Diplomatic WikiLeaks

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MacG
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Post by MacG »

woodpecker wrote:"no mention who pays for it."

There were lots of mentions of who pays for it a year ago, when the home page was just an appeal for funds, which lasted for several months, with no other info up there owing to their desperation for money.

The people who pay for it are individuals, journalists etc. etc., who send in a few quid each year to keep the show on the road.
Well, the WikiLeaks thing is a well designed narrative, but when trying to find some facts everything get pretty confused. Looking in the web archive from 2008:

http://web.archive.org/web/200803142044 ... eaks:About

Things like:

"Who is behind Wikileaks?
Wikileaks was founded by Chinese dissidents, journalists, mathematicians and startup company technologists, from the US, Taiwan, Europe, Australia and South Africa.

Our public Advisory Board, which is still in formation, includes courageous journalists, representatives from refugee communities, ethics and anti-corruption campaigners, including a former national head of Transparency International, human rights campaigners, lawyers and cryptographers."


They try to ride piggyback on the open source movement, but I just cant belive in their story. It just looks like spin. Tossing fancy words around for gullible souls to gobble up.
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woodpecker
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Post by woodpecker »

"They try to ride piggyback on the open source movement, but I just cant belive in their story. It just looks like spin."

Various bits about Ben Laurie:

**

Ben Laurie is a founding director of The Apache Software Foundation, a core team member of OpenSSL, a member of the Shmoo Group, a director of the Open Rights Group, Director of Security at The Bunker Secure Hosting, Trustee and Founder-member of FreeBMD, a committer at FreeBSD and Advisory Board member of WikiLeaks.org.[1]

Ben wrote Apache-SSL, the basis of most SSL-enabled versions of the Apache HTTP Server and is a co-author of OpenPGP:SDK.

(from his Wikipedia entry)

**

Would you say Ben is *not* part of the open source movement? Or that somehow while he might be involved in open source he's somehow the unknowing victim of piggybacking?
2 As and a B
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Post by 2 As and a B »

What I find most interesting about this - and I have looked at a few of the cables, so am speaking from personal experience rather than an opinion based on tidbits thrown out by the media - is that the cables lay bare the secret discussions and private opinions that US government officials have been having. Here's a good one - what Mossad was thinking in 2007:
--------------------------------------------- ----
IRAN: DAGAN REVIEWS ISRAEL'S FIVE PILLAR STRATEGY
--------------------------------------------- ----

¶10. (S) Dagan led discussion on Iran by pointing out that the
U.S. and Israel have different timetables concerning when
Iran is likely to acquire a nuclear capability. He clarified
that the Israel Atomic Energy Commission's (IAEC) timetable
is purely technical in nature, while the Mossad's considers
other factors, including the regime's determination to
succeed. While Dagan acknowledged that there is still time
to "resolve" the Iran nuclear crisis, he stressed that Iran
is making a great effort to achieve a nuclear capability:
"The threat is obvious, even if we have a different
timetable. If we want to postpone their acquisition of a
nuclear capability, then we have to invest time and effort
ourselves."

¶11. (S) Dagan described how the Israeli strategy consists of
five pillars:

A) Political Approach: Dagan praised efforts to bring Iran
before the UNSC, and signaled his agreement with the pursuit
of a third sanctions resolution. He acknowledged that
pressure on Iran is building up, but said this approach alone
will not resolve the crisis. He stressed that the timetable
for political action is different than the nuclear project's
timetable.

B) Covert Measures: Dagan and the Under Secretary agreed not
to discuss this approach in the larger group setting.

C) Counterproliferation: Dagan underscored the need to
prevent know-how and technology from making their way to
Iran, and said that more can be done in this area.

D) Sanctions: Dagan said that the biggest successes had so
far been in this area. Three Iranian banks are on the verge
of collapse. The financial sanctions are having a nationwide
impact. Iran's regime can no longer just deal with the
bankers themselves.

E) Force Regime Change: Dagan said that more should be done
to foment regime change in Iran, possibly with the support of
student democracy movements, and ethnic groups (e.g., Azeris,
Kurds, Baluchs) opposed to the ruling regime.

¶12. (S) Dagan clarified that the U.S., Israel and like-minded
countries must push on all five pillars at the same time.
Some are bearing fruit now; others would bear fruit in due
time, especially if more attention were placed on them.
Dagan urged more attention on regime change, asserting that
more could be done to develop the identities of ethnic
minorities in Iran. He said he was sure that Israel and the
U.S. could "change the ruling regime in Iran, and its
attitude towards backing terror regimes." He added, "We
could also get them to delay their nuclear project. Iran
could become a normal state."

¶13. (S) Dagan stressed that Iran has weak spots that can be
exploited. According to his information, unemployment
exceeds 30 percent nationwide, with some towns and villages
experiencing 50 percent unemployment, especially among 17-30
year olds. Inflation averages more than 40 percent, and
people are criticizing the government for investing in and
sponsoring Hamas, saying that they government should invest
in Iran itself. "The economy is hurting," he said, "and this
is provoking a real crisis among Iran's leaders." He added
that Iran's minorities are "raising their heads, and are
tempted to resort to violence."

