Mortgages

Paul · Post by **Paul** » 09 Feb 2006, 12:25

I`ve no idea if this will be of use to anyone but I feel sure a PO future is so completely unknowable that anything might happen and that the more scenarios we think about the more opportunity we might have for creative action.

So how about this. After a year or two of increasing oil prices (which started last year sometime?) one of a dozen or more events happen which starts to bring down the whole economic house of cards which the world economy has been built on for the last 60 years. And just like a house of cards within a few months nothing is left standing. When I mean nothing I mean nothing- not even those safe jobs in local government or teaching will be there, if you are in the armed services or the police you may still have an income.

So you have a house with ?100,000 still owing? Don`t worry. Once reality slowly starts to take hold we will all slowly start to realise that we won`t be going back to "normal" -ever. The wealth most people thought they had in their houses and pension funds and stocks and shares will be exposed for what it has always been; devoid of foundations.

That means that your ?400,000 house with ?100,000 mortgage won`t be worth anything on the open market. Nothing at all. But it also means it is worth nothing to the company who lent you the money and certainly not worth the costs of repossession even if that were possible (our courts are snowed under at the moment, how long would it take to process 20m repossessions plus another 20m bankruptcies over credit card debits/hire purchase?) And that`s just the short term. In the medium term the UK can obviously not support a population of 60m and we face returning to a sustainable 5/10m. All those empty houses, just help your self.

Me? I qualified in regional transport planning in the `70s and within a few months of starting work just couldn't`t imagine how the system could stagger on for very much longer so I had my mortgage paid off in 2years-and now they make TV series on the subject!

I hope the above helps. It would really worry me if I had a large mortgage and a young family and was facing peak oil but if you think through it my guess is you will keep the roof over your heads.

StephenCurran (Stef) · Post by **StephenCurran (Stef)** » 10 Feb 2006, 15:42

Welcome Paul
Conas at? t? ?----Gaelic for "How are you"?
(I had to look it up to spell it!)

I wrote this big post for you, but I just deleted cos it was lot of shite
and didn't address the subject.

Mostly I just wanted to say hi and welcome ya- I don't have
or ever have had, a mortage type debt.... just all the other ones.....see ya and Good Luck

Stef

snow hope · Post by **snow hope** » 10 Feb 2006, 17:41

Paul, that is the way I saw it when I first became aware of PO. But then everybody tried to convince me that clearing all debt was an absolute number one priority.

I still have a nagging doubt about that. Anyone else care to say Paul has got the wrong end of the stick?

grinu · Post by **grinu** » 10 Feb 2006, 18:26

I'm sure I read somewhere that America has passed/is passing a bill that prevents people writing off their debts. They basically are bound to making payments to their creditors (who could buy the debt rights) until the debt is cleared. Basically - no bankruptcy. Would also be more onerous than insolvency because the original debt would eventually have to be paid. I've been trying to find some links to info but can't - can anyone point people in the right direction?

MacG · Post by **MacG** » 10 Feb 2006, 19:38

Paul wrote:That means that your ?400,000 house with ?100,000 mortgage won`t be worth anything on the open market. Nothing at all. But it also means it is worth nothing to the company who lent you the money and certainly not worth the costs of repossession even if that were possible (our courts are snowed under at the moment, how long would it take to process 20m repossessions plus another 20m bankruptcies over credit card debits/hire purchase?)

Various wholesale processes can be implemented, and suddenly there is a bunch of mean and ugly ex-army guys showing up on your doorstep explaining that they represent the new owner, and you owe them rent. Not everyone would be hit, only those with something of real value. Maybe the copper wires and the copper tubing in a house would be worth ripping out? In that case someone will buy the house for the value of the copper and rip it out.

skeptik · Post by **skeptik** » 10 Feb 2006, 19:49

grinu wrote:I've been trying to find some links to info but can't - can anyone point people in the right direction?

http://www.creditinfocenter.com/bankrup ... Laws.shtml

The ultra rich can still duck out of having to pay anything by means of a loophole in the law involving the use of trusts. (delibererately left In the law for Dubya's rich buddies)

As setting up and maintaining one of these loophole trusts costs thousands of dollars it mean po' folk cant afford them. Well worthwhile though if your assets are measured in millions.

grinu · Post by **grinu** » 11 Feb 2006, 22:19

Cheers Skeptik

fishertrop · Post by **fishertrop** » 28 Feb 2006, 14:01

Debt agencies hire more staff as crisis deepens
By Paul Farrow (Filed: 01/03/2006)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.j ... erson.html

Mark Oynett of TDX said the number of call centre staff dealing with people who had defaulted on their debts had increased by around 25 per cent.

"Those who think the debt problem is going to get better are kidding themselves. The number of delinquencies is rising, not falling," he said.