Dozens of cyclists driven over on purpose!

[DominicJ]

Damn straight.

You'll no doubt all laugh, but I think bad road users should be nailed to the wall.

[ujoni08]

As a general point, I do wonder if labelling people as motorists, pedestrians, cyclists, etc. is helpful. Imagine a man called Tom, who owns a car, motorbike and a bicycle. Sometimes he walks on the pavement, too.

When he drives his car, he sometimes feels slightly annoyed by slow-moving traffic, including cyclists. When he cycles, he sometimes feels nervous because of the cars and lorries that whiz past so closely. When he rides his motorbike, all other traffic seems to be going too slowly, or pulling out in front of him. When he walks across a street, he sometimes doesn't look properly. What is Tom, (other than just a person) and can we attribute characteristics to him? Is he a menace? To whom?

@Dom, (I'm not speaking confrontationally, BTW, just offering my opinion). We'd all like to have wide, smooth, open, flowing roads with no other traffic, but we live in a crowded island with an old infrastructure. That can cause frustration, and I do understand that. I feel it too. What I can't understand/support is mowing people down on purpose (I'm not sure if that's what you meant, so please clarify if I'm wrong). I feel the (lack of) infrastructure is causing the problem, but can't see us being able to change it much. That leaves us to deal with it sensibly.

Dom, if that cyclist was purposefully holding up traffic, that's not very considerate at all. However, cycling and motorcycling courses do teach road positioning as a safety item, as it communicates with other road users and establishes your presence and intentions. Perhaps the road was so narrow he felt that the only way to protect himself was to occupy a more central position until it widened, which he's entitled to do under the law.

BTW, I believe two-wheeled vehicles are allowed to filter to the front of stationary traffic, providing they don't exceed twenty mph. I asked this question directly when I did the Bikesafe motorbike course with the police, and the answer was yes.

When we generalise about people, by using words like none, few, some, many, most, all we generate stereotypes.

Jon

[DominicJ]

We'd all like to have wide, smooth, open, flowing roads with no other traffic, but we live in a crowded island with an old infrastructure.

Actualy quite a few people on here are dead against that idea, but I accept the point.

Dom, if that cyclist was purposefully holding up traffic, that's not very considerate at all. However, cycling and motorcycling courses do teach road positioning as a safety item, as it communicates with other road users and establishes your presence and intentions.

Indeed, and when I was a motorcyclist, I dominated the road, provided, I could keep up with the flow traffic.

BTW, I believe two-wheeled vehicles are allowed to filter to the front of stationary traffic, providing they don't exceed twenty mph.

Perhaps, but I dont believe they are allowed to cross the stop line, its certainly dangerous to do so on this road.
And even if he is allowed, he pushed to the front of a que, despite being the slowest vehicle in it.
Had he waited at the back, which was where he was in the first place, the cars would all have driven off far faster than him, so their would be no need to "protect himself".
Instead he overtook, with no good reason to do so.

Believe me, I scream the same abuse at cars that force me (doing 80mph) out of the fast lane, quite dangerously often, only to then drop to 70mph.
It happens quite a lot, its infuriating.

[JohnB]

Believe me, I scream the same abuse at cars

Have you considered doing something about stress management? It's not at all useful to get so wound up, and it's harmful to your wellbeing, as well as others around you.

[DominicJ]

I'm the nicest person you'll ever meet, but put me behind the wheel, and I become a rage soaked killing machine.

I equate them to people who take three trolley loads through the 10 items or less que.
Its just down right inconsiderate.

[ujoni08]

I wonder if people's annoyance at filtering is because we see it as pushing in? The queue in a shop/bank etc. is the holy grail, and no-one would dare push in. Car drivers are mostly unaware that two-wheelers are allowed to filter to the front. Dom's point is a fair one here though, that a bicycle is much slower, and therefore just needs to be re-passed (I've experienced this as a driver, too). A motorbike is different. (The stop line applies to everyone, naturally).

The infrastructure isn't a problem we can easily fix, though good efforts are being made. If you're in a hurry, you will certainly feel frustrated. I feel a certain level of 'anger management' can be self-taught. I read years ago about Cognitive Dissonance:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

I had believed/hoped/expected something like: 'I would be able to drive all the way to my destination at a reasonable pace with few or no interruptions or delays'. My experience was different, and so I felt the dissonance/frustration. As the years passed, the roads became more clogged. Then I decided to change one of the two things that clashed. The experience on the road can't be changed, so I changed my expectations. I now expect to have to drive slowly, be delayed, have people pull out in front of me, etc. and voila! My expectations are confirmed, and I have cognitive harmony. I am as serene as can be (mostly . It really has changed driving for me, and my stress levels are way down.

Jon

[DominicJ]

I wonder if people's annoyance at filtering is because we see it as pushing in? The queue in a shop/bank etc. is the holy grail, and no-one would dare push in. Car drivers are mostly unaware that two-wheelers are allowed to filter to the front.

I didnt filter as a motorcyclist for this very reason.
Admitadly, seeing how often they were knocked over helped as well.

[clv101]

(The stop line applies to everyone, naturally)

But many/most major city junctions, bikes have their own separate stop line a few meters further down the road. This Advanceed Stop Line positively encourages bikes to filter and stop ahead of the motor vehicle stop line.

[DominicJ]

CLV
This junction did not have such a function, and as already mentioned, allowing the slowest vehicle to push to the front is, counter productive.

[JohnB]

I'm the nicest person you'll ever meet, but put me behind the wheel, and I become a rage soaked killing machine.

So you turn into a monster when you're in charge of a lethal weapon. Ever thought of volunteering to help out in Libya? Their beloved leader needs people like that .

The road is NOT a place where anger is ok. It leads to people getting killed and seriously injured, and taxpayers money that is needed by impoverished bankers being spent by the NHS, police and prison service.

[ujoni08]

Now that I expect counter-productivity, I am not enraged by it. One's rage has no effect on the system, but does affect one's health directly.
Just my experience... try it!

[JohnB]

Now that I expect counter-productivity, I am not enraged by it. One's rage has no effect on the system, but does affect one's health directly.
Just my experience... try it!

And mine, but it's very hard to do something about it. The people that do it don't see that they're the one with the problem, and put the blame onto someone else. It's a fascinating subject, but you only get to learn about it when you acknowledge you have a problem, and are ready to deal with it. Even then it's difficult and takes time.

[DominicJ]

Theres a difference vetween shouting at someone who has just forced you onto a dangerous position through their own thoughtlessness, and shooting children.

[Ludwig]

Believe me, I scream the same abuse at cars

Have you considered doing something about stress management? It's not at all useful to get so wound up, and it's harmful to your wellbeing, as well as others around you.

It's not useful to get wound up, but if you're prone to it, it's difficult to control. And once you are wound up, "controlling" your anger is actually much, much more stressful than letting it out. That's the problem.

I've found meditation helps a little. That, and avoiding people.

[PS_RalphW]

I used to get angry about people driving SUVs. Then I learned about peak oil and my attitude changed to 'poor sods. They have spent a fortune on a huge lump of iron that will be unsaleable in a few years'.

Mind you, that was a few years ago, and they are still selling, more or less.