What changes can we make to our lives to deal with the economic and energy crises ahead? Have you already started making preparations? Got tips to share?
adam2 wrote:We simply dont know what will happen, will the sheeple rampage across the country devouring all in their path, or die quitely indoors ?I suspect the later outcome, they are not very mobile without petrol which is certain to be short or rapidly become short in almost any emergency.
My thoughts entirely.
adam2 wrote:A fair part of the urban underclass would probably perish in an orgy of drink, drugs, car crashes, and gang violence.
Any available petrol would probably be wasted on driving as fast as possible and celebrating the absence of policemen and speed trap cameras, rather than be used purposely to escape the cities.
I can imagine ever larger gang-ruled lawless areas in the cities, and ever better fenced enclaves of decent people. I can't imagine a migration into the countryside until every last scrap of food has gone from the cities and even then they'll stop as soon as they reach a suburb with a few tins left.
This is all distant future to me, I was more worried about what would happen to my area - full of commuters with little industry - when fuel prices cut off the work / money supply. It looked to me like I was going to end up living in a very depressed area, better to take a chance and move out now.
adam2 wrote:
We simply dont know what will happen, will the sheeple rampage across the country devouring all in their path, or die quitely indoors ?
One way or another, they will be controlled and contained by TPTB. That doesn't mean we'll be safe from them - but the bigwigs will.
Any available petrol would probably be wasted on driving as fast as possible and celebrating the absence of policemen and speed trap cameras, rather than be used purposely to escape the cities.
??? I don't think so. Reality would hit home pretty quickly. It wouldn't take long before petrol was understood to be a precious commodity.
Even a lot of petrol heads these days are driving at 70 on motorways to save fuel. People are stupid, but they're not THAT stupid.
"We're just waiting, looking skyward as the days go down / Someone promised there'd be answers if we stayed around."
Catweazle wrote:
I can imagine ever larger gang-ruled lawless areas in the cities, and ever better fenced enclaves of decent people.
"decent" =~ "wealthy"?
I imagine the wealthy will have had it away on their toes, the people who are unable to flee will be forced to choose between taking their chances in the gang-ruled areas or getting together into a mutually defended and policed zone. Possibly.
Catweazle wrote:
I can imagine ever larger gang-ruled lawless areas in the cities, and ever better fenced enclaves of decent people.
"decent" =~ "wealthy"?
Good catch there Ludwig. That hit a sour note with me to.
If society collapses to that extent decent people will clump together for mutual protection. This will result in areas where people work together, grow food, police themselves, and "badlands" where they don't.
Good catch there Ludwig. That hit a sour note with me to.
If society collapses to that extent decent people will clump together for mutual protection. This will result in areas where people work together, grow food, police themselves, and "badlands" where they don't.
The wealthy will have left long before.
.
I think the sorting out just who are the decent people from the indecent will be the tricky part. Those that are in fenced in enclaves will be the ones with the means to build and guard the fence. Decency will have very little to do with it. Just where do you think the wealthy people will depart to?
RenewableCandy wrote:Switzerland. All the mountain passes are mined. Allegedly.
To keep that sort from getting in I suppose.
Nazi officer to the Swiss general: "Really, how many Swiss could you resist us with?"
Swiss general: "At full mobilization, I can have one million men and weapons at my command."
Nazi: But what if five million troops came over the border?
Swiss: Then I and my men would fire five shots each, and go home.
vtsnowedin wrote: Good catch there Ludwig. That hit a sour note with me to.
If society collapses to that extent decent people will clump together for mutual protection. This will result in areas where people work together, grow food, police themselves, and "badlands" where they don't.
The wealthy will have left long before.
.
I think the sorting out just who are the decent people from the indecent will be the tricky part. Those that are in fenced in enclaves will be the ones with the means to build and guard the fence. Decency will have very little to do with it. Just where do you think the wealthy people will depart to?
I think the wealthy will be off to the country pretty quickly once the riots start. Those who can't leave will probably fence off both ends of their streets and defend them, this already happened in recent riots when people defended their shops and homes. If there are criminals, or maybe even shirkers, within the street I'd guess they will be ejected.
I don't know, but it's what I would do if leaving wasn't possible.
I expect that you have that about right Catweasel. Do you think the rich will find it prudent or fashionable to once again maintain a manor house in the country with a keep and the modern version of a moat. Might be quite the profitable business designing and building the security nests for them.
vtsnowedin wrote:I expect that you have that about right Catweasel. Do you think the rich will find it prudent or fashionable to once again maintain a manor house in the country with a keep and the modern version of a moat. Might be quite the profitable business designing and building the security nests for them.
I'm thinking about early indicators of the wealthy moving out. A fair bit of their wealth will be tied up in the large houses in some parts of the city. They won't be able to sell them as only the wealthy could afford them, so my guess is that we'll see more and more of them converted into flats and sold off piecemeal to the less informed or those forced to move closer to their jobs by rising transport costs. This makes the potential for trouble even worse, more people crammed into already overcrowded areas and mortgaged up to the hilt.
RenewableCandy wrote:Switzerland. All the mountain passes are mined. Allegedly.
Not the passes but the tunnels all have demolition chambers built in. These could be prepped and ready to blow on very short notice. In most cases the neccessary explosives are literally just outside the tunnel entrance.
As all serious maintainence was stopped on the roads when the tunnels were built most are of limited use now.
You'd bet that a country with no need for boundary fences on property and plenty of automatic weapons in most homes will keep out whoever they want to If that fails they've still got everybody's bullion.
SleeperService wrote: a country with no need for boundary fences on property...
so no goats in Switzerland, then ?
I was supposing (probably wrongly) that they'd let the super-rich in and then blow the roads. Otoh perhaps even they find the super-rich too anti-social, and will just keep the loot as you say
SleeperService wrote: a country with no need for boundary fences on property...
so no goats in Switzerland, then ?
I was supposing (probably wrongly) that they'd let the super-rich in and then blow the roads. Otoh perhaps even they find the super-rich too anti-social, and will just keep the loot as you say
In Switzerland generally there's no REQUIREMENT to fence your property at all. Fields are enclosed for livestock obviously I used to deliver into Switzerland and was told that only the forgeiners felt the need to enclose themselves. Apparently if locals object and there's no real need the fence/wall would have to be removed.
Where there are walls needed they are built in moats so they are a security rather than privacy measure.
Would you want a country full or super rich who've accelerated TEOTWAWKI? I don't think the Swiss would either
If that fails they've still got everybody's bullion.
I used to deliver into Switzerland and was told that only the forgeiners felt the need to enclose themselves. Apparently if locals object and there's no real need the fence/wall would have to be removed. 