http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-13052309
"There is no question people become overweight because the eat more food than they need. [...] Prevention strategy alone has proved ineffective; there are at least two generations of morbidly obese patients who are now presenting with diabetes, stroke, heart disease and cancer for whom preventative measures are utterly irrelevant."
Jon
UK large-scale study on the impact of weight-loss surgery
Moderator: Peak Moderation
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Aurora
We went through this one before. The biology of obesity is very complicated. Its not just a case of making an effort to eat less. There is still lots of debate about what exactly is a healthy diet and the mainstream dietary advice is being increasingly questioned (essentially, its the carbohydrates that are the problem in obesity and related disorders, not the fats).
As well as perhaps there being misinformation about what is a good diet, junk food has addictive properties for many folk.
So, I wonder if all these major operations are really necessary in order to help people. We should make a bit more effort to find a more natural approach, I think.
As well as perhaps there being misinformation about what is a good diet, junk food has addictive properties for many folk.
So, I wonder if all these major operations are really necessary in order to help people. We should make a bit more effort to find a more natural approach, I think.
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emordnilap
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Aurora and goslow: I think you're both on the nail there. There has to be a targeted (ie, every individual is a new case) approach combined with a little more personal responsibility.
People could start by not buying food that's heavily advertised.
On top of this, I believe the food industries should have to jump many more hoops to be allowed to sell their products. For all their whining and complaining, they bear a significant part of the responsibility.
People could start by not buying food that's heavily advertised.
On top of this, I believe the food industries should have to jump many more hoops to be allowed to sell their products. For all their whining and complaining, they bear a significant part of the responsibility.
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
Obesity pandemic
Agreed with all of the above.
Jon
Jon
I inadvertently discovered how to keep weight down about 8 months ago.
Eat less of everything
I had a mouth infection which was wrongly diagnosed and thus developed into a very severe infection which destroyed all my sense of taste. It took three months and regular visits to a specialist before the infection was cleared BUT my sense of taste is only slowly returning.
Eating was an ordeal and I lost over 2 stone fairly rapidly by which time I knew I had to eat regardless as I was never much overweight anyway.
I am now so much more aware of what I am eating and getting real pleasure from some foods now that a little taste is returning. I am far more discerning about my food and am optimistic that the depth of flavour will return eventually.
Eat less of everything
I had a mouth infection which was wrongly diagnosed and thus developed into a very severe infection which destroyed all my sense of taste. It took three months and regular visits to a specialist before the infection was cleared BUT my sense of taste is only slowly returning.
Eating was an ordeal and I lost over 2 stone fairly rapidly by which time I knew I had to eat regardless as I was never much overweight anyway.
I am now so much more aware of what I am eating and getting real pleasure from some foods now that a little taste is returning. I am far more discerning about my food and am optimistic that the depth of flavour will return eventually.
Grid connected Proven 6kW Wind Turbine and 3.8kW Solar PV
Horizontal Top Bar Hives
Growing fruit, nuts, vegetables and a variety of trees for coppicing.
Horizontal Top Bar Hives
Growing fruit, nuts, vegetables and a variety of trees for coppicing.
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Aurora
<rant> Frankly, I'm sick and tired of hearing about the problems of the 'overweight'.
A large gentleman, for want of a better description, was featured on a recent TV program and during the course of the interview went on to blame his excessive weight gain on the delay in receiving a gastric band.
Christ! Talk about a blame culture!
The next time you enter a supermarket, take a long hard look around you.
These days, you can't fail to notice the correlation between the size of a person and the contents of their shopping trolley. Little or no fresh fruit, vegetables or fish. Instead of wholesome, nutritious, natural food, what do you find? Pre-packed, microwaveable ready meals, crisps, chocolate, beer, carbonated and/or still drinks with a high sugar content, cakes, biscuits and sweets. Has everyone lost the ability to cook?
The next step is a trip to your local surgery, where it's difficult to find a seat in the waiting room amongst all of the 'moaning fatties' queuing up to be treated for diabetes or to insist upon their rights to a gastric band.
Many people currently in receipt of incapacity benefit are confined to a wheelchair because they are overweight. Many more, require the support of carers or nursing staff. Most, if not all, are 'entitled' to blue badge parking concessions.
emordnilap wrote:
If not, then the NHS should have the right to charge any patient whose self indulgence (caused by excess food, alcohol, tobacco or illicit drug use) has led them to require treatment or surgery.
2) Why buy any high fat, high sugar products? Over the past twenty years there have been any number of public awareness campaigns about the perils of a poor diet. There are no excuses for not exercising and eating healthily.
3) The food industry is driven by a handful of powerful corporations. No attempt at legislation will change the way they manufacture their products and they will continue to resist any legislation by browbeating any politician who dares to stand against them.
I don't doubt that there are some folk out there with a proven medical condition which causes them to be overweight. However, I still can't help thinking back to the fifties and early sixties - a period when it was a rare sight to see anyone overweight, let alone obese.
