Ebola outbreak, and other potential epidemics

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emordnilap
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Post by emordnilap »

fuzzy wrote:Yes Biff was lynched in many a nasty pack fight, but he seemed to have stockholm syndrome and tried to encourage it. I wish him well wherever he is. I didn't agree with his outlook, but he had honourable motives.
Losing Biff, we lost a vital counterweight.

Maybe even so with JH, but the sun's out, which may have an influence on me. :lol:
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
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clv101
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Post by clv101 »

fuzzy wrote:I wish him well wherever he is.
He's recently put on an art exhibition: http://transitiontownlouth.org.uk/bell4.html

Considers human migration from the ice-age, slave trade, 1940s, present day Mediterranean and future movements associated with climate change.

Some really excellent pieces here, described by one visitor "This was the most intellectually coherent exhibition I have attended in years."
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PS_RalphW
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Post by PS_RalphW »

Current ebola outbreak in Congo raising concern because of local
armed conflict and cultural resistance are hampering vacination and control

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-healt ... KKCN1M510T
kenneal - lagger
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

clv101 wrote:.......Considers human migration from the ice-age, slave trade, 1940s, present day Mediterranean and future movements associated with climate change. ......
If you look back at the mass migrations of the past they have all had a deleterious effect on the host population so I can only assume that Biff cares more for the migrants than he does his own family and friends with his encouragement of current migration.
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
kenneal - lagger
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Post by kenneal - lagger »

PS_RalphW wrote:Current ebola outbreak in Congo raising concern because of local
armed conflict and cultural resistance are hampering vacination and control

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-healt ... KKCN1M510T
With any luck the insurgents will go down with Ebola and we'll hear nothing more of them. Things don't often happen that way unfortunately!
Action is the antidote to despair - Joan Baez
Little John
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Post by Little John »

kenneal - lagger wrote:
clv101 wrote:.......Considers human migration from the ice-age, slave trade, 1940s, present day Mediterranean and future movements associated with climate change. ......
If you look back at the mass migrations of the past they have all had a deleterious effect on the host population so I can only assume that Biff cares more for the migrants than he does his own family and friends with his encouragement of current migration.
Those thoughts precisely mirror my own.
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UndercoverElephant
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Post by UndercoverElephant »

emordnilap wrote: Losing Biff, we lost a vital counterweight.
It is unfortunate that he left. But I wish he had stayed and actually admitted that some of what he had been saying had been demonstrated to be wrong. That doesn't involve completely changing everything he believes, but it does involve acknowledging that some things had to change.

In other words, I would have much preferred the debate to have moved on, rather than one person being forced to leave because he came under so much pressure for defending things that he must have known, deep down, to be untenable given the inevitability of further deterioration of the human predicament.
woodburner
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Post by woodburner »

PS_RalphW wrote:Current ebola outbreak in Congo raising concern because of local
armed conflict and cultural resistance are hampering vacination and control

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-healt ... KKCN1M510T
Here we go again. The political statements which have a questionable foundation.

What about taking a broader view?
Starfield concluded that, every year in the US, the medical system directly kills 225,000 people. 106,000 die as a result of medicines the FDA has approved as safe. The other 119,000 die as a result of treatment in hospitals.
Makes the claimed ebola death count look tame by comparison. I get the impression it is a good sell story for news publishers, where flu isn’t getting the readers in. Also worth remembering Agenda 21 is the reason for the WHOs existence.
If a doctor says a patient died of virus VCX-2QK-89tf, a supposed thing the mother of the patient will never see and never have a chance of seeing…and if the doctor says he knows the patient had the virus because a diagnostic test was run on the patient…the mother will believe the doctor…even though she has absolutely no idea what kind of diagnostic test was run or whether it is accurate or even relevant.

“I saw my son die of the virus.�

She didn’t. But she’ll believe it. We can understand why she believes it.

But that doesn’t affect our judgment when we look into a virus and investigate whether it is real, whether it actually causes disease, and whether the diagnostic tests for the virus tell a true story.

When you have hundreds of millions of people who assert that Ebola is killing people, you’re looking at faith.

Blind faith in authorities who don’t deserve it.
Take this example—a farming village in Liberia, one of the so-called epicenters of Ebola. The families manage to produce enough to get by. They live downstream from a giant Firestone rubber plantation.

For years, to no avail, the people of the village have been protesting the runoff of noxious elements into their water supply. Fish are dying. Crops are failing. That means malnutrition, hunger.

That means chemical assault on their immune systems.

People are developing sores, lesions, fevers, respiratory problems, digestive problems, including diarrhea.

How easy is it to call this Ebola, in light of the current hysteria?

“Everyone knows� it’s Ebola. But it isn’t.

People are obsessed by the idea that a whole population, in far-off nation, under the gun, must all be suffering from One Thing—in this case, a virus.

Splitting this apart into a number of different causes in different regions—contaminated water, open sewage, severe malnutrition, decimating wars, toxic vaccine campaigns, the vast overuse of antibiotics, industrial pollution—this doesn’t have the compelling ring of: “It’s a virus.�

So people say, “Forget about all that. We don’t want to know about it. We know it’s a virus.�

No they don’t.

Reference

The nutters were at it in 2014
HARTFORD, CT — Governor Dannel Malloy has declared Connecticut to be in a state of public health emergency, enabling the indefinite suspension of certain civil rights. State bureaucrats have been granted the broad authority to forcibly detain suspected sick people without due process. The declaration came preemptively, as Connecticut has not yet seen a single case of the virus it purports to stop.

