UK drops grade plan.

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vtsnowedin
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UK drops grade plan.

Post by vtsnowedin »

https://dnyuz.com/2020/08/17/uk-scraps- ... s-parents/
LONDON — In a U-turn after days of criticism, the British government on Monday scrapped an exam-grading policy that was set to deprive thousands of 18-year-old school-leavers — especially the more disadvantaged — of places at universities.

Roger Taylor, head of the exam regulator Ofqual, said the use of an algorithm to predict the results of exams that were canceled by the coronavirus pandemic had caused “real anguish and damaged public confidence.�


“It has not been an acceptable experience for young people,� he said. “I would like to say sorry.�
Even with Covid-19 I would think students could actually sit for an exam to get a real grade.
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

There will be a huge outcry next year when the exam results tell a lot of kids that they are not as good as this year's kids so they will all want an upgrade.
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adam2
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Post by adam2 »

Two alternative conclusions may be drawn from this, neither of which is flattering to the education industry.

Option one; that teachers were not objective and offered unduly optimistic forecasts as to what grades could be expected.

Option two, that the great increase in pass rates was well deserved. If such splendid results are genuine, then schooling is obviously not as important as teachers would have us believe.
Schools closed for a large part of the year=record results.
Perhaps we should close schools for even longer in future so as to achieve even better results.
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Post by Little John »

The problem with the algorithm is not that it produced A level grades that were lower than over optimistic teacher assessments. Though, that will, of course, have occurred in some cases.

The problem was that the algorithm produced A level grades that were significantly lower than for previous year's cohorts in many schools. In other words, it was a shit algorithm.

Thus, those schools had an entirely legitimate argument to make in terms of pointing out that this was both grossly unfair to the pupils as well as being demonstrably useless as an algorithm.
Last edited by Little John on Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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clv101
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Post by clv101 »

Little John wrote:The problem was that the algorithm produced A level grades that were significantly lower than for previous year's cohort's in many schools. In other words, it was a shit algorithm.
It was a shit algorithm. And so especially shit with small cohorts it was discounted for small groups. Private schools tend to have smaller cohorts... Oops.

And as if tonight Williamson is still in post. :roll:
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Post by vtsnowedin »

Little John wrote:
The problem was that the algorithm produced A level grades that were significantly lower than for previous year's cohorts in many schools. In other words, it was a shit algorithm.
Or perhaps it revealed the failings of those schools and the misrepresentation of the quality of their graduates.
A hard set of real exams might sort that out but stake holders (the schools and staff) don't want to face that reckoning.
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Post by Little John »

vtsnowedin wrote:
Little John wrote:
The problem was that the algorithm produced A level grades that were significantly lower than for previous year's cohorts in many schools. In other words, it was a shit algorithm.
Or perhaps it revealed the failings of those schools and the misrepresentation of the quality of their graduates.
A hard set of real exams might sort that out but stake holders (the schools and staff) don't want to face that reckoning.
Nope.

The previous grades from those schools were based on externally set exams that were also externally marked.

It is also true to say that the knee jerk reaction of the government to criticism of its algorithm by allowing all grades to now be based on teacher assessments alone is likely to create as equally an invalid set of result, but in the opposite direction, as the algorithm did. But, that is yet another issue.
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Post by Initiation »

kenneal - lagger wrote:There will be a huge outcry next year when the exam results tell a lot of kids that they are not as good as this year's kids so they will all want an upgrade.
Unfortunately this is a likely outcome.

This table from Ofqual shows the 2019 marks and the unadjusted teacher assessments for 2020.

The number of students getting an A or A* rises from 25.5% to 37.8%. Unless 2019 was a particularly dumb year, there have to be questions on the accuracy of teacher assessments.

Whatever method is used though will never be perfect. The real losers are all those who have lost out on months of education and are going into a world with reduced job prospects and growing debt. One of the growing number of long term consequences of lockdown.

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Post by Little John »

Nope. Whilst whatever method is used will never be perfect, some methods are vastly, overwhelmingly more imperfect than others.

Purely teacher assessed grades will be bullshit. Employing an algorithm that is marking pupils' grades down at least a grade and as much as two grades lower than previous cohort of kids from exactly the same educational demographic will also be bullshit.

An algorithm that was not actually massively invalid was all that was required to produce a result that, whilst imperfect, would have been vastly superior to the shit show currently underway.
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Post by vtsnowedin »

A student locked at home could choose to educate himself by reading a few good books. The exams should determine how much information a student has absorbed and how many processes he or she can apply to answer problems. More difficult for the first few grades but once a student can read there is no problem with them gaining information from the available libraries and on line.
A student that spent the time playing video games should not be placed alongside a student that spent the same time gaining useful knowledge.
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Post by stumuz1 »

adam2 wrote:
Option two, that the great increase in pass rates was well deserved. If such splendid results are genuine, then schooling is obviously not as important as teachers would have us believe.
Schools closed for a large part of the year=record results.
Perhaps we should close schools for even longer in future so as to achieve even better results.
Brilliant :D :D :D :D
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Post by Lord Beria3 »

Let's see what next year's A level and GSCE results deliver.

My bet is a massive drop from 2020. Why? Teachers inflated the likely marks of their kids (a clear conflict of interest BTW) and longer term, the 2020 cohort results will be dismissed as junk by employers in the future.

I feel sorry for the kids.
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Re: UK drops grade plan.

Post by UndercoverElephant »

vtsnowedin wrote: Even with Covid-19 I would think students could actually sit for an exam to get a real grade.
That wouldn't have been fair, because they'd have lost their teaching in the crucial months leading up to the exam. Although it probably would have been less bad than the current situation, which is completely unresolvable.

If they take teachers predicted grades (unmoderated) then it is unfair on those pupils whose teachers were realistic instead of optimistic, and also on students from other years.

There is no fair solution now.
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Post by Lord Beria3 »

Agree UE.

Like I said, I feel sorry for the kids.
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Post by clv101 »

All this talk about 'fairness'. The conventional exam system isn't 'fair'.
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