Industrial Society Destroys Mind and Environment

[vtsnowedin]

Nice typo A million tears, indeed.

Yes quite! Comes from sitting on the smoky side of the camp fire.

[raspberry-blower]

Latest from Automatic Earth is very prescient for this thread:

The way we have built our communities, our towns and cities, is predicated upon maximizing energy use, even if we’re not always aware of that. Most people, to do something as mundane as grocery shopping, need to drive or be driven. Our homes need huge amounts of energy to be heated and cooled. These things are all as unnecessary as they are fixable. As is the transport of millions of tons of goods from all over the planet that we could just as well produce ourselves. And perhaps most importantly, we all surround ourselves with things we don’t need; even if we discount the poorest people, we’re like 5 billion squirrels on steroids. Because once we have access to all those energy slaves, we don’t want to let go of them, we think they make us happy.

Is there really a solid reason, apart from our religious adherence to the equally religious gospel of growth beyond infinity, that would keep us from taking a step back? Are we capable of recognizing the folly of our ideas, and of choosing a different path? That is not an easy question to answer. We certainly are as individuals, but as a group, as a society, different rules apply. Scaling down would collapse our economies, since they depend on ongoing growth – and energy use -. It would also collapse our political systems, which for better or for worse are integral parts of the organization of our societies. This probably means we’re not going to get anywhere in any scaling down efforts if as individuals we stay where we are, if that is a typical American or British or continental European community. Which in turn means most people may switch a light bulb or get a less inefficient vehicle, but that’ll be it, and they’ll stay put. And help David Price’s predictions along.

Debt Rattle: How to Redress the Planet's Energy Balance

[raspberry-blower]

Can't help feeling uncomfortable with the idea of 'Mindfulness' which is hitting the headlines big time as the panacea for the ills of modern life. If we can just live in the moment and let anxieties about the past and the future drift through our minds we will generally feel happier. Something like that. I first came across the idea with Eckhart Tolle's 'The Power of Now' and I was an immediate convert.

It seems to me, though, that there is a problem. By seeing an individual's state of anxiety, depression or insecurity as a personal 'sickness' we let the villain of the piece off the hook. Shouldn't we take to task free-market industrial capitalism which puts material growth above all else and measures success by GDP taking no account of personal well-being?

Mindfulness: Is it the Answer?

[lancasterlad]

Saw Ruby Wax's Sane New World Tour. She talked about mindfulness and had found it useful in her own life. The forum won't let me post what I want but take a look at her website at http://www.rubywax.net/

[emordnilap]

We had a 'tropical' storm last night, 19/5/2014, around 8:30 pm. I am talking a deluge, with short-interval thunder and lightning, which went on for around an hour or possibly more - I forget, I was entranced by it. Nature does that sometimes.

The power went off, as is usual in these situations. It's still off now, fourteen hours later. It made me realise how much easier it is to have no power in May, with its higher temperatures and long daylight hours. It's barely an inconvenience. But during winter? Give me fire.

[emordnilap]

Latest from Automatic Earth is very prescient for this thread:

The way we have built our communities, our towns and cities, is predicated upon maximizing energy use, even if we’re not always aware of that. Most people, to do something as mundane as grocery shopping, need to drive or be driven. Our homes need huge amounts of energy to be heated and cooled. These things are all as unnecessary as they are fixable. As is the transport of millions of tons of goods from all over the planet that we could just as well produce ourselves. And perhaps most importantly, we all surround ourselves with things we don’t need; even if we discount the poorest people, we’re like 5 billion squirrels on steroids. Because once we have access to all those energy slaves, we don’t want to let go of them, we think they make us happy.

Is there really a solid reason, apart from our religious adherence to the equally religious gospel of growth beyond infinity, that would keep us from taking a step back? Are we capable of recognizing the folly of our ideas, and of choosing a different path? That is not an easy question to answer. We certainly are as individuals, but as a group, as a society, different rules apply. Scaling down would collapse our economies, since they depend on ongoing growth – and energy use -. It would also collapse our political systems, which for better or for worse are integral parts of the organization of our societies. This probably means we’re not going to get anywhere in any scaling down efforts if as individuals we stay where we are, if that is a typical American or British or continental European community. Which in turn means most people may switch a light bulb or get a less inefficient vehicle, but that’ll be it, and they’ll stay put. And help David Price’s predictions along.

Debt Rattle: How to Redress the Planet's Energy Balance

"We're in the service of entropy" initially gives the impression that nature sees the future, which is wrong but it does make you think. This is much better: "the evolution of Homo sapiens is merely a transient episode that acts to redress the planet’s energy balance". I can get that. If there's energy, some random evolutionary event(s) will lead to its exploitation.

Good article, though how can philosophy compare with stuff????

[RenewableCandy]

Philosophy is funny stuff
you'd think by now we had enough.
And yet the fact remains, I fear,
we make more of it every year!

(with apologies to whoever wrote the original, which was about history.)

