New coronavirus in/from China

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:02

Whereas, if this lock-down had been done intelligently with only the elderly and those with comorbidities quarantined, it would have been far more easy to manage and maintain, the economy would have not been reduced to a smoldering ruin and herd immunity would be achieved in a couple of months for the vast majority of the population, thus making it much safer much sooner for the elderly and those with comorbidities to re-emerge from quarantine.

As it is, as well as being implemented unintelligently and too late, it is now looking to be breaking down entirely with all of the consequences that entails.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:12

clv101 wrote: That *most* people spend every penny (or more!) that they earn, irrespective of how much they earn, is a significant contribution to the fragility of modern society.

My wife has an old friend (went to school together) who works for Rolls Royce, as does her husband. Between them they earn seven times our combined income. But they spend it all. He's got a shiny BMW, she's got a nice Mercedes, and they've got another BMW that they share (why they need three cars is beyond me). They've also just moved to a larger house. He is basically a compulsive spender, so even though he earns more than twice what I did when I was a software engineer, every penny gets spent. And she's going nuts because she works so much and doesn't get quality time with her kids. Both are depressed. It's insane.

We both work part-time, doing jobs we enjoy, making do with what we've got. We are so much happier than they are.

And yet I do understand it a little. In my old life I was earning Â£30K (ten years ago), I was mostly single, and had no idea where I was going. I just wasted my money on partying, trying to stay sane because I hated the treadmill of my job. When you're in it, it is very hard to see a way out.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:14

clv101 wrote:I think the lockdown is breaking down, the behavioural scientists were right. An NHS friend in London shared some photos of her morning bus ride. Lower deck *full*, photo from upstairs shows street packed again, normality.

Where I am most people are still social distancing quite effectively. They aren't following the rules of the lockdown though.

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:16

clv101 wrote:I think the lockdown is breaking down, the behavioural scientists were right. An NHS friend in London shared some photos of her morning bus ride. Lower deck *full*, photo from upstairs shows street packed again, normality.

At which point you have to ask yourself what the point is in keeping all the non-essential businesses shut down. If people are going to break the spirit of the lockdown, why pay them to not work?

UndercoverElephant · Post by **UndercoverElephant** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:30

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52389285

Coronavirus: Social restrictions 'to remain for rest of year'

I very much doubt it. There's no way people are going to continue to respect the social restrictions beyond June.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 22 Apr 2020, 20:43

Yep. Not a chance. If they try and impose this past May, there will be serious trouble.

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:27

Geneva survey suggests 5.5% antibody prevalence

Even if way out, this study joins the many others which suggest that NO massive hidden population of infected & recovered exists.

https://www.hug-ge.ch/medias/communique ... estimation

(in French)

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:33

Would you wear end-user full scale PPE in public?

I want to return to work sometime, but I'm in an at-risk group.

I would be sort of happy to wear a PPE suit with full face mask during the day.

Better to earn money and survive - but sadly looking like a prat.

Would you do it?

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:37

As far as I can see we still have no proof that herd immunity can be achieved. If I've missed something could someone post a link please ?

ReserveGrowthRulz · Post by **ReserveGrowthRulz** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:37

Little John wrote:Yep. Not a chance. If they try and impose this past May, there will be serious trouble.

Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:38

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
UndercoverElephant wrote: And yet I do understand it a little. In my old life I was earning Â£30K (ten years ago), I was mostly single, and had no idea where I was going. I just wasted my money on partying, trying to stay sane because I hated the treadmill of my job. When you're in it, it is very hard to see a way out.
Escapism, you know, pretend you know something about geology, sing from the hymnal in the church of peak oil, pretend the world is going to end...etc etc.

Change the record, please.

Little John · Post by **Little John** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:41

Catweazle wrote:As far as I can see we still have no proof that herd immunity can be achieved. If I've missed something could someone post a link please ?

You have no proof that it cannot be achieved but overwhelming evidence that herd immunity, partial to whole, is the usual outcome of a viral pandemic.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:42

Little John wrote:
Catweazle wrote:As far as I can see we still have no proof that herd immunity can be achieved. If I've missed something could someone post a link please ?
You have no proof that it cannot be achieved but plenty of evidence that herd immunity, partial to whole, is the usual outcome of a pandemic.

It hasn't happened with AIDS. In fact we're still waiting for a vaccine.

Vortex2 · Post by **Vortex2** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:56

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
Little John wrote:Yep. Not a chance. If they try and impose this past May, there will be serious trouble.
Really? Serious trouble? What does that mean in an unarmed nation, you write letters to the editor? And use exclamation points frequently?

There are almost 2 million legal firearms in the UK, in a population of 67 million.

https://www.ecnmy.org/engage/the-uk-has ... ght-think/

vtsnowedin · Post by **vtsnowedin** » 22 Apr 2020, 21:56

Vortex2 wrote:Would you wear end-user full scale PPE in public?

I want to return to work sometime, but I'm in an at-risk group.

I would be sort of happy to wear a PPE suit with full face mask during the day.

Better to earn money and survive - but sadly looking like a prat.

Would you do it?

A man, to provide for his family, will endure many demeaning things and circumstances. If others were in the same boat so you were not singled out I expect I would if needed. That of course after seeking all better alternatives for a high risk person and finding none.