What guns to buy? and related posts.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 25 Feb 2020, 19:12

vtsnowedin wrote:
Vortex2 wrote:
A car door at fifty yards
.. so a perp would be somewhat discombobulated by that ..
to say the least. Closer ranges like the width of a bedroom and the whole shot cluster goes through in one very large hole.

Never quite sure about the concept of a shotgun in quarters this tight.

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 25 Feb 2020, 19:33

Being a semi-autistic techie I have found through theoretical analysis and practical tests that the US BB size pellets are the optimum load to deal with most problems that I personally might expect to encounter.

A hard hitting bunch of 40 or so pellets very effective out to 65 yards.

The 9 pellets of 00 buck (UK SG) are much more powerful but at distance they spread out too far.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 25 Feb 2020, 20:18

vortex2 wrote: A hard hitting bunch of 40 or so pellets very effective out to 65 yards.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 25 Feb 2020, 20:28

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
It isn't legal to use 00 buck on 2 legged varmints at very far distances here in the US anyway, so sounds like it is a load appropriately designed for the varmint!

What is legal for two legged varmints at distance if your not a cop?
Another point. The sound of a pump action shotgun having a round chambered behind the door is often enough to clear a room or hallway with no need to fire.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 25 Feb 2020, 21:15

vtsnowedin wrote:
ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
It isn't legal to use 00 buck on 2 legged varmints at very far distances here in the US anyway, so sounds like it is a load appropriately designed for the varmint!
What is legal for two legged varmints at distance if your not a cop?

Two answers to that one.
1) Absolutely nothing if the varmint isn't threatening at long distance.
2) Anything you want if they are EFFECTIVELY threatening.

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 25 Feb 2020, 21:39

Vortex2 wrote:
Being a semi-autistic techie I have found through theoretical analysis and practical tests that the US BB size pellets are the optimum load to deal with most problems that I personally might expect to encounter.

Squirrel, rabbits, turkey, the occasional groundhog that I could sneak up on, sure.

OK, stand at say 50 metres from me and I'll fire a semi-magnum 12-bore US BB load at you.

You won't be going home in a healthy state.

Shotguns are effing evil.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 25 Feb 2020, 22:02

Vortex2 wrote: Shotguns are effing evil.

Good and bad are not inherent in steel, powder and shot. People give the use of a tool its moral component.

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 26 Feb 2020, 00:09

If you are defending yourself against an armed intruder the best thing to do is kill them and be sure of it. Real life is not a B horror movie where the heroine in tattered miniskirt knocks out the bad guy with a fire extinguisher then leaves him without picking up his gun and finishing him only to have him rise up and catch her down the hall for a dramatic fight scene.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 26 Feb 2020, 00:40

vtsnowedin wrote:If you are defending yourself against an armed intruder the best thing to do is kill them and be sure of it.

And then do CPR?

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 07 Mar 2020, 18:04

Back from a gun show. No cheap 22s but scored a box of 7x57s in 175gr. corelokt. Not making that round now and these may date back to 1980 or so. In good condition 18 rounds for $12.00. Smile

The friend that went with me bought a Ruger version of the AR-15 new and a used Smith &Wesson 9mm pistol. Background check and paperwork all done and back over the mountain to home by noon.
Only catch was that Vermont recently passed a magazine size limit and the Ruger comes with a magazine over the limit so you get an empty hole in the box where the magazine once was. No matter we have magazines that fit.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 07 Mar 2020, 20:09

vtsnowedin wrote:Back from a gun show. No cheap 22s but scored a box of 7x57s in 175gr. corelokt. Not making that round now and these may date back to 1980 or so. In good condition 18 rounds for $12.00. Smile

Yikes! Pricey. Assuming price goes with scarcity, these things aren't all that common?

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 08 Mar 2020, 00:32

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
vtsnowedin wrote:Back from a gun show. No cheap 22s but scored a box of 7x57s in 175gr. corelokt. Not making that round now and these may date back to 1980 or so. In good condition 18 rounds for $12.00. Smile
Yikes! Pricey. Assuming price goes with scarcity, these things aren't all that common?

Not really when you consider a new box of what they are pushing now costs $22.99 and the only supply of 175 grain 7x57 comes from the former Soviet block. I'm going to use some of these for velocity and bullet testing to compare them with the currently offered wonder guns. My bias , which I hope to keep in check, is that these old loads were actually very good and nothing they are selling today is enough better to make any difference to the deer on the end of the bullets flight.

vtsnowedin wrote: Only catch was that Vermont recently passed a magazine size limit and the Ruger comes with a magazine over the limit so you get an empty hole in the box where the magazine once was. No matter we have magazines that fit.

Are old ones grandfathered in? [/quote]
Yes and if they become not... Well!! We will see how that works out.
My friend watched a guy try to buy a pistol to be told they could not sell it to him as a New York resident (just ten miles away) he could not bare that arm without a full NY permit. Hard to get unless you are a NY cop or relative.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 08 Mar 2020, 04:19

vtsnowedin wrote:I'm going to use some of these for velocity and bullet testing to compare them with the currently offered wonder guns. My bias , which I hope to keep in check, is that these old loads were actually very good and nothing they are selling today is enough better to make any difference to the deer on the end of the bullets flight.

To be honest, unless we are talking about long range competition, are small differences in ballistics anything more than academic?

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 09 Mar 2020, 21:45

To be honest, unless we are talking about long range competition, are small differences in ballistics anything more than academic?

Good point.

The base factors are fairly simple and include:

* Energy
* Lethality
* Range
* Flatness of shooting
* Total round weight
* Cost
* Availability
* Legality
* Weapon availability
* Weapon concealability
* Weapon magazine capacity
* Recoil
* Hand-loading capability
* Noise
* Subsonic capability (if reqd)
* "Exoticness" / fun factor
etc

Personally the 5.7 x 28mm and the 9mm x 39mm and maybe the Blackout .300 interest me most.

For personal defence I would be looking at a carbine with good optics and a calibre tending towards .308.

Handgun wise a FN 5.7 pistol plus a Sig 365 would keep me happy.

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 09 Mar 2020, 22:23

Vortex2 wrote: Handgun wise a FN 5.7 pistol plus a Sig 365 would keep me happy.

Never owned an FN. Are they nice?