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Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:55 am
by raspberry-blower
Vortex2 wrote:FWIW I suspect that the A380 cancellation could be due to its very labour intensive construction.

The wiring loom in each plane can be hand made ... thousands of metres of cabling.

This old fashioned approach leads to high costs and delays.
Putting the whole lot into context - including the demise of the Airbus A380 and another low cost airliner that folded on 5th February - Germania:

Wolf Street: Next in the Bankruptcy and Restructuring Saga of European and Asian Airlines

Of particular relevance to the A380 saga:
These bondholders are largely vulture funds whose specialty is exactly this sort of distressed assets, so this is unlikely to be the end of it.

How an airline with financials as unsound as Etihad’s can afford to even contemplate large capital investments in a money-losing company like Jet Airways speaks volumes about the business model adopted by Gulf airlines.

And this business model has been what has so far effectively kept the massively disappointing Airbus A380 program alive and breathing for so long, but the writing is on the wall.
The A380 is a relic of an age in its twilight. Put simply it is uneconomic compared to other available models

Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 11:48 am
by raspberry-blower
Wolf Street: More Airlines collapse: Jet, Alitalia, WOW

A good summary of the demise of over indebted airlines in an over saturated marketplace.

Also linked in here: ... hp?t=27113

Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:43 pm
by kenneal - lagger
The fewer planes flying around the better and the fewer part loaded planes flying around, even better still. May many more airlines go broke.

May the agreement which ensures airlines have tax free fuel also go by the wayside.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:39 am
by PS_RalphW
Flybe, uks largest short haul airline is on the point of collapse. The government is proposing to cancel UK airport taxes for all airlines (competition rules prevent single airlines being favoured) to prevent this. This would drive a coach and horses through the CO2 control legislation and show that Johnson cares f**k all about the environment. Remember he said he would lie down on front of bulldozers to prevent Heathrow expansion.

He is proving to be precisely the liar he has been all his life

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 8:37 am
by fuzzy
Lets see what happens but that would be a shocking outcome. It would prove that govs really don't care about anything.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:47 am
by adam2
If Flybe are allowed to go bust, then presumably some of their routes will be taken over by competitors, but some might close for good.
The closed routes would hopefully result in a permanent reduction in carbon emissions.
And the reduction in flights should also reduce calls for airport expansion.

I fear however that some deal will be done to save Flybe.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:21 pm
by clv101
"The government is to consider cutting air passenger duty on domestic flights as part of a plan to save the airline from collapse." :roll:

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:04 pm
by adam2
What has happened to the climate emergency ?

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:57 pm
by kenneal - lagger
How about writing to your MPs about it. I sent the following to my Tory MP:-
I note that the government are considering the removal of some taxes on airlines to save Flybe from bankruptcy. I hope that you will object to this for the following reasons.

1 This action drives a coach and horses through any claims that the government has any care for the environment or climate change. Aircraft are one of the largest emitters of CO2 in the world and they also put harmful gasses into the atmosphere in a particularly harmful place, making their contribution to climate change even more potent. What has happened to the Climate Emergency when the government can add to the subsidies enjoyed by a grossly polluting industry?

2 This subsidy to an already subsidised industry will harm the railways even more as they do not have the benefit of tax free fuel that the airlines enjoy. What benefits are the railways to be given so that they are not harmed by unfair competition? This reduction in costs to the airline industry will mean that they can offer still cheaper flights putting the railway industry at an even more distinct disadvantage.

3 What does this say about the government's commitment to a capitalist society when failing businesses are not allowed to fail. To me this confirms that capitalism is dead and we live in a Corporatist era where government decisions are made for the benefit and protection of corporations at the expense of the general public.

This business should be allowed to fail so that capacity in the industry can be reduced. Any viable slots can be taken up by other airlines so that aircraft will, in the future, fly with a greater load factor making them more fuel efficient. Cost of flights can be allowed to rise to an economic level, making other airline businesses stronger, and this will make the less polluting railways slightly more competitive.

I am sure that if the government were to explain all this there would be great kudos to be gained. Also Boris's claim that he would lie down in front of bulldozers to prevent Heathrow expansion would be shown to be not just bluster an another of what many people are calling one of his lies.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:53 pm
by PS_RalphW
Rescue deal agreed. Government to 'review' Airport tax. Ie cut it in a few months time when the Media has moved on to something else.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 7:49 pm
by adam2
Climate emergency now forgotten ?

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:37 pm
by ReserveGrowthRulz
adam2 wrote:Climate emergency now forgotten ?
Can't forget it if you never learned it.

Posted: Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:38 pm
by vtsnowedin
A rose by any other name.....

Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 5:31 pm
by adam2
The end now looks near for flybe

Update from TV news at 22-00, now in administration. A flight due to leave Manchester is cancelled without explanation.
Aircraft mechanics filmed removing their tools and other belongings.

Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:34 pm
by kenneal - lagger
That's got the government off the hook. FlyBe should have been allowed to go before Christmas so that other airlines could take up the slack and put their prices up a bit with less competition. Cheap flights are bad for the railways and the environment.