NHS strategy heralds shift to renewable energy

Bandidoz · Post by **Bandidoz** » 05 Feb 2009, 16:12

DominicJ wrote:Whats the Job of the NHS again?
Curing sick people or implementing energy policy?

Bear in mind that the NHS normally use interruptible power contracts - presumably to save a bit of money, and they hope they don't have to fire up their diesel gennies too often.

Adam1 · Post by **Adam1** » 05 Feb 2009, 17:05

kenneal wrote:They would save far more by fitting thermostatic valves on their radiators and turning the heat down a bit.

A friend of mine went to see her father in hospital and found him in a bed next to a south facing window on a sunny day with the heating full on and him suffering from heat stroke! Doesn't say much for the energy efficiency or the nursing.

Waste in the NHS is huge and fitting renewables will just add to the complacency and incompetence that causes that waste in the first place.

Absolutely. I used to work in the NHS on a project to build a replacement district general hospital (back in 1988). During the design stage, I suggested to project team that double-glazed windows were specified, rather than the proposed single-glazed ones, but was told that this was not possible. A central NHS Estates edict stated that nothing could be specified, if it increased the capital cost and didn't pay back financially within FIVE years, irrespective of the item's usable lifetime. The project team agreed that this was daft - how many hospitals have their windows changed every five years - but there was nothing that could be done.

20 years later I was sitting in a similar era and design hospital, complete with its 1980s era, single-glazed windows. It was the end of August during a rare warm (25C) spell last summer. The heating was going full blast and the temperature in the ward was over 30C. Windows were closed.

Healthcare is already massively energy intensive without hospitals p1ssing fossil fuel energy away like there is no tomorrow. It really is complete madness!

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 05 Feb 2009, 17:17

To add to the sheer ludicrousness of overheating, apparently dehydration is common among hospital patients (because they often feel too lethargic to sit up and pour themselves some water, without encouragement).

JohnB · Post by **JohnB** » 05 Feb 2009, 19:21

Looks like nothing's changed for years then. The only time I've stayed in hospital when I was 6, to have my tonsils out, and all I can remember was being kept awake by a bloody great ceiling heater.

Sarge · Post by **Sarge** » 05 Feb 2009, 20:36

I currently work in the NHS and get everywhere within the various departments, wards etc (it can be 27 degrees at my desk sometimes) and no nothing has changed. The excuse is that the "patients like it warm"

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 05 Feb 2009, 20:57

There is an ideal temperature for people sitting nude, doing nothing. It is 84 degF (looks it up in degC...it's about 29). Now patients aren't exactly running around playing fitba', but they are usually dressed or in bed. The ideal temperature for this, is about 24 degC.

Any hotter than that and you begin to compromise the performance of the people who are looking after the patients!

Post by **kenneal - lagger** » 06 Feb 2009, 02:06

RenewableCandy wrote:Any hotter than that and you begin to compromise the performance of the people who are looking after the patients!

And make the patients so sweaty that they need to drink more but the heat has made them too lethargic to do so.

DominicJ · Post by **DominicJ** » 06 Feb 2009, 08:35

Whats the prime bacteria growing temperature range?

RenewableCandy · Post by **RenewableCandy** » 06 Feb 2009, 16:46

Now there's a thing. Depends on the bacterium in question. The only one I know is Legionella 22-55 degC because it has a bearing on HW and A/C, which I had to know for work.

The most lethal bacteria like a temperature just over body heat (37 degC): they are lethal because as a body heats up to say 39 degC to try and fend them off, they thrive all the more. Birds have a slightly higher body temperature than we do, and I suppose that's why diseases spread by birds (H5N1 etc) are such a problem.

JonB · Post by **JonB** » 06 Feb 2009, 20:05

DominicJ wrote:Whats the prime bacteria growing temperature range?

Anything from 0 to 100 C, depending on the bug

Human pathogens optimum is 37C. We grow our Legionella and othe human pathogens at 37C happily, and Legionella survive up to 59 no probs. 20C up most human pathgens grow nicely, albeit slower than optimum 37.
Main constraint is nutrient source (people / food/ blood spills etc) which is why cleanliness is so important. Shame half the nursing and other staff seem to have forgotten this these days.