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So who else has started fruit and veg growing with renewed determination since discovering PO?

I was keen before, but now I'm becoming a tad obsessed!

I spent the whole week end excavating my raspberries from the undergrowth! (Hopefully they'll appreciate my efforts and fruit more prolifically this year.)

I also sowed a few seeds on the window sill ready for the green house when it warms up.

The way I see it, it takes a few years to build up the fertility in the garden, and to get the weeds under control & systems put in place to keep them that way!

Oh & I've been reading Permaculture books... even unearthed ones I bought in the early 90's!

Anyone?

ETA some pics.

Creating some of the beds:



My favourite of the greenhouse - winter morning sun.

I have to admit that my wife has been doing nearly all the work to try and grow some food in our tiny outside space in London.

We are planning to expand this when we move to somewhere with more space.

I posted something about this in the PO and careers thread earlier.

We've found (and to all of you already doing this, I can imagine how this sounds) that growing stuff is going to take us a while to learn well - especially if, in my case, I haven't done that much to get my hands dirty! The five-day course we went on was inspirational though. Also, it's been much easier talking with others outside the PO world about permaculture than about peak oil (surprise surprise).

Adam1 wrote:I posted something about this in the PO and careers thread earlier.

Yes... that and the comment about the need for the mods to split the thread made me think it was about time a Grow Your Own type thread was started.

I have to admit I am trying to find out as much about seed saving as possible too.... I mean real independance only comes if you can keep growing with out having to rely on bought in stocks of fresh seed each year.No F1 hybrids for me!

So last year I grew veg on 3 beds each 6'x8' . This year we have created 2 more one 4'x22' and the other 8'x22'!

My motto is: Plant plenty... and cheer about the successes! (Develop selective memory about the rest.)

I would love to be self sufficient regarding our veg, but it'll not be this year. As you say Adam there is a steep learning curve. I'm sure your course was fascinating though. I'd love to hear more about Permaculture first hand. I do agree however that much of it is like the allotmenteering spirit redressed as something new. I don't think that's altogether a bad thing; after all if it makes growing your own food trendy again then that's great in my view!

Anyway so far it has been very theraputic.

Good timing.

Just today, our "new" garden has been finished.

I have spent weeks digging up the garden, removing all the plants, and laying an irrigation system fed from a 250 gallon rainwater IBC I installed, and the builder has just gone at 3pm after laying a retaining wall to hold the soil for new vegetable garden in.

The brickwork will be dry in 24 hours, and I can then backfill with the rest of the soil.

Then it's up to Mrs. PP to do the veggie thing. Not being macho or anything, but I kill anything green I touch.

Now I can get back to building the chassis for the diesel generator I am building, then it's off to my welding course next week, much more my line of things....!

The garden is tiny, but it will be a practice patch for when we eventually move to a smaller house with more land.

Cuont me in, I grew veg for the first time last year, and I'm hooked - just got me an allotment, even the family is interested. Small one did everything with me last year and is very keen, husband surprised both of us by getting interested once he found I really didn't expect him to do all the digging. Its' my project and any help is welcome.

When I have visitors of the right sort, I inviet them to turn over a spadeful of earth so that I can later say 'the beans (or whatever) aer growing in the bed X helped dig', and when I'm in tuoch with X I tell them how the crop is going. They all seem to like this notion, and one who helped last year wants to come for a weekend and help me with the lotty now (I am a lifestyle pusher. All my friends say so.) I also get pleasure from sharing the task, even symbolically, with others, and it's been a nice way to open new ground.

Seed saving - totally! I buy organic seeds where poss, find the Organic Gardeners Catalogue are excellent, and save seeds from lots of things. Some aer easy - courgettes, squash and pumpkins, beans, peppers. Maybe this year I'll try sme from some of the harder things. It's lovely to feel self-sufficient at least in bean and squash seeds - and somehow I suspect the OGC don't mind a bit. Besides, there's always something else to grow that I havent' tried before...

I get very grad ideas about the number of beds I can handle, but I'll start at one corner of the Lottie and see how far I get this year. I confess it was a buzz to go down to take possession and find a row of leeks and a great stand of beans, dried in their pods, ready for harvest. The beans are scarlet runners - they're pink and black like a 1970's bathroom, and very silly; I've been giving them to friends who garden a little bit and telling them they'll get a good cow for them. Hopefully some will plant them and get hooked themselves.

Last year I did well with the pumpkin germination, so I gave a seedling to each child in my daughter's class, and I still get folk in the village come up to me and say 'Are you the pumpkin lady? We got a pumpkin off uor plant! Thank you!' with pleasure and evident surprise at the outcome. This year I'm likely to give them all magic beans. They are so very pink.

Did I mention I'm a lifestyle pusher?

Happy gardening, all.

P.S. Jerusalem artichokes are yummy.

I?m looking at the idea of permaculture. I got a little plot set up (currently buried under the snow). Having a tad bit of trouble finding a supplier and set of plant that will survive here (and that my wife thinks are eatable).

I did hear that although Northern climates have a shorter growing season, that in fact everything grows much quicker once it starts due to the increased day length!

Guess keeping stuff from one year to the next will be the biggest problem.