¶14. (S) Dagan suggested that more could be done to get the
Europeans to take a tougher stand against Iran. Under
Secretary Burns agreed, and suggested that Israel could help
by reaching out to the Europeans. Dagan said that Israel is
already doing this, and would continue to do so. Dagan
reiterated the need to strike at Iran's heart by engaging
with its people directly. Voice of America (VOA) broadcasts
are important, but more radio transmissions in Farsi are
needed. Coordination with the Gulf states is helpful, but
the U.S. should also coordinate with Azerbaijan and countries
to the north of Iran, to put pressure on Iran. Russia, he
said, would be annoyed, but it would be fitting, as Russia
appears bent on showing the U.S. that it cannot act globally
without considering Russia.

¶15. (S) Under Secretary Burns stressed that the USG is
focused on Iran not only because of its nuclear program, but
also because it supports terrorism and Shiite militias in
Iraq. The U.S. approach is currently focused on the
diplomatic track and increasing pressure on Iran through
sanctions. Work in the UNSC helps to define the Iranian
nuclear threat as one that affects international security,
and not just that of Israel. While UNSC members Russia,
China and Qatar will water down efforts to increase pressure
on Iran, it is still worthwhile to push for a third sanctions
resolution. In the meantime, the U.S. will encourage the
Europeans, Japan and South Korea to implement unilateral
sanctions against Iran outside the UNSC framework. The U.S.
will continue to encourage banks and financial institutions
to slow down their operations in Iran and financially isolate
it. Regarding military pressure, the Under Secretary noted
that the U.S. has deployed 1-2 carrier battle groups in the
Gulf over the last six months, and that President Bush has
stated that he will interrupt Iran's activity in Iraq. As
for outreach to the Iranian people, the VOA is now
broadcasting programs in Farsi, and the USG is trying to get
more Iranian students to visit the U.S. to promote
people-to-people relations.

-----------------------------------------
PAKISTAN: ISRAEL WORRIED ABOUT MUSHARRAF
-----------------------------------------

¶16. (S) On Pakistan, Dagan said that President Musharraf is
losing control, and that some of his coalition partners could
threaten him in the future. The key question, Dagan said, is
whether Musharraf retains his commander-in-chief role in
addition to his role as president. If not, he will have
problems. Dagan observed that there has been an increase in
the number of attempts on Musharraf's life, and wondered
whether he will survive the next few years. Under Secretary
Burns replied that South Asia has assumed vital importance in
American foreign policy since September 11. The U.S. is
committed to denying Afghanistan as a safe-haven for Taliban
and Al-Qaeda activity. The USG will continue to support
Pakistani President Musharraf, and is seeking to boost his
military defensive capabilities. At the same time, the U.S.
is encouraging Pakistan and Afghanistan to work with each
other militarily. Turning to India, Under Secretary Burns
noted that U.S.-Indian economic cooperation is growing, and
that the USG is working effectively to reduce tensions
between India and Pakistan.
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PS_RalphW
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Post by PS_RalphW »

It looks like someone, presumably Mossad, is paying dissidents to bump off nuclear scientists.

I'm guessing this is a two fold purpose, one to directly destroy their nuclear know how, and two to panic other nuclear workers to quit their jobs.

Its the sort of direct intervention that tends to have repercussions.

Expect trouble in the West Bank.
contadino
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Post by contadino »

featherstick wrote:None of it is really earth-shattering though is it?
Well...maybe, maybe not.

Probably the most significant IMO is the US ordering the tracking of UN representatives using their frequent flyer ID. That directly flies (sorry) in the face of the charter between members and the UN.

I say 'maybe not' because the US has already demonstrated contempt for the UN in the past, so doing so a 2nd time (although I don't know the date of that particular message) wouldn't be a great surprise.

So, 'earth-shattering'? One of the worlds' superpowers ignoring the rules of the establishment which mediates on international affairs, has got to be a pretty dangerous situation.

BTW: I've now changed my mind about who's behind it. Now I think it is Israel's work.
MacG
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Post by MacG »

woodpecker wrote:"They try to ride piggyback on the open source movement, but I just cant belive in their story. It just looks like spin."

Various bits about Ben Laurie:

**

Ben Laurie is a founding director of The Apache Software Foundation, a core team member of OpenSSL, a member of the Shmoo Group, a director of the Open Rights Group, Director of Security at The Bunker Secure Hosting, Trustee and Founder-member of FreeBMD, a committer at FreeBSD and Advisory Board member of WikiLeaks.org.[1]

Ben wrote Apache-SSL, the basis of most SSL-enabled versions of the Apache HTTP Server and is a co-author of OpenPGP:SDK.

