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We prepare to break another 600 sqm this spring, mainly for some potatoes, beans and rhubarb. After more than five years of looking out, we found this baby second hand, at half the price of a new one:



I've worked a lot with cultivators, and this category is by far the easiest to handle. Almost no muscle power needed, and even if (when) the gasoline cost ?10 per liter, it's worthwhile to pour it this little thing. One hour of work with a heavy cultivator is equivalent to 10-15 hours of digging.

I am more envious of the fact you have 600 sqm extra space available to grow more stuff!

I would love a go with this sort of thing - bit of an overkill for an allotment though!

I prefer to dig anyway - I need the exercise!

We have a Mantis cultivator (http://www.mantis-uk.co.uk/) which we have found to be better than the heavyweight variety. It would turn over one of our 10 x 1.2 metre beds (hard silt with cobbles sized stones in, hard enough to drive a lorry over) down to about 250 deep, and to a fine tilth, in a couple of hours or so. A heavy weight machine wouldn't touch the ground. It also uses a fraction of the fuel that a heavy machine would.

I've stopped using it now though, because it chops up all the worms. Not a good idea in an organic garden.

I used to have a rotavator many years ago but sold it. I don't think they are justified unless you are growing commercially and need to clear a lot of land - and then it's probably better to to hiresomeone with a tractor. Better to go for no digging on deep beds.

There is now greater understanding of the importance of the fungi and other micro-organisms in the soil that are promoted in undisturbed soil. It seems that the fungal threads play a role in moving nutrients around the soil, effectively increasing the volume of soil from which a plant's roots can obtain nutrients. No digging allows this phenomenon.

MacG wrote:We prepare to break another 600 sqm this spring, mainly for some potatoes, beans and rhubarb. After more than five years of looking out, we found this baby second hand, at half the price of a new one:



I've worked a lot with cultivators, and this category is by far the easiest to handle. Almost no muscle power needed, and even if (when) the gasoline cost ?10 per liter, it's worthwhile to pour it this little thing. One hour of work with a heavy cultivator is equivalent to 10-15 hours of digging.

Is that a rotovator or a fully blown 2 wheel tractor with PTO? I've heard some of those things can be used to drive all sorts of usefull stuff like mowers, scythe bars, chippers, power harrows etc etc...

Ahw, there is a place for everything. We got heavy clay and the current plot we are going to break has been fallow for three years, and grazing before that. Some heavy grass to get trough thus.

This class of cultivator is really a 2-wheel mini-tractor which can be equipped with everything from snow blowers to carts and generators. Overkill to some degree, but I expect it to last my lifetime. There are things of very similar construction from the 1930's which are still in use.

This class of tools is very popular in Switzerland, France, Italy and almost all the eastern countries. Extremely useful, rugged and low-maintenance. We have general problems finding the "right" scale of tools up here - professional farm gear is HUGE while the hobby stuff is to weak. The now so popular 4-wheelers are rather weak for example, except from the heaviest ones, but they are prohibitively expensive.

The next step up is the Chinese tractors. Very fit for small scale operations. One good is Jinma.

Do you favour Chinese over the older imported Japanese stuff?

http://www.affordabletractors.co.uk/search.php?area=2

I hear the Japanese stuff (Kubota, Yanmar, Iseki etc) is built to last, the Chinese stuff hasn't been round long enough to prove itself yet. Bloody cheap though. Which is suspect in itself....

SunnyJim wrote:Do you favour Chinese over the older imported Japanese stuff?

http://www.affordabletractors.co.uk/search.php?area=2

I hear the Japanese stuff (Kubota, Yanmar, Iseki etc) is built to last, the Chinese stuff hasn't been round long enough to prove itself yet. Bloody cheap though. Which is suspect in itself....

What I've heard, it's Japanese companies which brought the tech into China. Same with scooters and mopeds - Yamaha and Honda lurk behind the curtains. I suspect that today's low prices are a historic anomaly which we will talk about for the rest of our lives, boring our grandchildren to death.

