give Steve some insight. Everyone can take it or leave it though.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 24 Jun 2013, 12:10

lol - I should have expected that everyone would start doing the test!

Are we that predictable?

Interesting to see the wide range of "types" represented here, even among those who have "declared" so far. No wonder such good debate goes on here!

RevdTess · Post by **RevdTess** » 24 Jun 2013, 12:17

Tarrel wrote:
lol - I should have expected that everyone would start doing the test!
Are we that predictable?

Honestly I thought people would just go "It's one of those naff new-age online personality test thingies" and ignore it. But I guess people can't resist doing the test first and then saying how naff it is.

For what it's worth I know I'm a type 8 but that was one of my lowest scores when I did the test so I think the test is pretty rubbish myself, though the second of the free tests (http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/QUEST/quest.asp) is probably better and simpler.

Read the summaries of each type and then decide. Helps to read everyone else's type too, if you want to know how [not] to push their hot buttons...

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 24 Jun 2013, 12:24

Tess wrote:
stevecook172001 wrote:I can't deny my half of that charge Tess and so I'm not going to try. We all have our little demons and mine are a deeply ingrained and sometimes (yes, I'll admit it) overinflated problem with authority (real or imagined) and hypocrisy as I see it. I also have a knee-jerk inclination to justify and defend the actions of the otherwise weak and disenfranchised, sometimes even when there is demonstrably no defence for those actions and will take instinctive exception if I see their actions criticised from the position of anyone who has more power than them.

I'd just like to state that all of the above tendencies are born of deeply thought out and well constructed philosophical positions

I'd like to state that.

But the truth is, as is usually the case with such things, my positions are merely the result of the hidden and then re-expressed emotional and irrational psychological responses born of a set of clichéd childhood formative experiences which I do not intend to recount here.

That is all.
I have a lot of sympathy with all that because I am very similar and for similar reasons of childhood experiences leading to unhelpful emotional responses to authority - even legitimate authority. The fact that I don't often unleash it on the web is only because I learned very quickly that online text is a place where it's almost impossible to change anyone's minds - because it's so public that everyone feels obliged to defend their positions to the hilt. Also I realised that if I lose my temper online it tends to stick around more permanently which is very embarrassing if you've been working hard over the years to nurture a more gentle and forgiving spirit

You're very brave to admit your childhood wounds. Like you I get into a rage about injustice and then I get childish if people dare to disagree with me. I just instinctively know that I'm right and opponents are either idiots or bastards!

In case you're interested in such things, you've described yourself as a type 'eight' on the enneagram scale http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/typeeight.asp

Generally what 'eights' most want is autonomy for themselves and justice for others, and when we don't get it we get very angry, both with authority and with ourselves for being powerless in the face of it.

Bless you for being so honest. Appreciated. I feel like I understand better where you're coming from.

I did the quickie version of the test. A histogram of my results is below. After initially reading the type eight descriptor, I also thought it likely I would be a type eight. However, my test results disagree somewhat and I am apparently not quite as tough-minded as I would like to pretend to myself and others.

Or, then again, maybe all of the pretence was in my test responses? If so, such pretence was not done consciously. Despite the results of the test I would agree with your initial impression and would still contend that there are at least elements of my personality that are distinctly 8-ish

Type 1 *****
Type 2 *****
Type 3 *****
Type 4 **
Type 5 *****
Type 6 ***
Type 7 ******
Type 8 ****
Type 9 *

I should say, my degree was in psychology at York. I took this degree for lots of reasons, but a primary one being that I realised at a fairly early age that my personality was a bit unusual for want of better word and this realisation led to a natural curiosity about all things psychological and behavioural.

A part of the condition of the degree was that we students had to submit to a certain number of hours per year as experimental subjects in researcher’s experiments. Consequently, I had most cognitive tests done on me at one point or another on that degree. We were not always privy to the results of the tests, but I did get access to some of them. I remember one of my lecturers remarking to me that I had a very unusual combination of high extroversion coupled with off-the-scale neuroticism. That combination does strike me as being synonymous with certain aspects of a type 8 personality as described in the link you provided. I just thought I'd mention that.