What's changed?
The availability of cheap 'junk' food? Yes perhaps, but the overwhelming cause is a lack of personal responsibility. Hardly a surprise really when you realise that a vast majority of the sheeple in the UK have joined their American cousins in worshipping at the alter of consumerism coupled with a twisted perception of morality that would put an alley cat to shame.
</rant><tin hat on>
A large gentleman, for want of a better description, was featured on a recent TV program and during the course of the interview went on to blame his excessive weight gain on the delay in receiving a gastric band.
Christ! Talk about a blame culture!
The next time you enter a supermarket, take a long hard look around you.
These days, you can't fail to notice the correlation between the size of a person and the contents of their shopping trolley. Little or no fresh fruit, vegetables or fish. Instead of wholesome, nutritious, natural food, what do you find? Pre-packed, microwaveable ready meals, crisps, chocolate, beer, carbonated and/or still drinks with a high sugar content, cakes, biscuits and sweets. Has everyone lost the ability to cook?
The next step is a trip to your local surgery, where it's difficult to find a seat in the waiting room amongst all of the 'moaning fatties' queuing up to be treated for diabetes or to insist upon their rights to a gastric band.
Many people currently in receipt of incapacity benefit are confined to a wheelchair because they are overweight. Many more, require the support of carers or nursing staff. Most, if not all, are 'entitled' to blue badge parking concessions.
emordnilap wrote:
1) There has to be a LOT MORE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.There has to be a targeted (ie, every individual is a new case) approach combined with a little more personal responsibility.
People could start by not buying food that's heavily advertised.
On top of this, I believe the food industries should have to jump many more hoops to be allowed to sell their products. For all their whining and complaining, they bear a significant part of the responsibility.
If not, then the NHS should have the right to charge any patient whose self indulgence (caused by excess food, alcohol, tobacco or illicit drug use) has led them to require treatment or surgery.
2) Why buy any high fat, high sugar products? Over the past twenty years there have been any number of public awareness campaigns about the perils of a poor diet. There are no excuses for not exercising and eating healthily.
3) The food industry is driven by a handful of powerful corporations. No attempt at legislation will change the way they manufacture their products and they will continue to resist any legislation by browbeating any politician who dares to stand against them.
I don't doubt that there are some folk out there with a proven medical condition which causes them to be overweight. However, I still can't help thinking back to the fifties and early sixties - a period when it was a rare sight to see anyone overweight, let alone obese.
What's changed?
The availability of cheap 'junk' food? Yes perhaps, but the overwhelming cause is a lack of personal responsibility. Hardly a surprise really when you realise that a vast majority of the sheeple in the UK have joined their American cousins in worshipping at the alter of consumerism coupled with a twisted perception of morality that would put an alley cat to shame.
</rant><tin hat on>
Perhaps if people had to buy their own healthcare, and so were monetarily rewarded for not wasting it.....
Just heart disease costs the NHS £250 per person every year.
You can get a gym membership for less than that.
I'm rather, rotund, at the moment, but I just cant conceive of how much I would have to eat to double my weight.
Just heart disease costs the NHS £250 per person every year.
You can get a gym membership for less than that.
I'm rather, rotund, at the moment, but I just cant conceive of how much I would have to eat to double my weight.
I'm a realist, not a hippie
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emordnilap
- Posts: 14815
- Joined: 05 Sep 2007, 16:36
- Location: here
Because it's addictive?Aurora wrote:2) Why buy any high fat, high sugar products?
I have a friend who is a true chocolate addict. A full bar every day or beware all around.
She's a normal weight and size. Oh, she's practically vegan. That definitely helps.
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
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Kentucky Fried Panda
- Posts: 1743
- Joined: 06 Apr 2007, 13:50
- Location: NW Engerland
I've put some weight on in the last 3 weeks. My excuse is I'm recovering from surgery, not a gastric band. Soon as I'm back at work I'll be back to my normal weight.
I was watching the BBC and they were telling us that they had saved 100 or so people from type 2 diabetes. Thus saving the NHS from having to provide treatment for the illness.
Personally, the obese are just another tier above the infirm during a die-off situation.
I was watching the BBC and they were telling us that they had saved 100 or so people from type 2 diabetes. Thus saving the NHS from having to provide treatment for the illness.
Personally, the obese are just another tier above the infirm during a die-off situation.
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Aurora
To my knowledge the standard dietary advice for some time has been to follow a Mediterranean diet, i.e. fruit, veg, nuts and fish.goslow wrote:I do agree with a lot of what Aurora is saying. Except, just to re-iterate that the standard dietary advice of the last 30 years has probably contributed to the problem, and the addictive nature of junk food requires a more thoughtful approach than "just stop eating that".
As for the 'addictive' nature of junk food, why not just stop at once? It's called 'cold turkey' and all it takes is will power together with a sense of personal responsibility.