Earth heading for 5 billion overpopulation?

Forum for general discussion of Peak Oil / Oil depletion; also covering related subjects

Moderator: Peak Moderation

User avatar
Lord Beria3
Posts: 5066
Joined: 25 Feb 2009, 20:57
Location: Moscow Russia
Contact:

Earth heading for 5 billion overpopulation?

Post by Lord Beria3 »

Going to provide two startling different enterpretations of the above, first from the Optimum Population Trust and secondly a commentary from a extremely eccentric website which has been surprisngly accurate at times on geopolitics.


http://www.optimumpopulation.org/releas ... 6Mar09.htm

NEWS RELEASE
March 16 2009
EARTH HEADING FOR 5 BILLION OVERPOPULATION?
Conference to discuss sustainable population levels

A conference next week will attempt to answer a question that has fascinated scientists for centuries but has now taken on a new urgency – how many human beings can the Earth support?

With the earth’s population growing by around 80 million - a new Germany - each year, the Optimum Population Trust has assembled a distinguished group of experts to discuss the scientific case for lowering global and national populations to environmentally sustainable levels.

Speakers include: Tim Dyson, professor of demography at the London School of Economics; Prof. Andrew Watkinson, former director of the Tyndall Centre for Climate Change Research; Robin Maynard, campaigns director of the Soil Association; John Guillebaud, emeritus professor of family planning and reproductive health at University College, London; Prof. Chris Rapley, director of the Science Museum; Jonathon Porritt, chair of the Sustainable Development Commission; and Sara Parkin, founder-director of Forum for the Future and former co-chair of the Green Party.

Climate change, growing food shortages, the projected peaking of oil and gas supplies and the growth of international migration have focused renewed attention on population growth, with senior figures from both Labour and Conservative parties speaking recently of the need for population policies and leading figures in the green movement, including James Lovelock, author of the Gaia theory, warning of the dangers of overpopulation.

Lovelock agrees with many other commentators that the environmental crises facing humanity in the 21st century will significantly reduce the earth’s carrying capacity. He has said this could shrink the world’s sustainable population to 500 million - 1 billion, compared with a current total of 6.8 billion.

The Dutch inventor of the microscope, Antony van Leeuwenhoek, is thought to have been the first to estimate the maximum number of people the earth could support: in 1679 he put it at 13.4 billion. Since 1950 there have been many estimates of global carrying capacity, ranging from 0.5 billion to 1,000 billion. Based on ecological footprint and biological capacity data which have become available over the last decade, OPT estimates the world’s sustainable population currently at five billion and the UK’s at 18 million (the UK’s actual current population is 61 million).

However, these figures are predicated on present levels and patterns of consumption. Greener lifestyles in the UK could push up its sustainable population; by contrast, if the world as a whole grows richer and consumes more, this will reduce the planet’s carrying capacity. If present trends continue, by 2050, when the UN projects world population will be 9.1 billion, there will be an estimated five billion more people than the Earth can support.

The subject of global and national carrying capacity generated much interest among ecologists and biologists in the 1960s and 1970s but until recently was out of favour, along with the population issue as a whole. In 1969, for example, the Royal Geographical Society held a symposium on The Optimum Population for Britain with an audience of mainly professional biologists. With the UK’s population then standing at 54 million, 90 per cent of participants thought the optimum population for Britain had already been exceeded.

David Nicholson-Lord, OPT policy director, said: “With global and UK population rising so fast, there is an urgent need to bring the issue of sustainable populations to the top of the political agenda. The Conservative leader, David Cameron, has said we need a ‘coherent strategy’ to address population growth and last autumn the immigration minister, Phil Woolas, said the UK needed a population policy. It’s high time the parties turned these words into action.

“We also hope the conference will help dispel the myth that big is good in relation to population and that population decline is a sign of national failure. In terms of quality of life and sustainability, the most ‘successful’ nations are generally the smallest. And what is arguably Britain’s most creative period – the era that produced Shakespeare – came at a time when her population was probably five million at most, a twelfth of today’s numbers. In population terms, small is not only beautiful: it works well too.”

The conference, Environmentally Sustainable Populations: The scientific case for population policy - and ways of achieving sustainability, will be held at the Royal Statistical Society on March 26.
http://www.larouchepub.com/pr/2010/1007 ... study.html
British Royals Behind New Depopulation Scheme
July 16, 2010 (EIRNS)—The Royal Consort, Prince Philip. and the hare-brained heir apparent, Prince Charles, have long advocated the reduction of the world's population from its level today of 6.8 billion, to less than 2 billion backward peasants to maintain the British Empire's control of the world. Now, the British Royal Society has started a policy group entitled "Population And The Planet" that will advocate radical genocide similar to that called for by Prince Philip's WWF.

