Woodland for sale

snow hope · Post by **snow hope** » 28 Oct 2012, 13:22

6 acres of woodland have gone up for sale near me (1m away). The problem is that it is very strung out along a stream and follows a line that is quite steep - 1 in 5 approximately.
http://www.michael-chandler.co.uk/drumb ... mbo/212732

I haven't had a chance to view it yet as it is some way back from the road. I don't even know where there is access.

Could I ask for peoples thoughts as I have been waiting for some time to try and acquire some woodland.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 28 Oct 2012, 13:25

Extraction of the timber would be a nightmare. By UK prices it's expensive unless it had good fishing.

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 28 Oct 2012, 13:35

It's hard enough getting timber out of my wood with no vehicle access, and that would be far worse. I wouldn't like to try it there. One of my strategies was to cut and split logs in the wood, and bring out a rucksack load at a time during the daily dog walk, but there are no longer any dog walks. I reckon it would work with one load every day of the year, for a small stove heating a small well insulated space, but not for your monster house Snow.

JavaScriptDonkey · Post by **JavaScriptDonkey** » 28 Oct 2012, 19:00

Sounds like a classic 'hanger' where the miracle is that the trees manage to hang on at all.

There is usually a very good reason why such land is left as wild woodland.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 29 Oct 2012, 00:31

Catweazle wrote:Extraction of the timber would be a nightmare. By UK prices it's expensive unless it had good fishing.

I'm totally clueless about UK land prices of course but how could you ever get £60,000 of value out of fishing a half mile of stream? And then there is the woodlot which even if it has a good access in at least one season of the year will only produce something on the order of twelve cords per year of saleable wood which won't pay the interest on £60,000. The stump-age value (The property owners net) of the trees that are there ready to harvest plus £6000 would be my starting offer. Of course some fool with more money then brains will soon be the new owner.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 29 Oct 2012, 08:04

vtsnowedin wrote:
Catweazle wrote:Extraction of the timber would be a nightmare. By UK prices it's expensive unless it had good fishing.
I'm totally clueless about UK land prices of course but how could you ever get £60,000 of value out of fishing a half mile of stream? And then there is the woodlot which even if it has a good access in at least one season of the year will only produce something on the order of twelve cords per year of saleable wood which won't pay the interest on £60,000. The stump-age value (The property owners net) of the trees that are there ready to harvest plus £6000 would be my starting offer. Of course some fool with more money then brains will soon be the new owner.

You'll never get £60,000 of fish, but that's like saying you'll never get £1000 worth of pheasants from a days driven shooting. Trout streams attract a lot of money from rich people who like to fly fish.

From a wood product angle I wouldn't touch it, but other factors such as possible planning permission might be applicable.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 29 Oct 2012, 09:47

Catweazle wrote:
You'll never get £60,000 of fish, but that's like saying you'll never get £1000 worth of pheasants from a days driven shooting. Trout streams attract a lot of money from rich people who like to fly fish.

From a wood product angle I wouldn't touch it, but other factors such as possible planning permission might be applicable.

Oh I realize the entertainment value of fishing and that the food value of the fish has nothing to do with it. I just think £60,000 is way over priced for that entertainment value especially with it being only one side of the stream and no exclusive fishing rights put forth by the sales listing. But then again something is worth what it will bring on the open market so the dumbest fly fisherman in London with a seven figure trust fund or portfolio is in the drivers seat.

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 29 Oct 2012, 15:54

If you've got the cash available and nothing else to spend it on the wood won't devalue over the long term but the cash will. You can burn cash but it won't keep you as warm as the amount of wood that that cash could buy nor anywhere near as warm as the amount of woodland that the cash could buy.

If you don;t buy it, Snow, some *anker will with his ill gotten gains. but then he wouldn't know what to do with it when TSHTF. Only you can decide if you have a better use for the cash but be sure that it is the right piece of woodland to spend it on. If you're asking us for backing, perhaps you're not sure that it is the right piece.

I would certainly spend over the odds to secure the right piece of land, wooded or not.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 29 Oct 2012, 19:10

Depends what you want it for.

Looks like there may be a track access at the northern tip. Would need to verify this, and see whether you have "all purpose access" along the track.

If you're looking to transport firewood out, could you float it out?

It does seem very expensive, but I'm not familiar with Northern Ireland prices. By the BT postcode, I'm guessing it's fairly close to Belfast? If so, this would inflate the value. Proximity to your home is a big plus.

snow hope · Post by **snow hope** » 29 Oct 2012, 22:37

Thanks for your input.

No I am not at all sure about this string of land. I too feel it is over-priced, but it is the first piece of woodland I have seen offered for sale in the last few years in my local area. Hence the interest.
There is access at the North West (lower end) of the glen, which has a small stream, not a river. I think it will require further investigation and exploration if I am to be open-minded about it. But yes a lot of draw-backs. I am not even sure I would want to offer 50% of the asking price. It would not be bought with cash but some of my pension fund could be used to purchase it via a SIPP. Anybody who buys it for the asking price has more money than sense in my opinion. But beauty is in the eye of the beholder......

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 30 Oct 2012, 03:25

You can always put in a lower offer, Snow.

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 30 Oct 2012, 13:01

It's terrifically expensive...!

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 30 Oct 2012, 14:23

Sad to say, compared to York and surrounding areas, it looks positively reasonable.

I know this because I have looked

A lot.

Tarrel · Post by **Tarrel** » 30 Oct 2012, 17:57

I spent a lot of time looking at small (4-6 acre) woodland plots close to us in the south-east four or five years ago. This market seems to be dominated by the sub-dividers, such as woodlands.co.uk, who buy up sizeable tracts of woodland and then parcel it up to sell in smaller chunks. Their strategy seems to be to offer a product which, although expensive per acre, is within reach of many people (maybe through a personal loan, lump sum or some form of savings). In the end we decided to go the whole hog, buy something much bigger, relocate and change the whole lifestyle.

Going rates for these smaller plots seem to be around £7000 plus per acre at the moment. This compares with £4-5,000 when we were looking.

It strikes me that the problem someone looking for this size of plot faces, is finding someone to sell them one. You either need a sub-divider who can purchase a bigger plot and subdivide it, or you need a farmer to sell a copse or small woodland on their property. They are unlikely to want to do this because of the value the woodland provides (shelter, biodiversity, shooting potential, firewood, etc).

Buyers in the market for larger plots are in a much better position. The John Clegg website (www.johnclegg.co.uk) shows plots of 50 acres plus going for around £4000 per acre, and less than that for bigger plots.

I wonder how possible it would be for a group of people (say, some on this forum) to do a "DIY Subdivider" job. I.e. form some kind of trust to buy a larger plot at favourable rates per acre, then parcel it up and sell on the individual plots to the members at cost. You end up with a bite-sized plot at big-plot prices per acre. Alternatives to the "parcel it up and sell it on" approach would be some kind of a joint enterprise or community.

Having looked at woodlands.co.uk today, it's interesting to see how many of their plots are being marketed as having firewood potential, rather than for the amenity value which has been the case in the past.

Sorry the links are not clickable. It's a pain to do when writing on a tablet.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 30 Oct 2012, 18:19

I bought my woods at auction in 2006 for £50k, sold them on woodlands.co.uk in 2011 for £130k . That should give you an idea of where to look.