Stocking up on tinned stuff?

DominicJ · Post by **DominicJ** » 16 Feb 2011, 11:27

adam2 wrote:Tinned tuna in oil is my favourite to hoard.

Tunas a lot more expensive than it used to be.
My Dogs have tins of sardines in oil, which are about 45p from Asda, cheaper is available elsewhere.
Sadly, I cant stand most fish, and trying to eat new foods isnt the best start to a crisis.

postie · Post by **postie** » 16 Feb 2011, 15:33

adam2 wrote: Golden syrup in tins keeps well and is perhaps better than sugar as the cans are vermin proof, unlike sugar packets.

Tesco's do quite cheap golden syrup in jars (about 65p if memory is correct), which I guess are equally vermin proof. The jars can be used afterwards too.

As for the mentions earlier about varied diet and having to eat only beans, yup, I fully understand that, and I think there may have been (bean!

) some confusion about what i meant. Beans were an example. I have loads of different things, not just beans. "I like beans on toast as much as anyone, but not for breakfast dinner and tea" ( a quote from a Billy Bragg song)

We have tins of sardines and mackerel, tuna in oil (as the oil can be used elsewhere as already mentioned), noodles, loadsa pasta (half kilo Penne in Tesco's, 29p!) Various soups, tinned fruit - pears, pineapples. Tinned tomatoes.. not because they're hugely calorific, but they can be added to stuff to make it more palatable. A tin of Toms chucked over some pasta would be better than just the pasta. There's lots more too, condiments and salt for example, but even these are from the value range.

But we are in the early stages of stocking up, so we're still learning, and will be adding things like spam and curries in future. For now though, due to a very tight budget we're going to have to carry on with the absolute basic value brands stuff, and even then it really is just a can or 2 a week.

DominicJ · Post by **DominicJ** » 16 Feb 2011, 15:39

Postie
Its properly useful to be able to not shop for a couple of weeks (or cut 3/4 off your bill).
We had about £1500 of unexpected bills in december and january.

500g pasta, 30p, sauce, 70p, 8 sausages, 75p.
4 adult meals no problem.

Useful when you've got 20 jars of pasta sauce.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 16 Feb 2011, 16:19

What is the consensus on how much rice, flour,pasta, & oat meal to store (per capita)and the preferred storage container and packing method? I've seen a lot about this on other sites and wonder if the Power Switchers have a different take on it.

featherstick · Post by **featherstick** » 16 Feb 2011, 18:55

I don't have the recommended amounts to hand, but you'll find a long thread on Ludlow Survivors Group forum about amounts. Ideally, I'd like to store grains etc in vacuum-sealed packs in a robust bin, each pack enough for a few meals. This needs a bit more investment though i.e. a good quality vacuum sealer.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 17 Feb 2011, 00:46

featherstick wrote:I don't have the recommended amounts to hand, but you'll find a long thread on Ludlow Survivors Group forum about amounts. Ideally, I'd like to store grains etc in vacuum-sealed packs in a robust bin, each pack enough for a few meals. This needs a bit more investment though i.e. a good quality vacuum sealer.

I use five gallon plastic pails with snap on lids. I don't bother with vac sealing or excluding oxygen with dry ice as I rotate the stock. I also have some 2.3 gallon steel tins that chips and popcorn come in. I fill them with dried peas and beans still in their original plastic bags. Both make excellent mouse proof storage. I don't have as much on hand now as I once did. perhaps 25 lbs of flour and 25 lbs.of rice, 10 of corn meal and 10 of beans and 5 of peas. Canned goods come and go with probably 100 cans and jars as a minimum plus a chest freezer that is level full. As the price of food begins to soar I may invest in fully stocking my storage as within reason it will gain value as it sits on the shelf and the cost of replacing it rises.

DominicJ · Post by **DominicJ** » 17 Feb 2011, 09:09

VT
http://www.alpharubicon.com/~stryder/beans.htm

The Rubies seem to seriously know their stuff, although they have fairly different circumstances than we do, in that they believe things will pick up afterwards....

Apparently the Mormons say 50lbs of pasta a year, but I personaly eat well more than that.
I'd be looking at 90-100 kilograms if it was my main source of calories, a year, per person.
But then they also store rice and grains as well.

I probably have more like 10kg of pasta and 5 of rice, (we ate the rice stock and didnt replace it).

I'm off work tomorrow so I think I'm gonna do some organising in the kitchen.

Storage containers for me are currently jsut what it was in when I bought it, or plastic containers if the packs are open. Its stored in my kitchen, vermin arent a problem.

hardworkinghippy · Post by **hardworkinghippy** » 17 Feb 2011, 10:19

I got this link from a permaculture site - food for a year.

http://www.wildlandfire.com/docs/2005/food05.htm

I don't agree with buying so much but then we're lucky I guess to have the chance to feed ourselves with what we've got and we're used to stashing food.

I guess this is where my preps for PO and my "eat local/organic/homegrown" values tie in together and some of you might not be too concerned about the latter. Obviously, I'd prefer not to buy commercially made food and I suppose I shouldn't force my values on other people. But if you can grow food or get food while it's cheaper and in season why not sterilise or store it somehow yourself ?