Indeed. But how long will such things be viable in the face of rising fuel prices? Will food inflation keep up with fuel inflation? Does the future favour human scale agriculture or mechanised agriculture? At what acreage will mechanisation become economically viable??? All difficult questions to answer. The old 2 wheel tractor strikes a nice balance though I would think. As you say, very efficient and simple to repair. Not much to go wrong, and versatile.

SunnyJim wrote:Indeed. But how long will such things be viable in the face of rising fuel prices?

I have no idea. But I know that I would happily pour ?10 gasoline in a cultivator and ?50 in a chainsaw. The work they perform compared to the manual alternative is still very attractive.

biffvernon wrote:Better to go for no digging on deep beds.

There is now greater understanding of the importance of the fungi and other micro-organisms in the soil that are promoted in undisturbed soil. It seems that the fungal threads play a role in moving nutrients around the soil, effectively increasing the volume of soil from which a plant's roots can obtain nutrients. No digging allows this phenomenon.

No digging sounds good but what about ground which is compacted and bone dry below a few inches? I assume an initial deep dig (including adding stuff like well rotted manure) is beneficial, though it should then be left un-dug?

SunnyJim wrote:Do you favour Chinese over the older imported Japanese stuff?

http://www.affordabletractors.co.uk/search.php?area=2

I hear the Japanese stuff (Kubota, Yanmar, Iseki etc) is built to last, the Chinese stuff hasn't been round long enough to prove itself yet. Bloody cheap though. Which is suspect in itself....

I have a Chinese tractor, Benye, 25hp with back hoe and front loader, it is my 2nd, greatly regret selling the first as they are cracking machines. Before Chinese I had a Fordson Dexter, the Chinese tractors run rings round that sort of thing. Low maintenance and they just keep running. No fag lighters and cup holders mind.

Smithy wrote:

biffvernon wrote:Better to go for no digging on deep beds.

There is now greater understanding of the importance of the fungi and other micro-organisms in the soil that are promoted in undisturbed soil. It seems that the fungal threads play a role in moving nutrients around the soil, effectively increasing the volume of soil from which a plant's roots can obtain nutrients. No digging allows this phenomenon.

No digging sounds good but what about ground which is compacted and bone dry below a few inches? I assume an initial deep dig (including adding stuff like well rotted manure) is beneficial, though it should then be left un-dug?

I agree. No digging is a great ideal to strive for. I also agree that an initial dig to loosen the soil and remove perenial roots is essential, then you just need to maintain soil health by regular composting/green manures etc, however on a field scale it's hard to do. A quarter of an acre of wheat needs to be cut, and if you have it undersown with a clover ley, eventually you need to turn the clover ley into somehting you can put seed into. i.e. a tilth. No dig farm scale systems fall down for me at the seeding point of the cycle. Of course I'm only theorising about this. I've not done it. There are no dig seeders, but they are huge beasts that require hundreds of horsepower to run. Africa has something horse drawn called and eco-seeder that sounds good, but ideally you would want a small > 20hp towed seeder that could cope with planting into stubble and surface 'trash' like cut green manures. Currently it seems you have to plough (shallow as you can) then harrow to create a seed bed.

Also, raised beds are worth analysing. If you have wet land and restricted space, or a bad back then a raised bed would be good. If you have enough land and you live in a dry area, then leave your beds flat and just dont walk on them. Raised beds drain easier and the plants have more trouble finding water. Use what is right for the situation rather than just blindly going ahead with raised beds!

Greg, have you ever owned one of the Japanese tractors?

Greg, have you ever owned one of the Japanese tractors?

Nope, but have looked at them, nearly went for a recon Kubota but it was a bit too titchy for the job, most of them are.

My present (and last) tractor has enough oomph to handle most jobs (such as tonight, have just been and towed a tree out of the road that came down in the storm, lot's of firewood, oak too), and is ridiculously easy to look after. I don't buy into the flimsy thing at all.

Yes. I first used raised beds on rich and heavy clay land and when I moved to very light sandy soil I thought I would give up the deep beds as they would dry out too fast. But I've changed my mind on that. The increased depth of soil and better structure combined with plenty of organic matter means that I think there is more moisture available even though one might imagine that the drainage is better. So all my veg are on deep beds now.