The governor’s October 7th declaration read as follows:

“In response to the epidemic of the Ebola virus currently affecting multiple countries in western Africa, and in order to provide the Commissioner of Public Health and other appropriate officials with all authorities necessary to prevent any potential transmission of the Ebola virus within the State of Connecticut, I hereby declare a public health emergency for the State, pursuant to the Connecticut General Statutes Section 19a-131a, for the duration of the epidemic. Specifically, in accordance with Connecticut General Statutes Section 19a-131b, I authorize the Commissioner of Public Health to Order the isolation or quarantine, under conditions prescribed by the Commissioner of Public Health, of any individual or group of individuals whom the Commissioner reasonably believes to have been exposed to, infected with, or otherwise at risk of passing the Ebola virus.�
– Governor Dannel P. Malloy, October 7, 2014


Rationalizing his actions, the governor said in a statement: “We need to have the authorities in place that will allow us to move quickly to protect public health, if and when that becomes necessary. Signing this order will allow us to do that.�

The recipient of most of the newly-imparted power is Jewel Mullen, Connecticut’s Commissioner of the Department of Public Health (DPH). By having this measure in place, Commissioner Mullen explained, “we don’t have to scramble in the event I need to take action.�

The actions that authorities might want to “scramble� to use is the forcible quarantine of citizens — without charges or trial.

Connecticut General Statutes Section 19a-131a spells out the powers that may be used during the state of public health emergency:

“[While] the emergency exists [the state] may do any of the following: (1) Order the commissioner to implement all or a portion of the public health emergency response plan developed pursuant to section 19a-131g; (2) authorize the commissioner to isolate or quarantine persons in accordance with section 19a-131b; (3) order the commissioner to vaccinate persons in accordance with section 19a-131e; or (4) apply for and receive federal assistance.�

As noted above, the Commissioner may issue an order of mass vaccination at his or her own discretion.

Section 19a-131d states that any individual who refuses to comply with any portion of the order may be punished with with fines and imprisonment for up to one (1) year.
(My bold)

They had this sort bollocks in Leicester with smallpox vaccinations. The people revolted, the stopped vaccinating, and the incidence of smallpox outbreaks, er, plummited. Well whadayoukno?

Jenner was later proved to be a fraud.
To become an extremist, hang around with people you agree with. Cass Sunstein
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emordnilap
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Post by emordnilap »

Indeed, the broader picture is often missed.

Here in Ireland, we have a health service 'crisis' - patients waiting for days on trollies, people waiting for years for procedures, never enough beds, resources or staff.

No-one ever seems to address the question, "Why so many sick people"? Pre-emptive health care scares the money men.
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
woodburner
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Post by woodburner »

Just by way of keeping people off the streets (though as it’s a radio interview they could walk around with their iWhatever) here is a lengthy conversation on how we are protected by the world of government and medicine. Nice to know someone cares.

https://youtu.be/etO5KiAHrks even mentions ebola (a lot).
To become an extremist, hang around with people you agree with. Cass Sunstein
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emordnilap
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Post by emordnilap »

woodburner wrote:Just by way of keeping people off the streets (though as it’s a radio interview they could walk around with their iWhatever) here is a lengthy conversation on how we are protected by the world of government and medicine. Nice to know someone cares.

https://youtu.be/etO5KiAHrks even mentions ebola (a lot).
Interesting. Hardly surprising...no corporation has the interests of its customers at heart and this is particularly - no, vitally! - true of pharmaceuticals.

Hand-in-hand with food industries, they are forced, by law, (because of their obligations to shareholders) to make people ill.
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
fuzzy
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Post by fuzzy »

And anyone who has a few hours to spare could learn a lot about one reason why the 1st world has bankrupt medical systems etc - Real eye openers that are compulsory for anyone whose waist grows with age:

1st one has crappy audio

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wv_ZA88ytg4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIegMp5cWBY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL5-9ZxamXc
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emordnilap
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Post by emordnilap »

Coincidentally, I'm just reading an article which says much the same thing, better put than I could.
We have moved into “corporatism� (favored by Benito Mussolini), which is a halfway point on the road to full-blown fascism.

Corporatism is where the few moneyed interests—not elected by the citizenry—rule over the many. In this way, it is not a democracy or a republican form of government, which is what the American government was established to be. It is a top-down form of government and one which has a terrifying history typified by the developments that occurred in totalitarian regimes of the past: police states where everyone is watched and spied on, rounded up for minor infractions by government agents, placed under police control, and placed in detention (a.k.a. concentration) camps.

For the final hammer of fascism to fall, it will require the most crucial ingredient: the majority of the people will have to agree that it’s not only expedient but necessary.
Ahh, yes, I recognise that.

Source
I experience pleasure and pains, and pursue goals in service of them, so I cannot reasonably deny the right of other sentient agents to do the same - Steven Pinker
woodburner
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Post by woodburner »

A few more points about Ebola need to be considered...

This is a disease that spreads most effectively among populations that have a substantially poorer nutritional status than is seen in the United States and other well-fed populations around the world. Of course, any exposure to a high enough titer of virus can allow an infection to "take hold," even in a well-nourished individual.

Furthermore, it has been published that there are a substantial number of individuals, often healthcare workers who treated Ebola patients, who have a symptomless infection when exposed to Ebola virus. This further supports the concept just mentioned that the nutritional status of the exposed individuals is a very important consideration in determining the likelihood of the infection proceeding to severe illness or even death.

Fixes everything including Ebola
To become an extremist, hang around with people you agree with. Cass Sunstein
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UndercoverElephant
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Post by UndercoverElephant »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-47907976
Ebola outbreak 'not global emergency yet'

The World Health Organization says the spread of Ebola in the Democratic Republic of Congo is not yet a global health emergency.

The Ebola outbreak is the second biggest in history - infecting 1,206 people and killing 764. It shows no sign of being contained soon.

Efforts by healthcare workers have been hampered by conflict and rebel attacks.

And experts have warned it will be "very difficult to bring it under control".
Ominous.
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