Tattercoats - I love your approach to gardening! We've handed out sunflower seeds. & some raspberry thinnings!

Sally wrote: So last year I grew veg on 3 beds each 6'x8' . This year we have created 2 more one 4'x22' and the other 8'x22'!

I've been planting vegetables for 3 years now, but nothing on this scale. My best sucess was growing peppers last year from seeds saved from the year before. This year I plan to grow more peppers, french beans (saved seeds), broccolli, sweetcorn and potatoes in compost bags. I've already got overwintering onions and broad beans growing from last Autumn. Oh and of course tomatoes.

tattercoats wrote: Last year I did well with the pumpkin germination, so I gave a seedling to each child in my daughter's class, and I still get folk in the village come up to me and say 'Are you the pumpkin lady? We got a pumpkin off uor plant! Thank you!' with pleasure and evident surprise at the outcome. This year I'm likely to give them all magic beans. They are so very pink.

I planted pumpkins last year, and also gave seedlings to my daughters friends (she's 4), unfortunately I didn't do any research on how pumpkins grow. I naively thought that 1 seed = 1 pumpkin not 1 garden dominating vine, you live and learn. We ate the last pumpkin in a soup last week.

P.S. Jerusalem artichokes are yummy.

Glad to hear that, Tattercoats.

We're turning a corner over to a Forest Garden, with loads of perenials that, supposedly, don't need any attention. Jerusalem artichokes are to be one of the mainstays to possibly replace all or some of our spuds.

We've still got spuds in the ground, covered with plastic (if you look after it it lasts for years, honest ), so we just dig them up when we want them. That way there's no problem with finding space to store them. Works if you don't get very cold temperatures. Snow isn't a problem because it insulates, frost is the worst. Squashs keep very well in the cellar, well worth the space, they're worse than pumkins.

We've got broad beans and Japanese onions in the ground ready for a quick take of in the spring and ordinary onions sprouting in cells indoors. Also got peppers and aubergines in trays indoors with salads all to go out into the polytunnel or greenhouse. Toms are on the way as well. You can buy greenhouses very cheaply second hand - you need access to a trailer for moving them.

A decent trailer in a good buy (together with a towing hook) for collecting all sorts of free or cheap stuff for reuse. We are using slabwood, the offcuts from squaring up trees in a sawmill, mostly oak, to form the sides of deep beds for the garden - there are a lot of good clean planks in it. It's about ?10/tonne, collected so our trailer earns it's keep. What we can't use gets burnt on the fire.

We're just starting with the polytunnel, this year will be our first full year. The aim for this year is to keep it full all year round. We left the tom's in too late last autumn and didn't get the winter stuff in soon enough. Still there should be a year or two before we have to rely on it.

Must keep the deer off the carrots this year. The buggers uprooted the lot last year. They don't seem to like parsnips though. The venison tasted good! We've had one roe and the guy who does the shooting has had five. He can keep coming up until he has cleared the muntjaks, they're evil little so and so's, and sneak in through the tiniest hole.

We can sell any excess we grow. My daughter takes stuff to work and it disappears. Environmental Health Officers seem to appreciate good food for some reason. They also take loads of our beef. My wife takes stuff to church as well.

Grazing land is very cheap to rent (many people are happy just to have someone grazing it) and very available. Three of us are getting together to buy some store lambs to fatten on free grass this spring. One of the guys does pork, so, with our cattle on the common, we'll be self sufficient in meat as well.

Cooperating helps a lot, lightens the work load and makes it more fun and less solitary, like allotment societies. Thinks- must get the ecovillage off the ground soon.

Ramble over, time for bed!!

Since buying our house 2 1/2 years ago I have been progressively
(but very slowly) reclaiming the ground from the ten years of
natural progression that the previous owner had allowed unchecked.
I have cut most of the trees (and saved for firewood), but the
roots are going to be hard to dig out. (especially the yew).
We do intend to plant veg, and we managed a token quantity last year.
My wife has ordered plenty of seeds and seed potatoes, but
for health reasons almost all the physical work will be done by me .
At least my other half will be on hand to hoe out the weeds this time,
when we had an allotment the ten minute walk was disincentive
enough to let the weeds get well ahead of the crops...

I'm planning on a 2-week permaculture course later this year.

Then I just need to get out of London and sort myself out some land!

I'm hoping to do one in Cork later this year... if I make it! Not booked yet. Where are you doing your one?

Has anyone else been on one of these courses? What do you think?

PS I've edited my first post to put a couple of pictures in it.

The pics look good Sally - especially the greenhouse! Nice raised beds!

We went on a five-day permaculture course last August down in Hampshire (a bit further to travel than Cork). It was run by Patrick Whitefield, who was brilliant. If you did a search for "Patrick Whitefield permaculture courses", you might find something...

Also, doesn't the college where Rob Hopkins worked near Kinsale run a two-year permaculture course. Maybe they do a short intro version.

This is the one I am contemplating:

http://www.westcorkpermaculture.org/

Has anyone done a Permaculture Design Course like this one?
I have Patrick Whitefield's book now. I imagine he'd be a good teacher.

Sally