How hardcore are your preparations?

the_lyniezian · Post by **the_lyniezian** » 27 Dec 2009, 18:18

Diddley squit really so far, unless its trying to get my aunts to get energy saving light bulbs? I think I am probably the worst culprit in our family, anyway.

Anyway, partly due to my beliefs going all "survivalist" is something I wonder is really necessary. Trusting in the Lord rather than the food store or the price of gold, and learning to live more with less is probably a better bet. Now if only I could do it...

the_lyniezian · Post by **the_lyniezian** » 27 Dec 2009, 18:19

I'm not denying that other preparations (especially changing lifestlyes to depend less on oil and other energy reserves/materials) is not worthwhile. Of course it is.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 27 Dec 2009, 22:37

the_lyniezian wrote:Diddley squit really so far, unless its trying to get my aunts to get energy saving light bulbs? I think I am probably the worst culprit in our family, anyway.

Anyway, partly due to my beliefs going all "survivalist" is something I wonder is really necessary. Trusting in the Lord rather than the food store or the price of gold, and learning to live more with less is probably a better bet. Now if only I could do it...

The Lord helps those who help themselves. Which is a good way of saying that there won't be any help coming from "above". Prepare or starve, there are millions of good Catholics starving to death in Africa because some preaching fool told them that contraception was a sin and that the Lord would provide. Well, call me Thomas, but I just can't see what those kids did that deserved a lingering starvation.

Prepare, prepare, prepare, then share your new knowledge with as many people as you can. You can make a difference - when the wheels fall off you can show people how to survive. Five fishes won't do squat for five thousand people in reality - but five fruit trees can make a difference, five hundred fruit trees can make a lot of difference.

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 27 Dec 2009, 23:27

the_lyniezian wrote:I'm not denying that other preparations (especially changing lifestlyes to depend less on oil and other energy reserves/materials) is not worthwhile. Of course it is.

I have this theory that "Go forth and multiply, and replenish the Earth" has been the subject of a catastrophic misunderstanding, and that He was actually talking about planting trees...

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 28 Dec 2009, 04:06

RenewableCandy wrote:......"Go forth and multiply, ...

God was, I seem to remember from school bible studies, a bit p***ed off with Adam and Eve at the time and perhaps the translation is a bit on the polite side. He may be regretting losing His temper now as they, and we, have taken His words literally.

PaulS · Post by **PaulS** » 28 Dec 2009, 17:32

We are squarely at 1 and beyond, if you count Transition and local resilience.

I have decided we needed to do that within two months of learning about PO and we sold our house, rescued our pension and bought a small farm within 10 months of that - back in August 2005.

Another month or two and we will be there - self sufficiency in food and energy, including transport.

Btw, by self sufficiency I don't of course mean that we make or build every damn thing, from house to shoe laces. I mean we produce enough of essentials that we can trade or barter for whatever we need.

Post by **mikepepler** » 01 Jan 2010, 09:02

We're at 2 I think, having bought the woodland a couple of years ago, as well as having emergency supplies and equipment at home.

the_lyniezian · Post by **the_lyniezian** » 05 Jan 2010, 16:05

Catweazle wrote:
the_lyniezian wrote:Diddley squit really so far, unless its trying to get my aunts to get energy saving light bulbs? I think I am probably the worst culprit in our family, anyway.

Anyway, partly due to my beliefs going all "survivalist" is something I wonder is really necessary. Trusting in the Lord rather than the food store or the price of gold, and learning to live more with less is probably a better bet. Now if only I could do it...
The Lord helps those who help themselves. Which is a good way of saying that there won't be any help coming from "above". Prepare or starve, there are millions of good Catholics starving to death in Africa because some preaching fool told them that contraception was a sin and that the Lord would provide. Well, call me Thomas, but I just can't see what those kids did that deserved a lingering starvation.

First off, I'm more evangelical Protestant in my leanings so I'm hardly in agreement with most of the policies of the Catholic church, and especially their views on contraception. (Caveats are of course that there are some in the evangelical community who suggest that since children are a blessing from the Lord, then large families are a good idea- though that might be in the context of Biblical times!- also that we're neglecting albeit natural methods of birth control like the rhythm method or breastfeeding kids up to several years old like some hunter-gatherer tribes, and that I am a tad skeptical of over-population arguments as the whole problem of poverty etc.).

But I am in disagreement that "God helps those who help themselves" in this context is true or a valid argument. It implies that either there is no actual God, or that God takes no active part in the world; moreover it ignores that some people cannot help themselves. Not only is the Bible full of examples of miraculous divine provision, but there are many more modern examples. (For example Hudson Taylor, pioneer miusssonary to China in the 19th century, never solicited donations, rather waiting for God to move peoples' hearts to provide funds. He was not disappointed, and neither were many others following his example. There was also a story I read once concerning some Russian Jews who converted to Christianity, and later had to flee to China when the Communists came to power- and how god guided them and provided for them miraculously in the face of hardship.)

