Well I've still not managed to get a stove in. The chimney stack is bowing out and needs fixing and as it is shared with next door I've been trying to get permission off their landlord to go halves on the work but he's been taking his time.
Still, the wood stack is doing well. I got a little off Freecycle and they have been thinning out the trees at work so there's some really good bits being given away.
Wood / Solid fuel burning stoves
Moderator: Peak Moderation
One for Mike and Tracy P...
http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/wood_burn ... stove.html
Should be easy for you to keep cosy with one of these.
http://www.stovesonline.co.uk/wood_burn ... stove.html
Should be easy for you to keep cosy with one of these.
Check out the hetas efficiency docs. They give you a way of comparing stove efficiencies. Something that I found really difficult.
http://www.hetas.co.uk/02_Hetas%20Guide ... 060607.pdf
Another document I have found invaluable in assessing what makes a good stove and understanding stove principal is this;
http://www.aprovecho.org/web-content/pu ... s/pub1.htm
Basically most stove efficiencies seem to give the efficiency of the stove at turning wood into heat. There is another possibly more important efficiency to consider and that is the efficiency of the stove in transfering that heat to the room. This is where masonry heaters come in, and why they are so efficient.
However the prinipals can also work on a smaller scale.
For example. We have a 7kw woodburning stove, and we also have a rayburn, which is rated when burning wood at 6kw output by HETAS. It puts only 4Kw to the room and 2Kw to the water. However the rayburn actually contributes more heat to the house than our woodburner, and this is why (I think...);
The Rayburn absorbs more of the heat created by the fire. The woodburner excels at burning wood efficiently and being super controlable. It does this by using fire bricks to ensure that the temp in the fire burning region is really high, hence encoraging the burning of secondary gasses. The hot air then goes up the chimney. A fair proportion of it heats the stove and the stove gets hot, but the fact that I can turn it right down and easily keep it in says to me that when it is running full guts then ALOT of the heat must be going straight out the top of the chimney. The rayburn however is different. The heat is absorbed by teh body of the stove and it has far greater surface area giving out heat than the woodburner. This make for a more efficient transfer of heat. We also have it against an internal wall and not in a fireplace recess. This helps with air circulation. finally we have and exposed black flue pipe which kicks out alot of heat which in the woodburner will be heating the airspace in the chimney breast!!!!!!
So, installation is as important as stove in my opinion. I think siting a woodburner in the room as opposed to in a fireplace is more efficient. If you can use a flue pipe that is exposed rather than putting it up the chimney then that will incorage transfer of heat too.
Just my 2p worth.
http://www.hetas.co.uk/02_Hetas%20Guide ... 060607.pdf
Another document I have found invaluable in assessing what makes a good stove and understanding stove principal is this;
http://www.aprovecho.org/web-content/pu ... s/pub1.htm
Basically most stove efficiencies seem to give the efficiency of the stove at turning wood into heat. There is another possibly more important efficiency to consider and that is the efficiency of the stove in transfering that heat to the room. This is where masonry heaters come in, and why they are so efficient.
However the prinipals can also work on a smaller scale.
For example. We have a 7kw woodburning stove, and we also have a rayburn, which is rated when burning wood at 6kw output by HETAS. It puts only 4Kw to the room and 2Kw to the water. However the rayburn actually contributes more heat to the house than our woodburner, and this is why (I think...);
The Rayburn absorbs more of the heat created by the fire. The woodburner excels at burning wood efficiently and being super controlable. It does this by using fire bricks to ensure that the temp in the fire burning region is really high, hence encoraging the burning of secondary gasses. The hot air then goes up the chimney. A fair proportion of it heats the stove and the stove gets hot, but the fact that I can turn it right down and easily keep it in says to me that when it is running full guts then ALOT of the heat must be going straight out the top of the chimney. The rayburn however is different. The heat is absorbed by teh body of the stove and it has far greater surface area giving out heat than the woodburner. This make for a more efficient transfer of heat. We also have it against an internal wall and not in a fireplace recess. This helps with air circulation. finally we have and exposed black flue pipe which kicks out alot of heat which in the woodburner will be heating the airspace in the chimney breast!!!!!!
So, installation is as important as stove in my opinion. I think siting a woodburner in the room as opposed to in a fireplace is more efficient. If you can use a flue pipe that is exposed rather than putting it up the chimney then that will incorage transfer of heat too.
Just my 2p worth.
Jim
For every complex problem, there is a simple answer, and it's wrong.
"Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs" (Lao Tzu V.i).
For every complex problem, there is a simple answer, and it's wrong.
"Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs" (Lao Tzu V.i).
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kenneal - lagger
- Site Admin
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- Contact:
We had a flat top Clearview stove that was highly efficient but didn't heat the room to the same extent that a previous domed stove of similar size did. I changed some of the insulated flue for single wall and painted the whole lot matt black with cylinder block paint. That made quite a difference.
My daughter has now inherited the Clearview and has about 1.5m of black single wall flue on it before the insulated section goes through the roof. They seem to get quite a bit of heat out of it like that.
My daughter has now inherited the Clearview and has about 1.5m of black single wall flue on it before the insulated section goes through the roof. They seem to get quite a bit of heat out of it like that.
That is how mine is installed. Single black flue and spray with stove paint. It easily warms the whole downstairs, but I did oversize it for my use. It gives 7 to room and 6 to rads and tank. Something like that, I thought to myself when getting it that;
1 the quality of the wood would only ever lower the kw as manufacturers would probably state the best used.
2 that these numbers were probably based on running the stove hard. In reality no-one does that. Hence if you give the fire a burn then slow it down, even to a level or rate that wood burns on an open fire then your KW again will drastically drop.
So I oversized a bit, but bought a good stove to have control. I probably output 4kw to room and 4kw to tank and rads on average. Clearview say to burn the fire at 500c thats bollocks. Thats slamming it hard with a boiler in it. That may keep the glass clean with a back boiler but you'd burn ?140 or 3cu worth of wood a month! As for the flue not performing as well with lower temp fires ie 350 thats not my expierence. Burnt last year, swept it this year and had hardly nowt out, most of what I did have out was the anthracite I had given me. My flue is internal, insulated with purlite and in 225mm enginering brick chimney, so that problably helps plus it goes out almost vertical, slight dog leg for rain.
The only thing thats a pain is the fact no matter what temp you burn, if you got a back boiler the glass gets dirty and you need to do the ash trick to clean it. Still very happy with mine, would not be without it, especially when real winter comes. If anything I wish I could have had the 28mm flow and return running more vertical than vertical and across ceiling joists to the tank. I got a pump with stats on the 22mm rad run, but with the right wood and if I open the puppy up I can make the water in my boiler bubble - this does worry me becasue if the stats fail or pump and I'm out and for some unknown reason the fire leaked air then I would not want steam to build up and baaaa bang - it should vent in the loft first, but like I said the 4.5m run of horizontal 28 dont help even though it thermoshpyons brilliant.
1 the quality of the wood would only ever lower the kw as manufacturers would probably state the best used.
2 that these numbers were probably based on running the stove hard. In reality no-one does that. Hence if you give the fire a burn then slow it down, even to a level or rate that wood burns on an open fire then your KW again will drastically drop.
So I oversized a bit, but bought a good stove to have control. I probably output 4kw to room and 4kw to tank and rads on average. Clearview say to burn the fire at 500c thats bollocks. Thats slamming it hard with a boiler in it. That may keep the glass clean with a back boiler but you'd burn ?140 or 3cu worth of wood a month! As for the flue not performing as well with lower temp fires ie 350 thats not my expierence. Burnt last year, swept it this year and had hardly nowt out, most of what I did have out was the anthracite I had given me. My flue is internal, insulated with purlite and in 225mm enginering brick chimney, so that problably helps plus it goes out almost vertical, slight dog leg for rain.
The only thing thats a pain is the fact no matter what temp you burn, if you got a back boiler the glass gets dirty and you need to do the ash trick to clean it. Still very happy with mine, would not be without it, especially when real winter comes. If anything I wish I could have had the 28mm flow and return running more vertical than vertical and across ceiling joists to the tank. I got a pump with stats on the 22mm rad run, but with the right wood and if I open the puppy up I can make the water in my boiler bubble - this does worry me becasue if the stats fail or pump and I'm out and for some unknown reason the fire leaked air then I would not want steam to build up and baaaa bang - it should vent in the loft first, but like I said the 4.5m run of horizontal 28 dont help even though it thermoshpyons brilliant.
Looks good! I expect the white tiles behind the fire help too.
Our wood burner is installed like this;
It's a bit tighter, and there is a pocket of air that gets very hot up below the registration plate. This heats the registration plate which looses heat to the air in the chimney. I should like to line the back of the fireplace with some reflective material, and put rockwool and stainless steel under the register plate to help guide the heat out of the fireplace recess.
