Unhappy Campers

[Potemkin Villager]

I have been weaning myself off doomerspace recently. However I succumbed again to the charms of r/collapse to be rewarded with this heart warmingly graphic vision from No-Formal2869 :-

" I suspect this is due to boomers entering the age of demise and refusing to accept that everyone dies, and it is sadly their turn. So they are constantly going to the ER when they get a cold or flu because it could kill them. They are falling down, breaking bones, and suffering various cario and/or pulminary complications. We also have my generation (X) dying "deaths of despair" (overdoses, alcohol poisonings, self-neglect, suicide, morbid obesity, exposure) in unprecedented numbers-numbers never seen before in history. Pregnancy complications are on the rise. Add that the number of Americans with carrying licenses has quadrupled recently, with 2022 being the deadliest mass-shooting year to date, and we have our hospitals full. You aren't a doomer. We are ALL feeling the same eerie thing. In med terms, this planet has MRSA and the inflammation is causing heat, extreme pain, and a huge 'angry red' welt, and everything has come to a nice puss-filled head. She's ready to pop any second, and the tension is thick. We are all feeling it. The question is...what IS it????"

I wonder what other boomers hear think of this characterisation?

[Catweazle]

Most men I know would rather chew their arm off than go to a doctor, which is why my precautionary bowel screening test lead to a diagnosis of stage 3 cancer. I'm perfectly aware I won't live forever, I think most people are the same.

[Vortex2]

I wonder what other boomers here think of this characterisation?

Boomers built the current world.

Current job seekers are looking for "work life balance" and other soft handed cr*p.

I suspect that testosterone levels could be a factor ... they are declining 10% per decade. Mail fertility is also on the wane.

Boys used to aspire to be train drivers or crane operators. Nowadays, many regard web development or social media content creation as manly.

This change is certainly not ubiquitous .. but if you look around, you will see many young men who are, say, unlikely to want a career in the military.

[johnny]

Most men I know would rather chew their arm off than go to a doctor, which is why my precautionary bowel screening test lead to a diagnosis of stage 3 cancer. I'm perfectly aware I won't live forever, I think most people are the same.

I believe at the heart and soul of McDoomsterism is a deep seated fear of mortality. fear of ones demise. And doom mongering appears to be a non-youngsters game. Ones mortality can be difficult to talk about, so it is projected onto cool and interesting topics as a substitute, where it can be talked about openly. A classic projection scenario.

Peak oil was a good attraction for awhile, had a decent short term fuse, appeared serious, was good for cool prepping and guns, ammo and mre scenarios, explain to the family why a doomstead was neeeded (alternatively called hunting and fishing cabins in the US, or maybe a hobby farm), could be taken seriously (for a little anyway), etc etc.

So yeah, people are afraid of dying, and do all sorts of weird stuff to avoid talking or thinking about it. The problem with using climate collapse appears to be the length of time required. "It will he warmer as time goes on, and rain more, and oceans will rise inches in your lifetime" just doesn't have the kick of MZBs, starving suburbanites in a week, building homemade claymores to kill them, etc etc.

[PS_RalphW]

Climate change is slow in terms of the average human attention span, but in terms of geological history we are talking meteor strike speeds. It is true that rich old white men have been bemoaning the collapse of civilisation and the feminisation of youth for at least 2000 years, and probably a lot longer than that. But in that time many, in fact almost all civilisations have collapsed, and this one is showing no signs of being any different. And this one is now global, and has triggered the 6th mass extinction event on this planet, in the last 200 odd years, mostly the last 50. We are an invasive species and until we get our population and resource extraction under control, we are going to face massive die off events, which will leave the planet a much less diverse and ecologically stable place for the few survivors, for a few million years at least. This is not a crime against humanity, it is the crime of humanity, and I am deeply ashamed to be associated with it.

I am also into the declining health phase of life, and my adopted children are not shining examples of macho empire building beloved of our parents generations, but I do think their mental health issues are a natural and adaptive response to the crazy world they have been born into. I should have enough electronic resources to command reasonable living and health care standards to reach a good lifespan by historic standards, as long as this corner of civilisation does not implode too quickly, but I do not think that such virtual wealth will do my heirs much good, even if they had the social skills to manipulate it in their favour.

[Potemkin Villager]

I believe at the heart and soul of McDoomsterism is a deep seated fear of mortality. fear of ones demise. And doom mongering appears to be a non-youngsters game. Ones mortality can be difficult to talk about, so it is projected onto cool and interesting topics as a substitute, where it can be talked about openly. A classic projection scenario.

Peak oil was a good attraction for awhile, had a decent short term fuse, appeared serious, was good for cool prepping and guns, ammo and mre scenarios, explain to the family why a doomstead was neeeded (alternatively called hunting and fishing cabins in the US, or maybe a hobby farm), could be taken seriously (for a little anyway), etc etc.

This is precisely what I have been coming to think more and more. Funnily enough both our children now have quite similar views to
their parents despite us trying as hard as possible not to proselytize and let them form their own beliefs independently. They both
have recently told us, having made their way a bit in the wicked world, they now understand why we, and the parents of many of their friends from school, came to live where we do and like we do.