(from his Wikipedia entry)

**

Would you say Ben is *not* part of the open source movement? Or that somehow while he might be involved in open source he's somehow the unknowing victim of piggybacking?
What on earth does that have to do with WikiLeaks?
MacG
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Post by MacG »

contadino wrote: BTW: I've now changed my mind about who's behind it. Now I think it is Israel's work.
Hmm.. I think it is an independent media-genius. Someone who enjoy reading William Gibson.
2 As and a B
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Post by 2 As and a B »

On the whole, it is much better to shine the light on the work of these cockroaches. It might stop them scheming, at least until they've scuffled off to their more secret places.
MacG
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Post by MacG »

foodimista wrote:On the whole, it is much better to shine the light on the work of these cockroaches. It might stop them scheming, at least until they've scuffled off to their more secret places.
I think about what Stetson Kennedy did to the Ku Klux Klan with the aid of Superman in radio theater. Quite a surprise and freak event nobody had expected.

http://www.worldhistoryblog.com/2005/12 ... t-kkk.html
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woodpecker
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Post by woodpecker »

MacG wrote:
woodpecker wrote:"They try to ride piggyback on the open source movement, but I just cant belive in their story. It just looks like spin."

Various bits about Ben Laurie:

**

Ben Laurie is a founding director of The Apache Software Foundation, a core team member of OpenSSL, a member of the Shmoo Group, a director of the Open Rights Group, Director of Security at The Bunker Secure Hosting, Trustee and Founder-member of FreeBMD, a committer at FreeBSD and Advisory Board member of WikiLeaks.org.[1]

Ben wrote Apache-SSL, the basis of most SSL-enabled versions of the Apache HTTP Server and is a co-author of OpenPGP:SDK.

(from his Wikipedia entry)

**

Would you say Ben is *not* part of the open source movement? Or that somehow while he might be involved in open source he's somehow the unknowing victim of piggybacking?
What on earth does that have to do with WikiLeaks?
He's one of the guys that decides the direction. As mentioned. One of the people you claim not to believe exist, part of the Wikileaks 'story' you don't believe in.
MacG
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Post by MacG »

woodpecker wrote:
MacG wrote:
woodpecker wrote:"They try to ride piggyback on the open source movement, but I just cant belive in their story. It just looks like spin."

Various bits about Ben Laurie:

**

Ben Laurie is a founding director of The Apache Software Foundation, a core team member of OpenSSL, a member of the Shmoo Group, a director of the Open Rights Group, Director of Security at The Bunker Secure Hosting, Trustee and Founder-member of FreeBMD, a committer at FreeBSD and Advisory Board member of WikiLeaks.org.[1]

Ben wrote Apache-SSL, the basis of most SSL-enabled versions of the Apache HTTP Server and is a co-author of OpenPGP:SDK.

(from his Wikipedia entry)

**

Would you say Ben is *not* part of the open source movement? Or that somehow while he might be involved in open source he's somehow the unknowing victim of piggybacking?
What on earth does that have to do with WikiLeaks?
He's one of the guys that decides the direction. As mentioned. One of the people you claim not to believe exist, part of the Wikileaks 'story' you don't believe in.
You really take liberties when interpreting .... !
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Lord Beria3
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Post by Lord Beria3 »

Well on the issue of Iran, I got a lot of trouble for saying that a war against Iran was on the cards a while ago. I feel that in relation to these revelations (that both the Arabs and Israel were both telling the Americans to attack on the strongest terms) that I have been proven right on that score. It is perfectly reasonable to report on potential attacks on Iran.

Regarding the issue of spying on the UN, I can't get upset about it. All the great powers do it... what’s the big fuss?
Peace always has been and always will be an intermittent flash of light in a dark history of warfare, violence, and destruction
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Andy Hunt
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Post by Andy Hunt »

RalphW wrote: Expect trouble in the West Bank.
Sadly, I would be surprised if there were no trouble in the West Bank.
Andy Hunt
http://greencottage.burysolarclub.net
Eternal Sunshine wrote: I wouldn't want to worry you with the truth. :roll:
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Lord Beria3
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Post by Lord Beria3 »

One of the more interesting leaks is the revelation that China has given up on its allly North Korea.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/no ... fied-korea
China has signalled its readiness to accept Korean reunification and is privately distancing itself from the North Korean regime, according to leaked US embassy cables that reveal senior Beijing figures regard their official ally as a "spoiled child".
Not sure how the North Korean elite will respond to this humilation, will they become even more fearful, aggressive and lash out? A dreadful time for it to come out, with the two Koreas on the brink of war! :lol:
Peace always has been and always will be an intermittent flash of light in a dark history of warfare, violence, and destruction
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Andy Hunt
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Post by Andy Hunt »

That's an "interesting" sense of humour you have there Beria.
Andy Hunt
http://greencottage.burysolarclub.net
Eternal Sunshine wrote: I wouldn't want to worry you with the truth. :roll:
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