Brexit process

[UndercoverElephant]

F--k off

Prorougement has been a political tool of the executive since for ever. But, antidemocratic wankers like you are all getting the vapours now about it...right?

You are morally intellectually and politically bankrupt. you and those like you make me sick to my f***ing stomach.

Nope. What Johnson did was suspend parliament for a considerable lenght of time, for a dishonest reason. The reason he was on the losing end of an 11-0 judgement by the highest court in the land was that if they'd ruled this as lawful then there would be nothing to prevent a future prime minister suspending parliament whenever they felt like it, for however long they liked, without giving an honest justification for doing so.

That would be a terrible precedent, wouldn't you agree? It is all very fine agreeing to it when it is being done to achieve an end you want, but what if next time it is done for an end you are opposed to? This really is about the way our democracy works, not brexit.

Your argument depends on the implied claim that the end always justifies the means, and that means it is you who is morally and intellectually bankrupt, not me. It doesn't matter how important you happen to believe the goal is, we cannot allow a system where a prime minister with no majority can simply suspend parliament when it suits him. That way lies tyranny.

The very fact that you've ended up calling a unanimous supreme court judgement "morally and intellectually bankrupt" suggests something has gone seriously wrong with your own thinking.

[Little John]

F--k off

Prorougement has been a political tool of the executive since for ever. But, antidemocratic wankers like you are all getting the vapours now about it...right?

You are morally intellectually and politically bankrupt. you and those like you make me sick to my f***ing stomach.

Nope. What Johnson did was suspend parliament for a considerable reason of time, for a dishonest reason. The reason he was on the losing end of an 11-0 judgement by the highest court in the land was that if they'd ruled this as lawful then there would be nothing to prevent a future prime minister suspending parliament whenever they felt like it, for however long they liked, without giving an honest justification for doing so.

That would be a terrible precedent, wouldn't you agree? It is all very fine agreeing to it when it is being done to achieve an end you want, but what if next time it is done for an end you are opposed to? This really is about the way our democracy works, not brexit.

Your argument depends on the implied claim that the end always justifies the means, and that means it is you who is morally and intellectually bankrupt, not me. It doesn't matter how important you happen to believe the goal is, we cannot allow a system where a prime minister with no majority can simply suspend parliament when it suits him. That way lies tyranny.

The very fact that you've ended up calling a unanimous supreme court judgement "morally and intellectually bankrupt" suggests something has gone seriously wrong with your own thinking.

You pathetic liberal petite bourgeois fraud and, given that, your of treatment of Biff Vernon was all the more heinous given you are essentially his ideological brother. At least he was honest in his utter disregard for the "lower orders" and their votes and opinions. As was I in my disgust of his disregard.

For you, it's all just been a game..right? You antidemocratic wanker.

[Little John]

So, Labour has just passed the motion which includes: maintenance and expansion of free movement of workers across borders and giving migrants the right to vote in UK elections. In other words, a direct assault on the working class of this country.

Well, I suppose the joke party has got to get votes from somewhere.

So they want more free movement (which Corbyn admits keeps working class wages down) but at the same time they will magically raise pay.... apparently.

But, it's ok though because people will only have to work 4 days a week and on Fridays it's unicorn racing day.

[Vortex2]

The acidic combative tone which as developed here is replicated throughout the land.

There will be tears before bedtime ... probably caused by CS gas.

[Little John]

This is what happens when you F--k with peoples votes

[UndercoverElephant]

F--k off

Prorougement has been a political tool of the executive since for ever. But, antidemocratic wankers like you are all getting the vapours now about it...right?

You are morally intellectually and politically bankrupt. you and those like you make me sick to my f***ing stomach.

Nope. What Johnson did was suspend parliament for a considerable reason of time, for a dishonest reason. The reason he was on the losing end of an 11-0 judgement by the highest court in the land was that if they'd ruled this as lawful then there would be nothing to prevent a future prime minister suspending parliament whenever they felt like it, for however long they liked, without giving an honest justification for doing so.

That would be a terrible precedent, wouldn't you agree? It is all very fine agreeing to it when it is being done to achieve an end you want, but what if next time it is done for an end you are opposed to? This really is about the way our democracy works, not brexit.