The rayburn however as you can see is free to transfer as much heat as it produces with nothing to restrict it....
Our wood burner is installed like this;
It's a bit tighter, and there is a pocket of air that gets very hot up below the registration plate. This heats the registration plate which looses heat to the air in the chimney. I should like to line the back of the fireplace with some reflective material, and put rockwool and stainless steel under the register plate to help guide the heat out of the fireplace recess.
The rayburn however as you can see is free to transfer as much heat as it produces with nothing to restrict it....
Jim
For every complex problem, there is a simple answer, and it's wrong.
"Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs" (Lao Tzu V.i).
For every complex problem, there is a simple answer, and it's wrong.
"Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs" (Lao Tzu V.i).
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emordnilap
- Posts: 14815
- Joined: 05 Sep 2007, 16:36
- Location: here
The thermostat on the back boiler exit pipe, the one that kicks in the pump, is it possible to buy a good one. I mean is there a choice where 'you get what you pay for'?
Mine seems to be of cheap quality and doesn't want kick in when it should.
I can't seem to find any on the web but there again I might be putting the wrong search terms in.
Mine seems to be of cheap quality and doesn't want kick in when it should.
I can't seem to find any on the web but there again I might be putting the wrong search terms in.
I got a danfoss type AT pipe/cylinder stat costs only ?14 had it from dougfield. Does the job and always kicks in. Just remember to set it to correspond to 80-90 degs on the flow about 300mm coming out of the boiler. Mine works out at 67 degs at its location to match 90 300mm from the boiler. My stat is behind the bookcase in my photo, along with the pump etc. Top qual ones that look horrible but can be placed near ie 300mm are ?40-60.
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RenewableCandy
- Posts: 12777
- Joined: 12 Sep 2007, 12:13
- Location: York
Yep thats our Lakeland Terrier. He's a cracking dog, fully grown there. Lakies are awesome dogs, big dog ina smaller package, can out run and out jump most of the big dogs, you'd never think it lol. They are hunters, but mine is just a pet 
Its good PO dog, but I would have rathered an Airedale, and still might get one in two years time, two dogs lol. Lots of work though stripping their coats, but you get used to it. Lakies are great alarm dogs and fearless, easy to train, cheeky funny dogs, great with people and other dogs, providing you socialise them from 10 weeks old
Here's a few more of him
As a pup
Growing up
Its good PO dog, but I would have rathered an Airedale, and still might get one in two years time, two dogs lol. Lots of work though stripping their coats, but you get used to it. Lakies are great alarm dogs and fearless, easy to train, cheeky funny dogs, great with people and other dogs, providing you socialise them from 10 weeks old Here's a few more of him
As a pup
Growing up
Last edited by MisterE on 25 Oct 2007, 17:12, edited 3 times in total.
Friend of mine has one. Very compact but absolutely packed with muscle. Great little dogs. I like Welshies as well, also a very sturdy little terrier.MisterE wrote:Yep thats our Lakeland Terrier. He's a cracking dog, fully grown there. Lakies are awesome dogs, big dog ina smaller package, can out run and out jump most of the big dogs, you'd never think it lol. They are hunters, but mine is just a pet :-)
Suss
Yep the welshy's are great. I'm welsh but got a Lakie lol. Also the welshy's have a nicer coat I think, they keep their colours, Lakies can look a bit washed out. But I prefer the Lakie head, and I prefer the Lakie personality If that makes any sense - as one Welshy owner put it when I was deciding between the two, your a Lakie owner go get one
If that makes any sense - as one Welshy owner put it when I was deciding between the two, your a Lakie owner go get one muwhahahaaa I just read that - I often tease the boys that Scotts failer to the North pole was he didnt have dogs, they said why and I said "you cna eat them" its food that works for you! Then I looked at the dog, looked at them, said mmmm yum yum Peak Oil - they went nuts!RenewableCandy wrote:Put the Chopsticks down, slowly, now step away from the Dog...
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RenewableCandy
- Posts: 12777
- Joined: 12 Sep 2007, 12:13
- Location: York
You could always train him to kill the grey sqirrels instead of merely terrorising them!MisterE wrote:muwhahahaaa I just read that - I often tease the boys that Scotts failer to the North pole was he didnt have dogs, they said why and I said "you cna eat them" its food that works for you! Then I looked at the dog, looked at them, said mmmm yum yum Peak Oil - they went nuts!RenewableCandy wrote:Put the Chopsticks down, slowly, now step away from the Dog...