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 17 Feb 2011, 11:30

Thanks for the links guys but that was not what I was after. I've been at this a while and have always been an independent sort. I've read several of those lists and some are quite good. I think the list from the Mormon site is perhaps the most complete.
I have already done things like plant 50 lbs of potatoes and getting 2000 lbs yield. I've also been hit by blight and lost the whole of my tomato and potato crop. Gardening ,canning, freezing, chickens , beef, butchering, hunting, reloading, Yeah been there ,done that ,wore out the tee shirt.
What I was interested in was your UK take on the matter of food storage to see how seriously you take the issue and who's list you think is the best. The next question is how much do you personally have on hand today in late winter with the Middle east in turmoil.
I ask because in just a few days of reading and posting on Power Switch I have become reacquainted with the vast difference in view points between Americans and you Brits. For example on a thread about choosing a new car a Subaru Forester was considered a gas hog. In America they are considered an over priced but fuel efficient car and the Subaru Legacy AWD wagon was the top selling new car in VT just a few years ago. Not that either side is wrong in their opinion just that the Americans are paying less then half what you are for fuel so when doing lifetime costs the bottom lines are different.
As we move forward and oil prices rise due to demand exceeding supply you have an advantage over me as you have already spent a decade dealing with high priced fuel and have already tried options and sorted out winners from losers. I am just trying to pick your brains a bit.
So again . What do YOU think?

DominicJ · Post by **DominicJ** » 17 Feb 2011, 12:57

What I was interested in was your UK take on the matter of food storage to see how seriously you take the issue and who's list you think is the best. The next question is how much do you personally have on hand today in late winter with the Middle east in turmoil.

I think its a very serious issue, but one that rather overwhelms my ability to take seriously.
The lists are an interesting thought experiment, that I appreciate as a guide, but theres simply no way you can store much food in the UK unless you're extraordinarily wealthy and can afford a manor house or a farm.
My cooking area probably about 15x15ft, maybe 20x20, once you subtract your sink, oven/hob, washer, dryer, dishwasher, fridgefreezer, doors and radiators, you just dont have that much space left.

Having a months worth is my target, with the larder sorted, I could probably double that.

My current "storage" is fairly limited, a load of spaghetti and some pasta shapes, totaling about 10kg, about 20 jars of pasta sauce, a few other assorted tins, 5kg rice, a huge quantity of spices (500g of curry powder lasts a long time...).

I dont consider middle east turmoil to be that relevent, the oil taps arent going to be turned off even if Iran extends as far west as Morroco this time next week.

As we move forward and oil prices rise due to demand exceeding supply you have an advantage over me as you have already spent a decade dealing with high priced fuel and have already tried options and sorted out winners from losers. I am just trying to pick your brains a bit.
So again.

I think I'd be better off paying £50 a month for petrol and £80 on other things, rather than £130 on petrol.
It provides quite an incentive to change, but robs much of the capital I'd like to use to do so.
The irony being I could afford an efficient car if petrol were cheaper....

What do YOU think?

That anything is better than nothing. Having a months food doesnt solve a 3 month food gap, but its a start.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 17 Feb 2011, 13:47

DominicJ wrote:
What do YOU think?
That anything is better than nothing. Having a months food doesnt solve a 3 month food gap, but its a start.

Absolutely, It gives you thirty days to work the problem if nothing else.
Space for an apartment dweller is indeed a problem. I've seen shelves made from milk crates stacked with boards between them and each crate filled with essentials also end tables and ottomans that were hollow and filled with packaged rice. You don't want the place to look like a doomsday bunker but just a cabinet that fills the space between the top of the fridge and the ceiling well packed could hold quite a bit.

MrG · Post by **MrG** » 17 Feb 2011, 14:38

What I was interested in was your UK take on the matter of food storage to see how seriously you take the issue and who's list you think is the best. The next question is how much do you personally have on hand today in late winter with the Middle east in turmoil.

It's a good point. I always said if TSHTF it'd make a big difference to me what time of year it happened.

September.. Dim problem... Late February.. much more of an issue.

postie · Post by **postie** » 19 Feb 2011, 14:25

DominicJ wrote: My cooking area probably about 15x15ft, maybe 20x20, once you subtract your sink, oven/hob, washer, dryer, dishwasher, fridgefreezer, doors and radiators, you just dont have that much space left.

Having a months worth is my target, with the larder sorted, I could probably double that.

Sounds about the same size as ours. We have one main cupboard we use to "short-term" store stuff. It's not easily accessible so the kids aren't tempted to help themselves. ( It's head height above the fridge)

When that is full, (as it has been once since we started stocking up) We decant everything from that cupboard into boxes and inventory them. Similar stuff we try and put in with other similar stuff. The boxes i picked up from a catering place and they stack ( plastic mushroom boxes) and are just slightly higher than a normal sized can.. which is useful. I also have some old wooden fruit boxes rescued from a traders skip, which i reckon serves a dual purpose of becoming kindling once empty of tins.
Anyhows, the boxes, once full, then get moved into the loft. It frees up a cupboard, it also means we can't easily be tempted to dip into the store ourselves.

We have about 5 boxes now in the loft. Which aint much at all.. but we have just started. The kitchen cupboard is now about one tenth full again.

I know not everyone has a loft. But other places in the house could be used I guess.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 19 Feb 2011, 15:00

postie wrote:[
We have about 5 boxes now in the loft. Which aint much at all.. but we have just started. The kitchen cupboard is now about one tenth full again.

.

How many days could you get by on the contents of those five boxes and how many would you like to have up there.

postie · Post by **postie** » 19 Feb 2011, 15:38

vtsnowedin wrote:
postie wrote:[
We have about 5 boxes now in the loft. Which aint much at all.. but we have just started. The kitchen cupboard is now about one tenth full again.

.
How many days could you get by on the contents of those five boxes and how many would you like to have up there.

ah.. there's the question!

Presuming we had about a weeks worth of stuff in the house.. the 5 boxes wouldn't really last us more than 2 weeks. There's 4 of us living here btw. 2 adults, 2 kids.

If it really was a case of TSHTF, then I guess you'd ration yourself quiet severely and we might be able to eke the supplies out a bit longer.

(It's roughly 20 cans of stuff to a box)