As health systems come more under pressure alas triage by age and wealth will become more and more severe. I have been lucky so far and my health issues are still easily managed and I still seem to have a robust immune system. However if I make it as far as 80 things will be very different so I am making the most of it now. Thankfully I live a country where even the police still go largely unarmed.

[johnny]

Climate change is slow in terms of the average human attention span, but in terms of geological history we are talking meteor strike speeds.

Few people think in terms of geologic time to begin with, so it isn't a surprise that there is little aprpeciation for climate change generally or geologically induced climate events. Let alone cosmological. A nearby originating gamma burst would be interesting, a CME like the Carrington event only bigger would be perfectly reasonable, and do far more to provde cool Amish lifestyle scenarios for preppers than some of the ones more commonly discussed.

It is true that rich old white men have been bemoaning the collapse of civilisation and the feminisation of youth for at least 2000 years, and probably a lot longer than that.

Apocalypticism has been around for at least a millennium.

But in that time many, in fact almost all civilisations have collapsed, and this one is showing no signs of being any different.

Absolutely right. But it didn't happen in the timeframe claimed by the true believers, which tends to be the point used against the idea. "Collapse? Again? What is going to cause it this time, raging halitosis?". That or standard human hubris most likely, "who us, collapse?...naw..."

And this one is now global, and has triggered the 6th mass extinction event on this planet, in the last 200 odd years, mostly the last 50. We are an invasive species and until we get our population and resource extraction under control, we are going to face massive die off events, which will leave the planet a much less diverse and ecologically stable place for the few survivors, for a few million years at least. This is not a crime against humanity, it is the crime of humanity, and I am deeply ashamed to be associated with it.

Humans demonstrate characteristics identifical to cockroaches in a bucket with a nice pile of sugar to consume and breed and expand with. And when the last grain of sugar is gone....well....cockroaches and humans...no different at the end of the day.

I've decided it is just simple speciesism that causes all of this. Us being so special and all, SURELY we aren't like those cockroaches.

I am also into the declining health phase of life, and my adopted children are not shining examples of macho empire building beloved of our parents generations, but I do think their mental health issues are a natural and adaptive response to the crazy world they have been born into. I should have enough electronic resources to command reasonable living and health care standards to reach a good lifespan by historic standards, as long as this corner of civilisation does not implode too quickly, but I do not think that such virtual wealth will do my heirs much good, even if they had the social skills to manipulate it in their favour.

We all have our hopes and dreams, a common human trait. But if we aren't smarter at the end of the day than those cockroaches...well....I wonder what they do when the sugar runs out? Probably isn't pretty.

[johnny]

Thankfully I live a country where even the police still go largely unarmed.

The point of police isn't to stop crime, but to basically clean up the mess afterwards, try and find the perpetrator, provide a disincentive for others thinking about doing the same, etc etc. No real need to be armed.

Thankfully I live in a country where citizens are not required to acquiesce to the kindness of criminal perpetrators. Prior to the police being alerted, showing up to do their jobs, etc etc. Armed or not.

[Vortex2]

It is true that rich old white men have been bemoaning the collapse of civilisation and the feminisation of youth for at least 2000 years, and probably a lot longer than that.

Perhaps ... the feminisation part now seems to be physically based and not just imagined.

[RevdTess]

Current job seekers are looking for "work life balance" and other soft handed cr*p.

I suspect that testosterone levels could be a factor ... they are declining 10% per decade. Mail fertility is also on the wane.

Whether or not men are going 'soft', there are still 50% of the adult population who are not men, and therefore presumably cannot be blamed for wanting a 'soft handed' work life balance - if indeed this is a feminine principle at work.

Unless you're arguing that women should all stay at home, or that men and women should have clearly demarcated job roles, I don't think you can convincingly argue that those of us without manly levels of testosterone should be forced to accept manly workplace practices. And surely if women are allowed a 'soft' work life balance, then men who want it should as well?

In any case, I'm not convinced the manly hours I used to work as a City analyst made my work more effective than when I was allowed to work from home, and later when I enjoyed a 2-day week.

As for the decline in testosterone levels, this is definitely happening. I've even read that the Y chromosome might disappear entirely in some distant future, if some other species' experience is anything to go by.

[PS_RalphW]

As my older adopted child now takes testosterone I have one data point that says this hormone has no visible effect on aggression or propensity to work or to get up one minute earlier than absolutely necessary to catch the bus in the morning

[Vortex2]

And surely if women are allowed a 'soft' work life balance, then men who want it should as well? RevdTess

Sure.

That said, it certainly seems that major engineering projects, done exceptionally fast, are generally carried out by very focussed men for whom work-life-balance is a meaningless concept.

I have no knowledge of the virology and other life science areas, but in those fields it may indeed be women who push projects to completion. Again, I doubt that work-life-balance is much of a concept in those cases either.

Piddling about on Facebook, TikTok and the like won't get bridges built or vaccines created.