Current Gold Price

[Snail]

When I look at the gold price and especially the silver price, I can't believe there's not manipulation going on. Sites like moneyweek admit there's probably 'management' happening but they don't go into details. Maybe so much paper pms are being sold which pushes the price down? So TPTB and their cronies can buy it cheap. Paper stuff fails.

Like Ludwig, I think that TPTB will eventually replace the financial system we have now with a new one. Which is one way to deal with impossible debt, take care of China, and impoverish the masses.

If PMs are being manipulated, does that make gold a better or worse investment I wonder? Silver only £18.70/oz and predicted to fall further.

[Oxenstierna]

If PMs are being manipulated, does that make gold a better or worse investment I wonder? Silver only £18.70/oz and predicted to fall further.

That's what I'm wondering.

I'd agree with Ludwig and Snail that there is some probably serious manipulation of the markets going on. It seems counter-intuitive that in a week that has seen Euro-turmoil and an alleged bank run in Latvia that the gold price should be down. What, if not gold and silver, are people putting their money in?

That said, I don't think we can underestimate what a minority interest precious metals are. I know plenty of people who have a *lot* more money in the bank than me who look upon my fascination with the shiny stuff as mere eccentricity.

[Ludwig]

I am convinced that there are long-standing plans in place for dealing with a post-PO world.

There may be plans but I have little faith in any large scale, pro-active response happening (a good response or a bad one). "Dealing with a post-PO world"? We can barely 'deal' with the pre-PO world. Post peak everyone's ability to do stuff reduces. That includes our leaders. In short I don't subscribe to the narrative of a future where some individuals are dramatically empowered and are able to enact significant national scale plans. That's simply not how collapse works.

I suppose I was being too elliptical: what I was suggesting is that, unlike the leaders of previous collapsing civilisations, our leaders have the technology to wipe out human beings - not just in foreign countries but also in their own countries - who are surplus to requirements. I think there might be quite clever ways of doing this without (most) people even realising it is being done.

I don't believe TPTB have any fundamental interest in enacting "national scale plans" except in the interest of their own security. I would guess that many of them already have plans to sail away to remote places in (with a view to climate change) high latitudes.

Just the other day Max Keiser on his show on RT was commenting on how the idea of power residing in the nation state is obsolete. The trappings of the nation state are still there, but the real power is with a relatively small trans-national network of string-pullers.

I don't think this is just paranoid speculation: there is evidence for it, and it is logical.

[UndercoverElephant]

If PMs are being manipulated, does that make gold a better or worse investment I wonder? Silver only £18.70/oz and predicted to fall further.

That's what I'm wondering.

I'd agree with Ludwig and Snail that there is some probably serious manipulation of the markets going on.

Of course there is. The price of gold, and especially silver, is going to be the final battleground in this global monetary crisis.

[JavaScriptDonkey]

If PMs are being manipulated, does that make gold a better or worse investment I wonder? Silver only £18.70/oz and predicted to fall further.

That's what I'm wondering.

I'd agree with Ludwig and Snail that there is some probably serious manipulation of the markets going on.

Of course there is. The price of gold, and especially silver, is going to be the final battleground in this global monetary crisis.

On the other hand maybe institutions that foresee an imminent liquidity problem are dumping their gold positions into cash positions to make very sure that they can meet their obligations that must be paid in X currency.

At the big dog level of investment gold is just another commodity.

[Lord Beria3]

http://etfdailynews.com/2011/12/15/gold ... j-iau-ego/

If you’re concerned about where gold prices (NYSEARCA:GLD) are headed after yesterday’s (Wednesday’s) bear-market buzz, don’t be. This is just a brief pit-stop in what continues to be an epic bull-run for the yellow metal.
Gold prices fell below $1,600 an ounce Wednesday for the first time since October, settling down nearly 5% at $1,586.90 an ounce Comex division of the New York Mercantile Exchange (NYMEX). That’s below the closely-watched 200-day moving average for the first time since January.

There are a few reasons for this slump: Panic over the Eurozone and its weakening currency, banks’ need for cash, and year-end profit-taking have all taken their toll on gold this week.

Still, while gold prices may be stumbling right now, they are not headed for a long-term bear market – not even close. In fact, it’s something our own gold and global resources specialist predicted months ago.

Money Morning Global Resources Specialist Peter Krauth said as far back as August that gold prices were due for a pull-back, so this minor blip isn’t surprising – and it definitely isn’t permanent.

“This is something I saw coming,” said Krauth. “Back in late August, as gold was pushing $1,900, I told my subscribers it was due to pull back, and likely to trade in a range between $1,600 and $1,800, and that’s exactly what we’ve seen so far. We could see a bit more weakness, but I think we’re much closer to a bottom at this point.”

Here’s why.

A Weak Euro and the Scramble for Cash

One of the biggest factors contributing to lower gold prices is the Eurozone and its increasingly weak currency. The euro fell Wednesday to $1.2998 against the dollar, its lowest level since January. That forced many traders into the dollar.

“As investors flee the euro, the “risk off’ trade means they’re falling back on the U.S. dollar,” said Krauth. “A higher U.S. dollar, in turn, means lower gold because gold is priced in U.S. dollars.”

Krauth said Europe’s economic turmoil has forced the region’s banks to hunt for more cash, which has led to more gold leasing transactions, further pressuring the precious metal’s price.

