Where are you getting this rubbish from
I see that it's NOT really relevant as it is "industry" provided and not peer checked
It's also OLD DATA...
Here is the info from the company ELTRA.. from the mouth of those who KNOW whats really going on...
Eltra and Denmark’s own Government has reached the following official conclusion:
"One of the consequences of Danish policy has been the need to operate a very complex power system, in this case where wind and local CHP plants generated 50% of power produced in 2001. This has led to some power overflow situations. At present, balancing a power system like the Danish one can only be done because it is connected to areas with other types of production - not a solution that is acceptable in the long term.
Internal Danish measures are now needed if critical situations and disturbances are to be avoided".
I.E. they are going back to the old system and concentrating on ground heat extraction, large centralised old style coal, bio mass (straw) and oil plants. They are closing down the multitude of subsidised small power plants and reducing the subsidy on wind power to the point where the private owners will have to close as they cost more to run than they can earn even with a 200% cost subsidy.
I’ve since spoken to an engineer in Denmark who works on their electricity grid supply system. Apart from confirming what was said about wind turbines creating problems with fluctuating supply, inherent frequency problems and latency issues that result in power failure and local switching station damage he also tells me that the system relies heavily on “Imported” power from Norway and Sweden when problems with wind power when the wind drops and Denmark’s other alternate power generation systems need time to start up to cover the drop and that in the main it is supplied from their nuclear generation plants !!!!
"Until we invent a way of storing huge amounts of electricity, wind energy can never be relevant to our future," says Gundolf Dany, chief engineer of the Institute of Power systems in Aachen. The extra cost of "balance " power in Germany is about €500 million a year. Throttled back or idling, however, power plants are more polluting, like a car stopped at a traffic light. Dany and other engineers report that windmills have an insignificant impact on pollution reduction and in some cases even increase it.
This fact strikes at the heart of wind energy's promise. It explains why
not one power station has yet been replaced by the thousands of windmills already operating in Europe. Of course to fit in with variations of supply, power plants have to throttle back so they produce less electricity which drives up their running costs. And even when idling, they are still polluting.
Nor is wind energy cheap. All windmills in Europe are fuelled by subsidies. And the UK's plans to rely more heavily on wind power will bring extra costs vast new wind farms must be connected to the grid. But existing transmission lines are full up.
The Energy White Paper (DTI 2003) says unequivocally of the “subsidies”: - “The cost is met through higher prices to consumers.” Grid improvements will cost £1.3 billion up to 2010 to connect existing and already approved sites. This cost will be bourn by the tax payer and through higher electricity costs.
In the Danish town of Fredericia, Henning Rasmussen sits in the control room of a transmission system operator, balancing the input of wind energy with demand for power.
"In strong winds, our windmills provide as much as five power stations" he says.
"But when the wind arrives one or two hours later than forecast, we get nothing and we have to ask our neighbours to save us."
Rasmussen gets on the phone to negotiate extra power from Nordic countries and Germany. Ironically, this means Danes often use hated nuclear power from Sweden and Finland. When there's too much wind, surplus power is given away. "A couple of years ago, we even had to pay Sweden to take it" says Rasmussen. "It was crazy! "
In Denmark this same transfer of costs has doubled the price of electricity, compared with ours, and CO2-emissions in Denmark are still rising even after the huge investment in wind energy.
"In green terms windmills are a mistake and economically they make no sense," says Niels Gram of the Danish Federation of Industries.
" Many of us thought wind was the 100 percent solution for the future but we were wrong. In fact, taking all energy needs into account, it 's only a three percent solution."
Danish experts admit that wind power has not worked out very well.
"In just a few years we 've gone from some of the cheapest electricity in Europe to some of the most costly," says Jytte Kaad Jensen,chief economist for Eltra, Denmark 's biggest electricity distributor.
Aase Madsen, an MP who chairs energy policy in the Danish parliament, is emphatic: "For our industry it has been a terribly expensive disaster."
An important article "Flere Vindmøller Skaber Kaos" by Niels Sandøe was published in the Danish newspaper, Jyllands Posten, on 4th June 2003. Herewith is a short summary::-.....
Electrical power supplied must balance the power demand plus transmission losses at every second of the day. If this balance is not achieved, either there will be an automatic disconnection of either supply (to prevent physical damage to generating plant) or of loads (blackouts). Conventional plant has to be run in conjunction with the unpredictable wind generators and their output varied in order to provide a cushioning effect.
When large changes in wind power occur, beyond the capability of such conventional plant to compensate, then the assistance of neighbouring systems has been called upon.
With excess wind power the surplus has to be dumped somehow. Help is secured from Germany, Sweden or Norway by offering zero-priced electrical energy. Unfortunately it appears that Germany has, at times, the same problem because of its own wind-turbine concentration in the same region. When the wind blows strongly, the problem is to dispose of the excess wind electricity. Hence the price drops -- which is why Denmark has been known to export electricity at zero economic benefit.
When will people WAKE UP!!!!
Wind power is NOT free.
Wind power connected to the National Grid on a large scale is NOT an environmentally good idea.
Wind power is NOT cheap.
Wind power will NOT save any Co2 production from existing power stations.
The way this Country has created the Renewable Obligation Certificate system means that power station owners can buy their requirement to produce so much power by renewable means buy buying RoC on the stock exchange and run their "dirty" power stations longer and harder to raise the extra money to pay for it..ultimatly raising the cost of power while that meagre amount produced by wind power cant even be "seen" on out National Grid System and cant be relied upon to allow any of the existing "dirty" power stations to ramp down..
Even when the Gird can "see" enough power arriving from wind the grid cant ramp down power stations quickly enough to save any Co2 production and even if they could ramp them down as quickly as the wind changes then those power stations would still have to tick over waiting for the wind to die down, effectively burning fuel for no gain at all.. What then is the saving?
You are spoon fed the idealism minus any real science, fact or true understanding. While the customer requires power supply to be reliable and constant, wind farms, especially the small 1 to 30 turbine land based farms will NEVER work if the intention is to cut emissions...
GET REAL... all they do is pander to the greenists, provide political green vote gathering, raise the cost of electricity and make £millions for the owners...that take that money OUT of the power generation economic cycle.. I.E. "WE" pay for that money to go into their pockets with no real benefit to the environment or to us.....
I find that most of those who promote wind power dont really understand it at all. They gleam data from those who are promoting it, especially the British Wind Energy Association (BWEA) that are a lobby group who are PAID to promote wind power by the owners of wind farms and the builders of turbines. They have been taken to the advertising standards several times and lost… giving false data. They lobby with false facts and don’t respond to journalistic questioning.
But there are similar things happening on both sides of the argument. Sadly the real facts are hard to find.
Is wind power a good idea.. well yes it is.. Sadly though trying to connect it to the UK National Grid on a large scale is extremely difficult and ultimately impossible financially to do properly and that’s why it will NEVER work in the way it is being promoted.. I.E. as a cheap clean alternative to our existing system that will save Co2 production.
Carbon capture is far far better… Wave energy is far far better.
But these two real alternatives wont ever be accepted because they wont make HUGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY for the owners…
Until the UK population will accept huge price rises (They are just filtering through now) associated with implementing the green agenda and accept intermittent supply and accept a vastly reduced personal use of energy , I.E. a total life style change, then wind power is just so much political spin that will never work properly.
