Why the cuts are good...

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 01 Jan 2011, 16:51

This year is when the cuts will bite and expect a wave of self-interested groups and individuals living of the taxpayer screaming about how this cut is the cut too far and so on.

Nonsense. The goverment will be spending MORE in 4 years time than it is now.

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/break ... b&state=UK

2010: Total Spending = £669 billion

2014: Total Spending = £724 billion

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/break ... b&state=UK

Remember the year 2000, was it a Third World nightmare? No, we had public services and all the other perks of a developed industrial society. Check out total spending in 2000...

Total Spending = £344 billion

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/break ... b&state=UK

Public spending has nearly DOUBLED in ten years! Some of that is inevitable, like growing healthcare costs as more old people survive but surely within the context of hundreds of extra billions on public spending, there is room for FAR more cuts than those planned on certain departments (not health or education) by this coalition government.

By 2015 our public net debt would have exploded to £1,284 billion and we will be spending around £63 billion a year on interest alone.

Far more severe cuts across the board must surely come by the second half of this decade - whoever is in power, to reduce this interest burden and reduce our overall national debt.

In 2011, we are expected to pay £43 billion on interest and our overall debt is £932 billion.

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/break ... b&state=UK

These figures are stark realities of our financial situation and why those cuts are necessary and good for the country. Bring it on

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 01 Jan 2011, 17:43

So tell me, LB3, why are cuts in public spending more desirable than cuts in private spending?

frank_begbie · Post by **frank_begbie** » 01 Jan 2011, 19:32

Once its gone it won't come back.

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 01 Jan 2011, 19:48

I discovered today that Rome fell within 12 months of the last Corn Dole being closed. But really, history's in the past, innit?

Lord Beria3 · Post by **Lord Beria3** » 01 Jan 2011, 20:28

Public spending is derived from the private sector. When the public sector gets too large it starts to crowd out the private sector.

Public sector cuts leads to a healthier private sector.

This is economic not political old chap.

Mean Mr Mustard · Post by **Mean Mr Mustard** » 01 Jan 2011, 20:52

When the corporate finance/ insurance / real estate sector gets too large and parasitic, it crowds out essential services which underpin society as a whole.

eatyourveg · Post by **eatyourveg** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:04

Mean Mr Mustard wrote:When the corporate finance/ insurance / real estate sector gets too large and parasitic, it crowds out essential services which underpin society as a whole.

It doesn't crowd them out. It takes them over. At a price, which not everyone may be able to afford.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:09

And how do most OECD countries, which have larger public sectors than the UK, manage?

nexus · Post by **nexus** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:16

Mean Mr Mustard · Post by **Mean Mr Mustard** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:18

eatyourveg wrote:
Mean Mr Mustard wrote:When the corporate finance/ insurance / real estate sector gets too large and parasitic, it crowds out essential services which underpin society as a whole.
It doesn't crowd them out. It takes them over. At a price, which not everyone may be able to afford.

Especially in years to come, that's very true. After the teaser low-bid / low upfront cost but long term contract commits the spending. Be interesting to see how some of these 25-40% budget cuts will actually impact, given that so much is ring fenced in long term contracts with the vaunted and always flexible private sector. What's left now is the services not already cherry picked because money can't be made from it.

30 year PFI deals will surely fail, especially given what we know about our long term prospects...

Totally_Baffled · Post by **Totally_Baffled** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:36

Below are the % of GDP spent on the public sector by country.

Britain doesnt do so bad.

Even in 2014 with spending at £724 billion and a GDP circa £1.477 trillion (2009's GDP and with 2% growth for 2010 - 2014 as an assumption), public sector spending remains at 49%, which is still more than countries like Germany and roughly 40th spot in the world.

Gives some perspective I think to those claims of public sector armageddon...

LOL look at America!!