(Now to get back to the main topic...)

Prepare, prepare, prepare, then share your new knowledge with as many people as you can. You can make a difference - when the wheels fall off you can show people how to survive.

As I said I wholeheartedly agree. To be fair, what I meant was a lot of the things like the option in the poll talking about things like investing in gold or stashing food anticipating some pending crash, rather than how properly to survive in a post-oil world. (Reading about things like how the US Government during the Depression ordered people to give up their gold, not to mention that its value is not altogether reliable, and having anything stored up- even food if times are desparate- is a definite magnet for thieves). Also is the question of what one is preparing for. Gradual decline? Short-term emergencies (e.g. if wars break out in the Middle East or elsewhere)? Leaner times? Total societal meltdown? How soon? What I do know is that is wrong for us simly to expect to keep going living in the lifestyle many of us in the developed world are accustomed to, and that society at large must prepare for when oil or other finite resources become scarce- as a member of that society we are all responsible to play some part.

Five fishes won't do squat for five thousand people in reality - but five fruit trees can make a difference, five hundred fruit trees can make a lot of difference.

No doubt true to some extent, but all I am saying is that it is probably foolish to rely soleley on human effort, nor that those five fish cannot become more if the one who created the fish in the first place is involved, and the need is great.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 05 Jan 2010, 22:45

the_lyniezian wrote:No doubt true to some extent, but all I am saying is that it is probably foolish to rely soleley on human effort, nor that those five fish cannot become more if the one who created the fish in the first place is involved, and the need is great.

I'm putting my faith in Aliens bringing clean power to Earth, but just in case they're late I'm growing fuel and food.

eatyourveg · Post by **eatyourveg** » 05 Jan 2010, 23:20

Catweazle wrote:
the_lyniezian wrote:No doubt true to some extent, but all I am saying is that it is probably foolish to rely soleley on human effort, nor that those five fish cannot become more if the one who created the fish in the first place is involved, and the need is great.
I'm putting my faith in Aliens bringing clean power to Earth, but just in case they're late I'm growing fuel and food.

+1 Catweazle.
These aliens by the way, don't suppose that the pre-condition for all that lovely clean power is that we all have to accept brain implants that boost the long term planning section of our brains is it? That would be good.

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 06 Jan 2010, 00:37

What if the aliens are already here, and running the government, big business, the banks and the media? They're dumbing the rest of us down (well most of us anyway) so we won't put up a fight when they take over completely!

RogueMale · Post by **RogueMale** » 06 Jan 2010, 02:16

JohnB wrote:What if the aliens are already here, and running the government, big business, the banks and the media? They're dumbing the rest of us down (well most of us anyway) so we won't put up a fight when they take over completely!

Is this what they're planning for us?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtInaXXzqlA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8eJfdGFswY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4hGAd7mWOg

Joking apart, it's likely that there are no other intelligent civilizations in the galaxy. Doubtless there were others in the past, and will be others in the future. But if the galaxy were teeming with intelligent life now, they'd already have made contact: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox. They haven't, and we in turn won't, and here's probably why: http://www.well.com/~davidu/onechance.html.

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 06 Jan 2010, 08:56

RogueMale wrote:it's likely that there are no other intelligent civilizations in the galaxy

No other intelligent civilizations!!!!!! Where is this intelligent civilization then, it's not on this planet

emordnilap · Post by **emordnilap** » 06 Jan 2010, 11:05

RogueMale wrote:Joking apart, it's likely that there are no other intelligent civilizations in the galaxy. Doubtless there were others in the past, and will be others in the future.

Shurely you mean the universe? The galaxy's small for other life to be guaranteed within it. But otherwise I agree, especially in the future, after we've gone.

RogueMale wrote:But if the galaxy were teeming with intelligent life now, they'd already have made contact: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox. They haven't, and we in turn won't, and here's probably why: http://www.well.com/~davidu/onechance.html.

The universe is hardly likely to be 'teeming' but my money is on life existing. Neither of those theories eliminate the chance of life - which is far more important than any contact between them, devastatingly amazing though that would be.

Post by **adam2** » 06 Jan 2010, 12:25

Catweazle wrote: I'm actually pretty confident that I could feed my family on what I can grow or shoot and I have been thinking up designs for a communal boiler system from which I could sell heat to, say, 5 of my neighbours.

Sounds an interesting idea, but remember that you will need an off grid electricity supply for pumping, since gravity circulation is most unlikely to work over such distances.
A wind turbine and battery bank is the obvious choice with steam power perhaps worth considering.
I would advise against counting on shooting small game etc, since such is liable to be in very short supply in the event of SHTF.