The policy group announced on "World Population Day," July 11, is, according to the Royal Society release, intended to study "the role of global population in sustainable development," and to look at "the implications of population decreases, as well as increases that are predicted in different parts of the world." The study is scheduled to be completed by early 2012, "to coincide with the point at which the world's population is expected to exceed 7 billion."

Not surprisingly, three of the 23 panelists come from the 20-year-old Optimum Population Trust, which first surfaced in a big way at the Copenhagen Climate Change Conference arguing that the solution to the genocidal climate-change hoax was the reduction by 5 billion people, who would consume less of the world's resources. Prince Charles is a "patron" of this genocidal group.

Thus, Prince Charles' long-time advisor and friend, Sir Jonathan Porritt, who is also on the board of OPT, has been selected as a panelist. Like Charles, Sir Jonathan has a loathing for non-organic food, because it is cheaper and more plentiful, and can halt mass starvation. Apart from Sir Jonathan, there are on the panel two other OPT members, including Sir David Attenborough, who argues that mankind's growth is killing wildlife and insects, and the sooner man is extinct, the better. And, there is OPT patron Partha Dasgupta, who is a professor of Economics at Cambridge University.

Chairing the panel is Sir John Sulston, chair of the Institute for Science, Ethics & Innovation, and head of the eugenicist Human Genome Project.

Demographers have noted that population replacement in high-level consumption areas of the world is declining, with growth only in poverty stricken Africa, where there is high infant mortality. One recommendation that the OPT panelists are likely to present to the Royal Academy, writes Dominic Lawson in the Independent July 13, is their Popoffsets program, whereby high consumption areas of the world would give aid for their higher C02 usage to Africa to help in family planning programs, rather than toward global development. According to Oxfam PopOffsets "if their [OPT] arguments were based on logic alone, the population lobby would probably be advocating euthanasia rather than birth control, but its preponderance of elderly white male members makes that pretty unlikely."

Not so. Prince Philip, who founded the WWF with the former Nazi intelligence officer, the late Prince Bernhard of the Netherlands, is fully in favor of euthanasia and other forms of genocide
In case, you that that is fantastic nonsence;

1) "Human population growth is probably the single most serious long-term threat to survival. We're in for a major disaster if it isn't curbed...We have no option. If it isn't controlled voluntarily, it will be controlled involuntarily by an increase in disease, starvation and war." - HRH Prince Philip, interview "Vanishing Breeds Worry Prince Philip, But Not as Much as Overpopulation", People Magazine, Dec. 21, 1981

2)
The Dutch government knew of the SS membership of the late Prince Bernhard as early as 1944, according to NRC Handelsblad.

The newspaper bases its finding on documents released by the National Archive in The Hague earlier this year. One of the documents refers to a coded telegram, dated September 1944, from Foreign Minister Eelco van Kleffens. The telegram reveals the cabinet knew Prince Bernhard had briefly joined the SS but suspected he had been unable to avoid doing so, "possibly in order to prevent something worse". In the telegram, the foreign minister instructs the Dutch ambassador in the United States not to refute claims, made by American media as of 1941, that Prince Bernhard had been a member of the SS.


Until now, it was not clear if the Dutch cabinet knew such allegations had any basis in fact. For many years Prince Bernhard remained evasive on his links with the Nazi NSDAP party and related organisations. In an interview with De Volkskrant, published shortly after his death in December 2004, the prince admitted to his SS membership for the first time. He always denied having belonged to the NSDAP.
http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/cabin ... ds-ss-past
Peace always has been and always will be an intermittent flash of light in a dark history of warfare, violence, and destruction
User avatar
Lord Beria3
Posts: 5066
Joined: 25 Feb 2009, 20:57
Location: Moscow Russia
Contact:

Post by Lord Beria3 »

Mike Ruppert concurs with both the overpopulation thesis by billions and the covert ruthless means in which the ruling circles will use to 'cull' the human herd.

Now, i have had problems with MR at times with his short-term predictions, but i have never questioned the longer term thesis which he outlines. Its startling how accurate he's been since he started writing on Peak oil back in 2000.

http://www.shtfplan.com/emergency-prepa ... e_06052010
Re the population bubble - that’s one of the more interesting things Ruppert has talked about. Even if you ignore the possibility of already passing peak oil, the simple exponential increase in human population over the last 150 years or so does raise an interesting scientific point - it seems that most, if not all, systems experience some sort of collapse at some point after seeing such an increase.
Are we overreacting? Only time will tell. I’ll say this much though - my philosophy is “prepare for unforeseen consequences.”
and
There are only two great bubbles on this planet left to go. The Chinese bubble and the human population bubble. And after the Chinese bubble goes the human population bubble goes.
I think that the weapon of choice for the most ruthless elements within the globalised power-elite will be gene-specific virsuses.

