Global youth uprising

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ReserveGrowthRulz
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

Mark wrote:Hurry up RGR, VT......, get your flights booked.....
And this has to do with...?
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Post by vtsnowedin »

Mark wrote:Hurry up RGR, VT......, get your flights booked.....

You've missed one:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... ve-vietnam
I'll leave the mouse hunting to the cats.
You must consider that any hunter knows or should know that hunting a prey species to extinction is illogical.
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

vtsnowedin wrote:..
You must consider that any hunter knows or should know that hunting a prey species to extinction is illogical.
That hasn't stopped it happening in the past!
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
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Mark
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Post by Mark »

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
Mark wrote:Hurry up RGR, VT......, get your flights booked.....

You've missed one:
https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... ve-vietnam
And this has to do with global youth irritation, guns, peak oil, posters from the home of the brave and land of the free or anything interesting...how?
It has plenty to do with all of them, either directly or indirectly.
Your/our generation along with the big corporates have totally abused and degraded the planet.
The future is very bleak for the natural world and all but the richest and most powerful humans
I know you won't/can't accept that, but that's your problem, not mine.
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

Mark wrote:...........The future is very bleak for the natural world and all but the richest and most powerful humans .................
If it's very bleak for us then it will also be bleak for them because whether they believe it or not they rely on the rest of us for their riches. Without the support of us plebs their money and riches are worth nothing at all. You can't eat cash and especially not electronic money and as for bartering their derivatives? !!!
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
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ReserveGrowthRulz
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

What, you find out about the indignities that humans inflict on our biosphere only after the internet was invented?
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Post by Mark »

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
Mark wrote:
ReserveGrowthRulz wrote: And this has to do with global youth irritation, guns, peak oil, posters from the home of the brave and land of the free or anything interesting...how?
It has plenty to do with all of them, either directly or indirectly.
Your/our generation along with the big corporates have totally abused and degraded the planet.
Agreed, with the caveat than anytime you can find evidence of the Roman civilization in the ice in Greenland, you can't restrict this overall idea to just the current generation.
Mark wrote: The future is very bleak for the natural world and all but the richest and most powerful humans
I know you won't/can't accept that, but that's your problem, not mine.
I was around when 4 billion people were supposed to die back during the 70's from starvation, pollution blotting out the Sun, thermonuclear winter, etc etc. Of course the future is bleak, has been for half a century now.

What, you find out about the indignities that humans inflict on our biosphere only after the internet was invented?
You just have a need to be obtuse, but that's your problem.
As I'm sure you already know, it's the current and accelerating RATE that's important:
https://www.un.org/sustainabledevelopme ... t-impacts/

The UN think there's still time to reverse the worst impacts - or at least they did in 2016...
Personally, I'm not so optimistic...
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ReserveGrowthRulz
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

At least when scientists did Doom back then, they didn't pussy foot around it.
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Post by Mark »

I know this is a Peak Oil Forum, but this is about lots more than just oil...
Appreciate that we're just a millisecond in the life of the planet, but our impact is totally and utterly out-of-step with the natural world, whatever issue you choose to look at.
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

Mark wrote:I know this is a Peak Oil Forum, but this is about lots more than just oil...
Indeed.
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Post by Mark »

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:Indeed. But peak oilers didn't understand petroleum engineering or resource economics either, but the point isn't that they were singularly ignorant of the relevant scientific topics involved in peak oil.

The point is that any geologic perspective doesn't tend to automatically contain the end of the world component that the temperature watchers seem to associate most strongly with.

Geologic processes, hell astrophysical processes have rocked this world in ways far more substantial, and far faster, than anything us humans have done. But because the human perspective is one of hubris, versus the geologic one which isn't, you have different perspectives on a seemingly simple idea, such as the rate of change of a thing.

Our impact, as is our very existence and the existence of our planet, is insignificant. Oh, I understand it soon might be significant to a significant chunk of us individually, but that is irrelevant, or not, based solely on perspective.

We all die. Be it from climate change induced causes, accident, or simple old age. Once you come to grips with that, the caterwauling about the how, when and why are just fingernails drawn across a blackboard.

It sucks what we are choosing to do to our biosphere. But make no mistake, we are choosing to do it, with every item we consume, every CO2 emitting decision we make. All the faux concern and COP21 conferences for climate folk to take excellent selfies in Paris while pretending that grand proclamations are the same as effective action is amusing to watch, but that means it was only entertainment. Nothing more.
You won't be surprised that I disagree. If we just consider planet earth (as we know it), human existence and our impact IS VERY significant.
Climate Change is real, we're consuming the planet's resources at a terrifying rate and are systematically depopulating the planet of it's biodiversity:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-50531208
https://www.forbes.com/sites/trevornace ... ae7f2b7bad

We can either sit back with complacency, say that it 'sucks' and make snide comments about those (imperfect) organisations that try to do something. Or we can put pressure on our Governments to support/strengthen these international agreements (like the way that the Montreal Protocol has helped to address/reverse the ozone depletion issue).

Framing the debate in cosmic/geological terms is just another 'red herring', and an excuse to justify inaction. When I depart this mortal coil, I expect that planet earth will still exist, but it will be in a much degraded/poorer state from when I arrived. Individually, I've probably made zero difference, but at least I've tried.....
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

Mark wrote:
ReserveGrowthRulz wrote: We all die.
You won't be surprised that I disagree.
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

One of the books that I read in the 70s and 80s pointed out that at one time miners could find one tonne boulders of almost pure copper lying around on the surface. Now they are digging bloody great holes in the ground 5000 feet deep for 1% or less ores. We really are scrapping the barrel for our resources now which doesn't bode well for the civilisations which might want to develop after our current one dies, as it sometime will.

Previous civilisations which died were replaced by others in different locations where there were abundant resources to harness. It will take some ingenuity to find new resources once our civilisation dies unless they can exist on our scrap heaps with wood as an energy source.
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
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ReserveGrowthRulz
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Post by ReserveGrowthRulz »

kenneal - lagger wrote: It will take some ingenuity to find new resources once our civilisation dies unless they can exist on our scrap heaps with wood as an energy source.
Without aforementioned ingenuity happening BEFORE our civilization dies, we would have already died off.
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

ReserveGrowthRulz wrote:
kenneal - lagger wrote: It will take some ingenuity to find new resources once our civilisation dies unless they can exist on our scrap heaps with wood as an energy source.
Without aforementioned ingenuity happening BEFORE our civilization dies, we would have already died off. Ingenuity allowing us to not need those tonne sized boulders of copper, and instead make it on the ittsy bittsy sized pieces.

Sort of like ReserveGrowthRulz...except in copper. :)
So we just keep using more and more energy to dig deeper and deeper for ever more poor ores and we do it all with renewable energy so it's sustainable! And it's not just copper where we are facing this.

All we need is RGR's infinite optimism and our civilisation will be everlasting with infinite growth. We'll get all we need from all those asteroids just out there beyond whatever! Send a tug up lug it back and the heat of re-entry will smelt it for us! Loads of ingots will land on the pallet at the factory gate just as calculated.
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
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