Your argument depends on the implied claim that the end always justifies the means, and that means it is you who is morally and intellectually bankrupt, not me. It doesn't matter how important you happen to believe the goal is, we cannot allow a system where a prime minister with no majority can simply suspend parliament when it suits him. That way lies tyranny.

The very fact that you've ended up calling a unanimous supreme court judgement "morally and intellectually bankrupt" suggests something has gone seriously wrong with your own thinking.

You pathetic liberal petite bourgeois fraud and, given that, your of treatment of Biff Vernon was all the more heinous given you are essentially his ideological brother. At least he was honest in his utter disregard for the "lower orders" and their votes and opinions. As was I in my disgust of his disregard.

For you, it's all just been a game..right? You antidemocratic wanker.

Your posts are actually making me laugh out loud now.

[Lord Beria3]

Lj, the question is whether the labour leave vote will finally have enough and switch to the Brexit party.

I'm not holding my breath!

[cubes]

This is what happens when you F--k with peoples votes

You're sounding like a stuck record. I'm honestly surprised you haven't been temp banned for all the abuse you've been spouting.

Your views on what leavers seem to want appears to be flawed imo, most aren't people who want to see blood on the streets or even do anything more than march. Most don't even want the brexit you want them to have. In a second ref I don't think there will be more than 15% spoiled ballots - they won't make a difference, just as a 52% remain win in 2016 would still have Nigel shouting about brexit while having his snout in the trough. If that was "unfinished business" (his words) then surely it's the same when the positions are reversed?

So why are you against a 2nd ref? No because of this democracy BS, it's because you're scared you'll lose now people have some understanding of brexit will truely involve - and that the rich brexiteers will benefit and they'll be claiming dole.

[fuzzy]

The obvious objection is mathematical. Why do you want one? There is no material evidence that has changed since the first one. Lot's of propaganda, but no actual evidence. If the propaganda worked and the vote was changed, which is the valid result the 1st or the 2nd vote? There is an argument for best of 3 - perhaps if the hysteria continues another 3 years...

But you knew this anyway.

[UndercoverElephant]

Lj, the question is whether the labour leave vote will finally have enough and switch to the Brexit party.

I'm not holding my breath!

You saw the conference. The 20-25% that is currently still backing Corbyn are not going anywhere. They want a Labour-left government and they want it more than they want brexit. They will not vote for the brexit party in a general election unless Labour does what Watson wants and goes full remain. That is why the Labour conference tried to get rid of Watson. It's why the Labour left hates him.

It is worth noting that most Labour leavers are on the left of the party, like Corbyn. And that means that they are the ones who are most committed to getting Corbyn into Downing Street and smashing the tory party. If they have to choose between that and voting for a Johnson-led tory party just to get brexit, they'll vote Labour.

[Little John]

You anti democratic *****. You really have no idea what you are unleashing in this country.

[UndercoverElephant]

You anti democratic *****. You really have no idea what you are unleashing in this country.

Me unleashing it?

All I am going to do is vote Labour, for mainly non-brexit reasons.

[Catweazle]

You anti democratic *****. You really have no idea what you are unleashing in this country.

If you are imagining that there will be millions of LJ's, emerging from behind their spittle-covered computer screens to riot on the streets then I think you will be disappointed.

I wanted to leave the EU, and now the true implications are becoming clearer I'm wondering if that was the correct decision. There are more like me.

[stumuz1]

Just a little aside.

Out of my 13 hour working day yesterday, 8 hours was spent behind the wheel.

A55, A41, M54, M6, M5.

All the along route, using the motorway infrastructure ( the ones that tell you "don't drive tired, get your eyes checked etc) were government Brexit messages.

'Hauliers the paperwork you will need for imports and exports will change on Nov 1.'

'Are you ready for the export changes Nov 1.'

Having been on the stakeholder group for the Gov' planning for chemical legistlation, it was done on a very we may/may not leave approach.

Things seem to have ratcheted up a few notches in the last week or so.

Question. (only genuine answers not partisan/sectarian)

When Bojo says he will obey the law and we are leaving on the 31st, Do you think he has something up his sleeve or is merely grandstanding and will go to Brussels and request an extension?

[clv101]

It's all grandstanding IMO. He wants to be seen to have tried as hard as possible only to be blocked by parliament/the EU/judges etc. It's all about the election narrative of Boris standing up for the people against the establishment, classic populism.