[Atman]

We had a 'tropical' storm last night, 19/5/2014, around 8:30 pm. I am talking a deluge, with short-interval thunder and lightning, which went on for around an hour or possibly more - I forget, I was entranced by it. Nature does that sometimes.

The power went off, as is usual in these situations. It's still off now, fourteen hours later. It made me realise how much easier it is to have no power in May, with its higher temperatures and long daylight hours. It's barely an inconvenience. But during winter? Give me fire.

This also happened in Somerset, with lightning of biblical proportions which lit up the whole sky, accompanied by an hour long deluge. Is this our future in the UK? I see the weather becoming more and more unpredictable and extreme.

[RenewableCandy]

We must draw the obvious conclusion: God hates cider.

[emordnilap]

But, but, but we drink very little cider here in the west of Ireland.

[RenewableCandy]

He was aiming at Somerset. You lot were just "Collateral damage"

[sushil_yadav]

.
Industrial Society trying to save environment, not by stopping production of consumer goods but by recycling consumer goods is like the Gunman trying to save victims of shooting not by stopping the shooting but by shooting them with recycled guns and bullets.

The lunacy of Industrial Society has no limits.

Industrial Society has been coming up with ridiculous solutions for saving environment.

Green Industry..... Green Technology..... Sustainable Development.

All these are oxymorons.

No industry can be green.....No technology can be green.....No development can be sustainable.

Coming back to recycling :

Every Industrial Activity destroys environment.

Recycling Industry also destroys environment because recycling requires Industrial Activity.

First you destroy environment to make consumer goods.

Then you destroy more environment every time you recycle consumer goods.

So where is the saving of environment???

Environment is saved when you don't make consumer goods.

That is how environment was saved for millions of years on earth before industrialization.
.
.

"Bring this Technology.....Bring that Technology".
"Bring this Technology.....Bring that Technology".

Industrial Society trying to save environment, not by stopping Industrial Activity but by changing Industrial Technology is like the Gunman trying to save the victims of shooting not by stopping the shooting but by changing the Gun.
.

[vtsnowedin]

.
Industrial Society trying to save environment, not by stopping production of consumer goods but by recycling consumer goods is like the Gunman trying to save victims of shooting not by stopping the shooting but by shooting them with recycled guns and bullets.

The lunacy of Industrial Society has no limits.

Industrial Society has been coming up with ridiculous solutions for saving environment.

Green Industry..... Green Technology..... Sustainable Development.

All these are oxymorons.

No industry can be green.....No technology can be green.....No development can be sustainable.

Coming back to recycling :

Every Industrial Activity destroys environment.

Recycling Industry also destroys environment because recycling requires Industrial Activity.

First you destroy environment to make consumer goods.

Then you destroy more environment every time you recycle consumer goods.

So where is the saving of environment???

Environment is saved when you don't make consumer goods.

That is how environment was saved for millions of years on earth before industrialization.
.
.

"Bring this Technology.....Bring that Technology".
"Bring this Technology.....Bring that Technology".

Industrial Society trying to save environment, not by stopping Industrial Activity but by changing Industrial Technology is like the Gunman trying to save the victims of shooting not by stopping the shooting but by changing the Gun.
.

Nice rant Yaday.
So you would have us stop all industrial activity and mechanized agriculture? I suppose that would save the environment but for whom would you save it? Most if the seven billion now alive would starve without the use of technology. Is it not better to recycle a piece of metal then to go back to the mine and dig yet another hole in the ground to extract enough ore to feed the smelter or blast furnace?

[biffvernon]

Nice rant Yaday.
So you would have us stop all industrial activity and mechanized agriculture? I suppose that would save the environment but for whom would you save it? Most if the seven billion now alive would starve without the use of technology. Is it not better to recycle a piece of metal then to go back to the mine and dig yet another hole in the ground to extract enough ore to feed the smelter or blast furnace?

So you didn't see this report, vt? http://www.grain.org/article/entries/4929

[sushil_yadav]

Most of the seven billion now alive would starve without the use of technology.

The claim of Industrial Society that Industrial Agriculture is feeding 7 billion people is very misleading.

Industrial Society is not doing a favour to anyone by feeding 7 billion people.

Industrialization itself is the cause of 7 billion people.....If industrialization had not happened and man had continued with Agrarian Society, total world population would be less than 2 billion today.

Agrarian agriculture would have been able to feed this population and if at all there had been any shortage of food, only the excess population would have perished, not the entire human population.

Secondly, thousands of consumer goods and services being produced by Industrial Society are not food....Industrial Society has destroyed the environment for production of thousands of consumer goods and services.

Industrial Society has destroyed forests, rivers, oceans and atmosphere with Industrial Activity......Industrial Society has decimated millions of species with Industrial Activity.

Very soon man is going to get decimated/ wiped out because of environmental destruction and climate change.

Who is going to produce food on a dead planet???

Who is going to eat the food on a dead planet???

.