PowerSwitch

Having just read Greg Palast's book - The Best Democracy Money Can Buy (which you all should read if you have the time or inclination) an interesting quote about Michael Meacher (that ex environment minister who keeps changing his mind about whether this issue is serious or not) is in it. The quote is from 1998, I believe, by a Derek Draper, then a lobbyist but once apparently Chief aide to the 'Dark Prince' (then minister without portfolio (had he left it somewhere)) Peter Mandelson (the one who put's the ideas into Tony's head). The quote goes like this: "There is an environment minister, Michael Meacher. He's very weak and basically he's irrelevant and nobody should have to take him into account. To be honest with you, he's a nobody going nowhere, so I wouldn't particularly sort him out. I don't think he'll be in a job much longer". Maybe Mr Meacher isn't the best bet for raising awareness of this issue then!
Palast gives the impression that New Labour are (or were - this is a few years ago, but littles changed in their approach) pretty much void of any real ideology themselves but rely on big business to lobby them to produce their 'ideologies' - basically the more you pay the more likely they'll come round to your point of view. Apparently a bribe is not classed as a bribe by the home office 'if the cash is "renumeration" for services performed' - Work that one out! So there you have it, unless someone in the PO crowd wins the lottery we've no chance in influencing the current Government, democracy exists but your vote counts for more if your the Chairman of a multinational with a few quid in your pocket! Just think we can swap this lot for David Cameron at the next election, another upstanding individual, who will no doubt see the light and lead us to salvation! Me thinks not - buy your lifeboat now cause with leaders like this were all doomed - unless, that is, there's a third way!!

jev wrote:... - buy your lifeboat now cause with leaders like this were all doomed - unless, that is, there's a third way!!

I just have to say that there IS a third way. It is called the Green Party and the way is through policies based on principles of sustainability.
A lot more than just a bunch of environmentalist tree-huggers they have evolved into a serious political/social philosophy that provides a genuine 'third way' - support them and vote for them, its the only hope you have in the political system.

RogerCO wrote:I just have to say that there IS a third way. It is called the Green Party and the way is through policies based on principles of sustainability.
A lot more than just a bunch of environmentalist tree-huggers they have evolved into a serious political/social philosophy that provides a genuine 'third way' - support them and vote for them, its the only hope you have in the political system.

Lucky you. Here in Sweden the Green Party is a bad joke. They have lost all contact with the underlying issues and are fully satisfied with enjoying the political process.

Oh I agree completely Roger - if we could convince the whole of the country that for the good of mankind we need to completely alter our form of consumptive living and revert to a system where we live a much more sustainable form of existence, things in the long run would no doubt be much more stable and better for all. Unfortunately humans in my experience are hellishly greedy! In order to try and get this argument over you are 'fighting' the current system of world governance which has enormous recourses at its disposal to 'convince' the bulk of the population that the form of life we are currently experiencing is how things should be. Whilst things carry on as ?normal? getting this message across in a major way will be near impossible as most people couldn?t give a monkey about what?s going on around them until it affects them directly ? this is as a result of the selfish, unthinking society that those with the bulk of the resources in their hands have developed through their laws, media, advertising etc, etc over the years. Once people (and that is likely to include you and me as well) actually start being affected by future problems then they will start to take interest, however I would imagine the major response won?t be call?s for a new form of sustainability but a call for our governments/corporations to seek out what we need to keep this show on the road, there?s more money in it for those in control of resources this way than if they held their hands up and admitted we need a major rethink of how our economies work. Most people fail to see the bigger picture and short term thinking is highly in vogue. A good example of this is today?s Independent, which has a glaring headline talking about energy problems - ?fuel costs are rising, energy reserves are dwindling and industry faces a power shortage? ? so what do they finish the headline with, nothing more than a short term quote ?are we heading for a new winter of discontent??. Another utter failure to see the bigger, long term picture! Maybe unfortunately I am a bit of a realist who believes that when you are in effect fighting against a system (that is so likely to be leading the world into a major ecological catastrophe, as things stand at the moment) with so much power, currently you?ve got pretty much zero chance of waking up even a small amount of the population to the potential benefits that would surely lie in a much more low key, sustainable form of existence. Call me pessimistic but I really can?t see a major political force emerging to take peoples best interest to heart simply due to the power of the media in affecting peoples thoughts and beliefs ? that box in the corner of the room keeps a lot of people from truly thinking for themselves and convinces them things will carry on pretty much as they are. Allied to that is that most people are actually living very comfortable lives that they enjoy and don't want to give it up. Having said that life sometimes has a funny way of throwing up surprises, so you never know! Also MacG?s response is quite valid as it is so often the case that when political parties, who originally had a clear vision and belief, start to get nearer to power they ?have to? (hate that phrase!) in effect start selling out and watering down their beliefs to appeal to a larger audience. Politicians generally believe in doing things that will appeal to big business (who convince us, through the media that these policies are for our benefit etc) these days than having unquestionable beliefs and values that they believe in. Our ?Labour? party is a perfect example of a party that bases its policies around what business and to a lesser degree people want, whilst having no real core belief ? other than staying in power ? to its name. Best wishes to you both.

jev wrote:Another utter failure to see the bigger, long term picture!

I wouldn't say its a failure to see the bigger picture, but maybe a reluctance to report on it. The Independent has run several stories on climate change recently and has mentioned PO (albeit rather incoherently) in a recent pull-out. It's a sad refelction of the state of the British press that the best newspaper out there effectively has to censor itself by sticking to the same mainstream stories as everyone else and differentiate itself purely on editorial bias (or lack thereof) so it can maintain its relatively modest circulation in order to guarantee further advertising revenues. Or maybe its a sad refelction on the state of the readership...

I kinda agree with jev. I attended a seminar here in Denmark on the government energy strategy for the next 20 years. The gov has no vision, they think the market forces will solve any problems. They even showed some very optimistic prediction curve for the oil price. Needless to say that it was totally unrealistic. During the seminar, none of the speakers mentioned PO. Since I am no danish speaker, I remained shy and listened with growing despair at how illiterate these people are.

I have no real solution that could awake concern in the majority. Some people are even welcoming the global warming because they say it's gonna be nice to have warmer winters with lighter heating bills. The thing they don't understand is that most of Denmark could be under water if all pole's ice melts. Truly depressing. My action is to write to everone I know and convince each person to do the same. The internet is still quasi-free and that's where my hope lies. As long as it is powered, there's a chance to touch millions of people directly.

The other thing we could do is to boycott all political elections. What would happen if every citizen did that ? We need to show that we the citizens are fed up or even against the actual political joke. We need actually to redefine how politics should be done. But that's a very tough issue.

thorgal wrote:We need to show that we the citizens are fed up or even against the actual political joke. We need actually to redefine how politics should be done. But that's a very tough issue.

Some are actually doing that very thing, thorgal.

See the links below:

I looked up the link you suggested. I sent a message asking if this was international or restricted to the UK. I live in DK, and I'm afraid (although not certain) that this is not known at all here.

It's international alright:

www.simpol.org

I don't think there's a Danish language version yet, though.