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/w ... ic_p1.html
[Since the attacks of 9-11-01 there has been a great deal of discussion and speculation as to whether or not gene-specific bioweapons might be used as a weapon of war or, in the gloomiest of scenarios, as an instrument of global population reduction to alleviate the inevitably drastic consequences of Peak Oil. FTW asked radio public affairs producer and investigative journalist Kellia Ramares to take a critical look at whether such weapons actually exist. While not definitively establishing that such weapons do exist, Ramares had documented, in chilling detail, both their scientific feasibility of such weapons and the fact that many nations have been actively pursuing them for some time. - MCR]
But in 1996, Dr. Vivienne Nathanson, the British Medical Association's (BMA) Head of Science and Ethics told a congress of the World Medical Association that ethnically targeted genetic weapons were now possible, and she cited as example the possibility of designing an agent that could sterilize or pass on a lethal hereditary defect in specific ethnic groups.24
More information in the following articles, if you are interested.

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/w ... ic_p2.html

In terms of depopulation targeted regions/countries, agroterrorism, by covert state actors, would be a logical choice. Perfect deniability as well.
Agroterrorism: The Likely First Case Scenario

The first genetic weapons are likely to be aimed, not at humans, but at agriculture. This is because so much more is known about plant and animal genetics through years of work sequencing their genomes and because modern agriculture has developed genetically uniform crops, which could be more easily attacked than people. Agricultural genetic weapons could also have a similar effect on a people as a direct genetic weapon, by wiping out many of the food sources of a geographically concentrated ethnic group.

Dr. Mark Wheelis, a microbial biochemist and geneticist at the University of California Davis, focuses his research on the history of biological warfare, and on biological weapons control. He sees anti-agricultural bioweapons as being within the reach, not only of states, but also of agricultural corporations, organized crime, terrorist groups and individuals.59

According to Wheelis, reasons to attack agriculture would include: attacking the food supply of an enemy belligerent; destabilizing a government by initiating food shortages or unemployment; altering supply and demand patterns for a commodity, or commodity futures, and for other manipulations and disruptions of trade and financial markets.60

An agricultural bioattack would be easier to carry out than one directly against humans because there are many plant and animal diseases that humans could disperse without harming themselves by handling the bioagents. Fields have little or no security. If the goal is an economic one, such as to disrupt trade, the creation of only a few cases may be necessary to require the quarantine or destruction of a region’s crops or animals.61 One example of the havoc an agricultural disease can wreak on farm economies occurred in England in 2001, when over the course of 9 months, 5.7 million animals were slaughtered at a cost of 2.7 billion pounds after an outbreak of foot and mouth disease.62
I have always thought that the powers-to-be will orchestrate a gradual powerdown through unpleasant and not so unpleasant means in the coming decades. The top circles of financial power are fully aware of peak oil and its challenge to their wealth, power and positions.
“A total world population of 250-300 million people, a 95% decline from present levels, would be ideal.”
Ted Turner, in an interview with Audubon magazine
In order to stabilize world population, we must eliminate 350,000 people per day. It is a horrible thing to say, but it is just as bad not to say it.”
J. Cousteau, Explorer and UNESCO Courier
National Security Memo 200, dated April 24, 1974, and titled "Implications of world wide population growth for U.S. security & overseas interests," says:

"Dr. Henry Kissinger proposed in his memorandum to the NSC that "depopulation should be the highest priority of U.S. foreign policy towards the Third World." He quoted reasons of national security, and because `(t)he U.S. economy will require large and increasing amounts of minerals from abroad, especially from less-developed countries ... Wherever a lessening of population can increase the prospects for such stability, population policy becomes relevant to resources, supplies and to the economic interests of U.S.
"If I were reincarnated I would wish to be returned to earth as a killer virus to lower human population levels" (Prince Philip Duke of Edinburgh, leader of the World Wildlife Fund, quoted in "Are You Ready for Our New Age Future?" Insiders Report, American Policy Center, December 1995).
Peace always has been and always will be an intermittent flash of light in a dark history of warfare, violence, and destruction
contadino
Posts: 1265
Joined: 05 Apr 2007, 11:44
Location: Puglia, Italia

Post by contadino »

You really do have a bee in your bonnet about killing lots of other people, don't you.
cubes
Posts: 725
Joined: 10 Jun 2008, 21:40
Location: Norfolk

Post by cubes »

I have always thought that the powers-to-be will orchestrate a gradual powerdown through unpleasant and not so unpleasant means in the coming decades. The top circles of financial power are fully aware of peak oil and its challenge to their wealth, power and positions.
"The powers that be" don't know shit. I doubt many of them still know what peak oil really is, let alone planning for the future.