Country GE as % GDP
1. Iraq 87.3
2. Cuba 81.4
3. Slovakia 66.2
4. Timor 65.5
5. Romania 65.5
6. Moldova 63.4
7. France 61.1
8. Seychelles 60.3
9. Hungary 59.1
10. Guyana 58.8
11. Czech Republic 58.8
12. Sao Tome 58.3
13. Sweden 58.1
14. Denmark 58.1
15. Iceland 58.1
16. Malta 57.9
17. Qatar 57.2
18. Kuwait 56.1
19. Belgium 56
20. Norway 55.8
21. Uzbekistan 55.6
22. Colombia 55.3
23. Italy 55.3
24. Netherlands 54.7
25. Austria 54.3
26. Finland 54.2
27. Portugal 54.1
28. Lesotho 53.8
29. Libya 53
30. Belarus 52.9
31. Cyprus (no Turk-adm) 52.6
32. Ukraine 52.1
33. Yemen 50.9
34. Greece 50.7
35. Brunei 50.5
36. Georgia 50.4
37. UK 50
38. Bosnia/Herzegovina 50
39. Bulgaria 49.9
40. Swaziland 49.9
41. Germany 48.8
42. Malawi 48.2
43. Canada 48.2
44. Latvia 47.7
45. Jordan 47.6
46. Egypt 47.5
47. Spain 47.3
48. Slovenia 47.1
49. Ghana 47
50. Croatia 46.8
51. New Zealand 46.6
52. Oman 46.5
53. Estonia 45.8
54. Zambia 45.4
55. Papua New Guinea 44.9
56. Angola 44.8
57. Namibia 44.2
58. Azerbaijan 43.9
59. Lithuania 43.9
60. Jamaica 43.9
61. Lebanon 43.7
62. Zimbabwe 43.7
63. Israel 43.6
64. Australia 43.6
65. West Bank/Gaza 43.4
66. Algeria 43.1
67. Uruguay 43
68. Serbia 42.8
69. Ireland 41.5
70. Venezuela 41.1
71. Saudi Arabia 40.4
72. Congo, Republic 39.2
73. Burundi 39.1
74. Turkey 39.1
75. Bahrain 38.6
76. Switzerland 37.8
77. Mozambique 37.7
78. Luxembourg 37.5
79. Kazakhstan 37.2
80. Vietnam 36.9
81. Rwanda 36.7
82. Trinidad/Tobago 36.3
83. Botswana 35.9
84. Macedonia 35.9
85. Syria 35.5
86. Peru 35.3
87. Cape Verde 34.4
88. Eritrea 34.1
89. South Africa 33.9
90. Kenya 33.6
91. Tajikistan 33.4
92. Mongolia 33.3
93. Indonesia 33.2
94. Malaysia 32.8
95. Gambia 32.4
96. Belize 32.1
97. Senegal 31.5
98. Bolivia 31.3
99. UAE 31.3
100. Kyrgyzstan 31.1
101. Dominican Rep. 31
102. Iran 31
103. Japan 30.9
104. Gabon 30.7
105. Morocco 30.7
106. Sri Lanka 29.5
107. South Korea 29.3
108. Chile 29.1
109. Madagascar 28.3
110. Panama 28
111. Pakistan 28
112. Albania 27.9
113. Burkina Faso 27.7
114. Uganda 27.6
115. Tunisia 27.4
116. Mexico 26.7
117. Paraguay 26.4
118. Nepal 26.3
119. Nicaragua 26
120. Ecuador 25.8
121. Honduras 25.6
122. Aruba 25.6
123. Togo 25.3
124. Benin 24.8
125. Tanzania 24.6
126. Nigeria 24.1
127. Equatorial Guinea 23.9
128. Sudan 23.3
129. Congo, Dem. Rep. of 22.9
130. Thailand 22.8
131. El Salvador 22.5
132. China 22
133. Ethiopia 21.8
134. British Virgin Islands 21.5
135. Cote d'Ivoire 21.4
136. Poland 21.2
137. Taiwan 21.2
138. Mauritius 21.2
139. Laos 21
140. Guinea 21
141. Russia 20.9
142. India 20.4
143. Chad 19.9
144. US 19.9
145. Cameroon 19.1
146. Argentina 19.1
147. Armenia 17.8
148. Philippines 17.7
149. Brazil 17.3
150. Hong Kong 17
151. Guatemala 16.7
152. CAR 16.6
153. Costa Rica 16.5
154. Haiti 16.4
155. Singapore 16.3
156. Bahamas 16
157. Cambodia 13.3
158. Bangladesh 12.8
159. Turkmenistan 9.6
160. Afghanistan 9.2

frank_begbie · Post by **frank_begbie** » 01 Jan 2011, 21:44

The sooner the better when peak oil really gets a grip, then we can go back to what really matters "survival of the fittest".

Rather than all this bullshit of politics and statistics than nobody really understands.

Mean Mr Mustard · Post by **Mean Mr Mustard** » 01 Jan 2011, 22:28

Right now, we're fighting a vicious cancer. But Beria thinks this is a good thing, as he thinks we're a little overweight, and could do with losing a few pounds.

http://golemxiv-credo.blogspot.com/2010 ... in-us.html

Edittid four speling

johnhemming · Post by **johnhemming** » 01 Jan 2011, 22:31

Where I have a problem with the Green Party position is their belief that in a world of constrained resources we can spend more on public services.

Energy constraints affect both the public and private sectors of the economy.

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 01 Jan 2011, 22:38

With PO, climate change and the collapsing financial system, I think it's inevitable that we need cuts, as there may well not be the money around to keep public spending at the present level in the future. My concern is that the wrong things are being cut, and things are being privatised that need to either remain in the public sector, or be sold to people and organisations whose aim is to do good, rather than to make money.