“European commercial banks are desperate for cash,” said Krauth. “They could well be “borrowing’ central bank or other sourced gold to lend out simply to raise cash temporarily. Interestingly, gold lease rates just spiked back up on Dec. 7, the very same day we started that recent bout of gold price weakness.”

Investors’ year-end scramble to get their hands on more cash also has triggered massive selling. After poor portfolio performance this year, investors and fund managers wanted to take profits and beef up cash holdings, while others needed cash to make margin calls.

According to a recent Reuters asset allocation poll, global portfolio managers held more cash in November than at any time during at least the last seven years.

Update on the gold situation.

I would take advantage of this correction in gold and silver as prices will rally hard in 2012.

I intend to get a bit more silver at these amazingly cheap prices!

[alternative-energy]

Some of you may find this presentation interesting.
http://papermoneycollapse.com/2011/12/a ... -collapse/

This Austrian economist and former bond trader with Merril Lynch and JP Morgan thinks currency collapse is inevitable without the occurrence of peak oil. The question remains when do the general population lose faith in the Country’s money system?

[RenewableCandy]

the technology to wipe out human beings - not just in foreign countries but also in their own countries - who are surplus to requirements. I think there might be quite clever ways of doing this without (most) people even realising it is being done.

The flu-jab season is with us once again. The "weak and vulnerable" are being encouraged to avail themselves. Mistakes can be made with batches of pharmaceuticals. Just saying, like.

[Lord Beria3]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-12-2 ... ities.html

Looks like the next few months could be a wild ride for the global markets as various euro nations lurch towards default and banking meltdown.

I expect gold to see high volitibility with quite possibily lurches lower in price but paradoxically, if I am right in expecting at least one PIIGS nation to default with a run on the banks, a massive rush of demand into physical gold (and a lesser extent silver) as confidence in keeping your wealth in the banks collapse in parts of Europe.

Even if the paper futures market is going down as speculators liquidate their long gold positions to make up on massive losses in other parts of their portfolio.

At some point, the ECB will have to start monetising on a massive scale to avoid a collapse of the financial system and this multi-trillion injection of funny money into the system should lead to a rocketing increase in gold and silver, particularly if inflation starts to spiral out of control.

So to sum up, in the short term I would not be surprised if prices of gold and silver carry on going down but at some point next year, (probably after April-May 2012) expect to see a massive rise in the value of gold and silver.

[RenewableCandy]

...high volitibility...

more Vodka, Tovarisch?

[clv101]

From August:

I'm aiming to by some more gold within the next 4 weeks, but will wait for a correction back below £1000 as Faber recommends. This will probably be the last time to buy before it shoots up to $2000 by the end of the year.

Is this an official Lord Beria3 prediction? $2000 gold by the year end? We shall see.

I guess the world doesn't always pan out how our good Lord predicts! In fact the price is now lower than the point he predicted a ~20% gain.

[Oxenstierna]

Gold closes 9.04% up on last year. The FTSE 100 closes -5.06% on last year.

As long as no-one bought gold during its September high-point then I think overall it's been a much better investment than anything else I can think of.

Credit to Lord Beria for being generally right. I'm glad I've listened to him.

If I thought he could predict exact figures, I'd be messaging him privately for tomorrow night's Lottery numbers.

[Lord Beria3]

Cheers Oxenstierna

For all the recent doom and gloom on the subject of gold, it is still UP 9.04% on the year - not many assets can claim that this year.

As for the $2000 not being reached, I put my hands up on that, but to be fair it came pretty close around $1930 in the third quarter. So not so wrong after all.

[Lord Beria3]

http://kingworldnews.com/kingworldnews/ ... _2012.html

Egon von Greyerz continues:

“But this is all a thin paper market, we have not seen one single physical seller of gold or silver at these prices. So it’s just manipulation and panic in a paper market at the year end. Of course, it’s easy for anyone who wants to intervene to push the price down even further in a thin market. So I think that’s what’s happening and I wouldn’t worry the slightest bit.

Gold is up for the year in all currencies and 2012 will be another fantastic year. I could see the first three to five months (of 2012) being dramatic. You know the financing requirements worldwide are just mind-boggling. We’re talking about trillions here if you combine sovereign, corporate and bank requirements. The requirements are so high they just have to start printing money and they will.

The combination of strong buyers (physical) at these lower levels and the fact that we will see massive money printing, starting next year, will lift gold and silver very quickly in my view....

When asked how close we are to that massive money printing, von Greyerz stated, “I think we are extremely close because the banking system will not survive without it and governments know that. They have to do it (print).

There are already covert actions happening. The ECB is already printing money covertly and so is the Fed. But it will soon become official in my view and the amounts will be much greater than (anything) we’ve seen so far.”

When asked where he sees gold heading in 2012, von Greyerz responded, “I wouldn’t be surprised to see several thousand dollars (for gold), let’s say between $3,000 and $5,000 next year. I see that as the next move and fundamentally everything supports that.”

I totally agree with this analysis. i think gold will hit $3000 and possibly £5000 in 2012 - current prices around $1500.

I also think that physical gold should hit $5000 even if the paper future trade keeps it lower next year. At some point the gold market will get taken over by the physical and prices will rise massively.

[clv101]

First weird gold story of 2012?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16392922