Israel/palestine conflict, worsens.

[Default0ptions]

“It has become clear that the IDF has entered its next phase of battle operations, meaning a full ground assault, as heavy aerial bombardment continues . . .”

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... -headlines

There’s some some dissembling in the article after that quote as to whether this is the start of a full ground assault or an “expanded raid” but this cannot be good news. Not for Gazan civilians, or for Israel, or for the wider region, or for the world in general.

I think that the potential for completely foreseeable ‘unforeseen consequences’ to escalate the situation here is far more serious than the Russia/Ukraine conflict ever threatened to be.

[BritDownUnder]

I expect the money will come from 'Western' or Gulf donors eventually. Or from people/countries who are silly enough to still heat their houses with gas or drive ICE vehicles.

I hear the UK just closed another coal power station.

On another note I hear that Hamas uses water pipes as rocket casings and diesel as part of the rocket propellant/explosive. Presumably there will be a sudden need in Gaza for Ammonium Nitrate fertiliser and Diesel in the next few months - for growing crops and making electricity you understand.

[adam2]

Another rocket propellant is sugar and ammonium nitrate. For this reason Israel has prohibited bulk supplies of sugar.
Diesel fuel or kerosene and ammonium nitrate is more popular.

[Ralphw2]

Gaza is 2 million people in an area of the isle of wight. They are dependent on imports for 80% of their food. Mass starvation is only a matter of weeks if not days away.

Isreal is gearing up for a prolonged war. They know that Gaza as a prison colony is no longer viable, so they have decided to remove Hamas the only way they know how, by scorched earth from North to south, leaving the people the "choice" of fleeing to dying. With all borders shut tight, they cannot currently flee.

[UndercoverElephant]

They know that Gaza as a prison colony is no longer viable, so they have decided to remove Hamas the only way they know how, by scorched earth from North to south, leaving the people the "choice" of fleeing to dying. With all borders shut tight, they cannot currently flee.

That is not much of choice then, is it. This is genocide, pure and simple. With the collusion of all western governments.

Everyone who refuses to use that word shares in the guilt.

[Default0ptions]

“Erdogan Vows To Get Israel Branded As "War Criminal" State, Also Blames West For Gaza "Massacre"”

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/ ... a-massacre

"Those shedding crocodile tears for civilians killed in the Ukraine-Russia war are silently watching the deaths of thousands of innocent children in Gaza," he critiqued further, highlighting the double standard.

Well this isn’t promising for NATO cohesion.

Or this: “Last year, President Trump suggested a move tantamount to destroying NATO: the withdrawal of the United States.”

(Currently “Donald Trump is leading President Joe Biden in several key swing states”)

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/14/us/p ... trump.html

[BritDownUnder]

The g-word getting a bit of a mention at the moment. I would certainly support a UN motion listing all genocides of the last, say, 150 years and then inviting the perpetrators to make amends. We could start with the Herero genocide in Namibia, maybe move on to the Armenian and Assyrian genocide in the late Ottoman Empire, the Parsley massacre, Holodomor, Holocaust and end up with Kurdish genocide, Rohingyas and then maybe Gaza.

One thing to note is that the only one I could see that was the blame of the UK was the Queensland genocide in the 1800s.

As the Aboriginals like to say "Ain't no pride in genocide".

[UndercoverElephant]

Israel....double standard.

The problem is that the very existence of Israel is a double standard, and has been for decades. Israel is allowed to do things that no other nation is allowed to do, such as set up an apartheid system and flout UN resolutions with total impunity.

Well this isn’t promising for NATO cohesion.

It won't make any difference to future of NATO. The UN, however, has now been undermined to the point where one wonders whether there is any purpose at all to its continued existence. Not just because of Israel, but also because of the presence of Russia on the security council.

NATO will continue to exist so long as it is in the interest of the US to remain allied to Europe. Yes, Trump disagrees. But Trump is an idiot. The whole world is in big trouble if he manages to get re-elected.

[UndercoverElephant]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-m ... t-67246761

Thousands in Gaza break into aid centres and take supplies, UN says

This is really serious now. We have the UN condemning Israel and Israel saying the UN has no authority or credibility. We have Israel telling people to flee from an area which is sealed so nobody can escape, while it begins the process of genocide. There is no way to remove the threat from Hamas without killing the entire population of Gaza. This is the Nazi state of Israel preparing to enact The Final Solution to the Palestinian Problem.

We are witnessing the beginning of a crime which is comparable to the Holocaust, being perpetrated by the survivors of that event against a people whose primary offence was occupying land Israel wanted to take. And our governments and most of our population is complicit.

I truly believe that future historians will see this as the beginning of the end of the western world as we have known it. Anyone unwilling to say this how it is, which includes Kier Starmer, is guilty.


First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

[johnny]

Johnny. Yada yada. You got your arse kicked.

Yada yada indeed. All US CSG still alive and kicking...Old World citizens still jealous they can't project power beyond their backyards...with the modern military equivalent of kitchen knives.

[Vortex2]

if the Patriot missile defence system did intercept a nuclear armed missile, what then happens ?

The missile detonates : they are fitted with "salvage fuses".

This gives a chance of the detonation killing the anti-missile system.

It also prevents fissile material falling into the hands of the enemy.

PS I have tried to avoid the forum recently as I knew that the anti-Israel rhetoric would be in full flow.

[clv101]

The US seem to be shifting a lot of equipment to the region. Two carrier strike groups, other ships as well, and a lot of transport flights: https://twitter.com/space_osint/status/ ... nW0pQ&s=19

[invalid]

‘Threat is not Hamas but Gazans, and Arabs of Judea and Samaria’

A leading Israeli security expert has told the country’s Maariv newspaper the “threat is not Hamas but the Gazans and the Arabs of Judea and Samaria”, referring to the occupied West Bank.

“As long as the state of Israel does not understand what the threat is – it will not be able to win,” Eliyahu Yossian, research fellow at Meshgav Institute for National Security and winner of the Israel Defense Prize, told the newspaper in an example of the discourse among Israel’s far right as the Gaza assault continues.

“If we don’t treat Gaza as an enemy, we will never get out of the rounds and each time it is going to get worse to the point that we reached the acute situation of [October 7] morning. The state of Israel needs to understand and accept that there are no innocents in Gaza.”

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog ... st%20Bank.

If the quote is accurate, it's very damning.

[Default0ptions]

Well this isn’t promising for NATO cohesion.

It won't make any difference to future of NATO.

You think Turkey becoming increasingly anti NATO won’t make any difference to NATO?

“Turkey has been a member of NATO since 1952, has its second largest army and is the host of the Allied Land Command headquarters.”

[UndercoverElephant]

Well this isn’t promising for NATO cohesion.

It won't make any difference to future of NATO.

You think Turkey becoming increasingly anti NATO won’t make any difference to NATO?

“Turkey has been a member of NATO since 1952, has its second largest army and is the host of the Allied Land Command headquarters.”

Turkey is not going to leave NATO.