Immigration cap threatens £100m wind turbine project

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 21 Sep 2010, 06:23

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 84734.html

So what does the "kick em all out" brigade make of that then?

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 21 Sep 2010, 07:47

It's the good face of global industries. Capitalism sees borders as a restraint on trade, restricting the most efficient use of resources. The free movement of goods and labour is central.

ziggy12345 · Post by **ziggy12345** » 21 Sep 2010, 07:50

And the use of cheap labour from outside the EU is central to the profits of the company.

biffvernon · Post by **biffvernon** » 21 Sep 2010, 07:55

Yes, and it results in a transfer of wealth from the rich to the poor that vastly exceeds any transfers associated with development aid.

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 21 Sep 2010, 09:09

Perhaps we should be asking why after 13 years of a Labour government we have a shortage of skilled engineers in this country. We have plenty of social workers, who can't do their jobs properly, plenty of government ... workers?, plenty of Media Studies specialists, what ever they do, but a shortage of engineers, doctors and nurses; people we have to bring in from abroad.

We have to steal those badly needed skilled people from the poor countries that have spent any cash they can get to train their own people, only to lose them to a rich nation which can't be bothered to train enough of their own. The vast majority of people trying to get into the UK are unskilled people and we have enough of them already because of the failure of our education system.

The sort of people GE are after are people with experience in the wind turbine industry. Had Labour not been so enamoured exclusively with the finance, I don't like to call it industry, sector we might have sought to retain a wind turbine manufacturing capability here. Unfortunately the industry was not sited in a Labour constituency so it was expendable.

Totally_Baffled · Post by **Totally_Baffled** » 21 Sep 2010, 09:51

The other point is that contadino makes a strawman argument by stating that those concerned about immigration want to "kick them all out".

It isn't about that at all, we will always need immigration in the UK, and they are very welcome.

The argument is that do we really need 200,000 per year net of emmigration?

With shortages in all sorts of public services(before the cuts), along with 4.2 million already on housing lists, desalination plants for the south east of England etc etc etc etc etc. This level of immigration is just not practical!

I don't think many people believe that we do.

Yes, and it results in a transfer of wealth from the rich to the poor that vastly exceeds any transfers associated with development aid.

If you are concerned about the uneven global distribution of wealth, perhaps Biff you could take a lead and sell up and evenly distribute yours?

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 21 Sep 2010, 10:08

TB, I suggest you read the comments below the article. People with a far better knowledge than I (and I suspect you too) have answered those points.

jonny2mad · Post by **jonny2mad** » 21 Sep 2010, 10:23

Well how many people can the uk feed without cheap fossil fuels.

I went to a talk this year where they worked out england had 10 MILLION to many people, thats even turning the entire country into vegans and using the best methods they could think of with similar calories to a wartime diet .

But hey we need diversity we need to bring more people into a already unsustainable lifeboat so more can starve .

And I'd agree with kenneal, we could train engineers here but no we take them and other skilled people from developing country's

Totally_Baffled · Post by **Totally_Baffled** » 21 Sep 2010, 10:30

contadino wrote:TB, I suggest you read the comments below the article. People with a far better knowledge than I (and I suspect you too) have answered those points.

hi Contadino

I have read the comments and there seems to be a mixed bag of views there.

Which ones are you refering to? (just so I understand your point correctly)

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 21 Sep 2010, 11:23

I was referring to the replies by Tom547 to comments.

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 21 Sep 2010, 11:24

jonny2mad wrote:Well how many people can the uk feed without cheap fossil fuels.

I went to a talk this year where they worked out england had 10 MILLION to many people, thats even turning the entire country into vegans and using the best methods they could think of with similar calories to a wartime diet .

But hey we need diversity we need to bring more people into a already unsustainable lifeboat so more can starve .

And I'd agree with kenneal, we could train engineers here but no we take them and other skilled people from developing country's

Yeah, I think it's a 3-day course to train a wind turbine engineer. Just train up some kids off the street.

woodpecker · Post by **woodpecker** » 21 Sep 2010, 11:47

Well I'm seeing no Comment content at all. (latest version of Firefox on Mac)

woodpecker · Post by **woodpecker** » 21 Sep 2010, 11:54

ziggy12345 wrote:And the use of cheap labour from outside the EU is central to the profits of the company.

Most of the overseas labour I meet in London is US, Canadian, Australian, New Zealand, and (big boom in last 5 years) South African. With a tiny smattering of technical people from South Asia (the latter sometimes shipped over in teams and put up in a shared flat in the City, to work crazy hours when they are not sleeping). The explosion in North American and Oz people in London in the last decade or two has been enormous. Twenty years ago there would be one US consultant on a team, making USD200k p.a. paid in Switzerland. Now they are falling over each other... Many of them tell me they live in places like South Ken and Notting Hill - the sort of places I could never afford.

Totally_Baffled · Post by **Totally_Baffled** » 21 Sep 2010, 13:54

contadino wrote:I was referring to the replies by Tom547 to comments.

lol I have read his comments several times now, and I am still undecided on whether his comments back your arguments or mine!

He seems to be saying that the 'unskilled masses' that people object to cannot get in because of the points system.

In other words, all the migrants coming to the UK ( that would mean 200,000 a year net on average, for the last 10 years) are skilled, and are required to fill skills shortages.

I find this very difficult to believe, thats 2,000,000 skilled workers in 10 years, or roughly 10% of the entire UK workforce.

This is on top of the fact that we are constantly told that migrants are required to do all the jobs that the lazy arse British won't do.

So which is it??

Something doesn't stack up?

contadino · Post by **contadino** » 21 Sep 2010, 14:02

I find the 200k net that you're referring to difficult to believe. Could you provide a source?