Even if they are planning a 'controlled' die off - there will be many factions of them competeing with each other for power. At the end of all the struggles there wouldn't be an elite left to rule over anyone (at least, not the current elite).
eatyourveg
Posts: 1289
Joined: 15 Jul 2007, 17:02
Location: uk

Post by eatyourveg »

Personally I do believe there are groups of severely maladjusted psycho's out there who are in positions of great power and/or influence who do see it as being in their best interests to thin things out a little.

However, I really don't think that ultimately what they think or do matters much, as a species, we have now managed to stack the cards so heavily against our own survival that is inevitable that something, or more likely, an accumulation of somethings will do the job very nicely without further help.

That isn't to say that these f***ed up A type psycho's won't start the thing, they just won't finish it. Nature will.
User avatar
clv101
Site Admin
Posts: 10551
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Contact:

Post by clv101 »

eatyourveg wrote:Personally I do believe there are groups of severely maladjusted psycho's out there who are in positions of great power and/or influence who do see it as being in their best interests to thin things out a little.
There's not really such a thing as 'the powers that be'. There are no controllers - what we see is emergent properties of a complex system. No one is in charge.
Guest

Post by Guest »

EDIT
Last edited by Guest on 14 Mar 2011, 17:44, edited 1 time in total.
eatyourveg
Posts: 1289
Joined: 15 Jul 2007, 17:02
Location: uk

Post by eatyourveg »

clv101 wrote:
eatyourveg wrote:Personally I do believe there are groups of severely maladjusted psycho's out there who are in positions of great power and/or influence who do see it as being in their best interests to thin things out a little.
There's not really such a thing as 'the powers that be'. There are no controllers - what we see is emergent properties of a complex system. No one is in charge.
I didn't say that these people are in charge. But there are those who gather in groups in ALL strata of society and attempt to impose their will on others by fair means or foul, either because they genuinely believe it is for the greater good, or for their own good and sod everyone else (chocolate anyone).
Various Megacorps fall into the latter category, by their very structure they must behave sociopathically, and absolutely not for the greater good. The people who run these organisations are selected for their sociopathic traits or they would not be in charge.
User avatar
biffvernon
Posts: 18538
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Location: Lincolnshire
Contact:

Post by biffvernon »

Yes, but... Megacorps do better if they have a large rich population to sell their stuff to. It's in their interest to look after their potential customers.
eatyourveg
Posts: 1289
Joined: 15 Jul 2007, 17:02
Location: uk

Post by eatyourveg »

biffvernon wrote:Yes, but... Megacorps do better if they have a large rich population to sell their stuff to. It's in their interest to look after their potential customers.
Yes, but... Megacorps are the vehicle through which these nutters achieve there aims. Their aims being to have things just as they personally want them, whether you or I agree is simply not factored in other than as a challenge to be overcome. In other words, we, the 'consumers', are financing our own doom - it has been successfully sold to us by megalomaniacs hell bent on having things just so for their own means.
I do not believe the NWO stuff, but I do believe there are disparate groups with aims that roughly concur, that can give the appearance of something more organised. As the general population will generally take a soft option every time, that is how it is sold to us.
User avatar
biffvernon
Posts: 18538
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Location: Lincolnshire
Contact:

Post by biffvernon »

Hmm.. I'm not so sure that 'these nutters' are all they're cracked up to be. I prefer Chris's idea of emergent properties of a complex system. It's nice to blame 'them' but maybe that's just scapegoating. The real villains of the piece are all those who go shopping. Us.

Just another inconvenient truth.
User avatar
emordnilap
Posts: 14815
Joined: 05 Sep 2007, 16:36
Location: here

Post by emordnilap »

biffvernon wrote:The real villains of the piece are all those who go shopping. Us.
+1
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
User avatar
clv101
Site Admin
Posts: 10551
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Contact:

Post by clv101 »

And why recessions are good news.
User avatar
Totally_Baffled
Posts: 2824
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Location: Hampshire

Post by Totally_Baffled »

Good article in the new scientist this week, 30% of all the worlds grain is fed to cattle, only 10% of the calories from grain are fed to humans, the rest is wasted.

This is on top of 40%-50% of all food thrown away.

Im with Chris on this one, its not about human numbers its about behaviour or consumption behaviours.
TB

Peak oil? ahhh smeg..... :(
MacG
Posts: 2863
Joined: 24 Nov 2005, 11:09
Location: Scandinavia

Post by MacG »

clv101 wrote:
eatyourveg wrote:Personally I do believe there are groups of severely maladjusted psycho's out there who are in positions of great power and/or influence who do see it as being in their best interests to thin things out a little.
There's not really such a thing as 'the powers that be'. There are no controllers - what we see is emergent properties of a complex system. No one is in charge.
I agree 100% with this description.
Post Reply