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March of the Beekeepers

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:23 pm
by biffvernon
http://www.ejfoundation.org/bees/march_ ... beekeepers
The March of the Beekeepers

10.30am for 11am start. Ends 12.30 / Friday 26th April 2013

Parliament Square, Westminster, London

Who: Avaaz, Buglife, Environmental Justice Foundation, Friends of the Earth, Greenpeace, Pesticide Action Network UK, RSPB, Soil Association and 38 Degrees.

What: Beekeepers with smokers (not lit), flanked by supporting celebrities, people wearing beehive hair, carrying flowers, apples, pears and other pollinated vegetables, honey and jam, a giant Winnie the Pooh.

Why: To grab the weekend headlines and pile the pressure on the Rt Hon Owen Paterson MP, Secretary of State for Environment and Rural Affairs, ahead of a vital EU vote banning neonicotinoid pesticides on Monday 29th April. Even the House of Commons Environmental Audit Committee has concluded certain neonicotinoids are harmful to bees and The March of the Beekeepers will show Mr Paterson the full weight of public, expert and Government opinion and persuade him to now support a European ban.

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:46 pm
by UndercoverElephant
It is truly extra-ordinary that it is taking this much effort to get the message through to the FUCKWITS that are running this country. This 2013, not 1965. We know these pesticides are killing bees and other invertebrates that are essential to the proper functioning of the ecosystem, not to mention the ECONOMY OF THE UK. We still have farms, right? :roll:

Owen Paterson is currently heading for a special place in the history of ECOLOGICAL FUCKWITTERY.

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:55 pm
by Little John
Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:59 pm
by Little John
UndercoverElephant wrote:It is truly extra-ordinary that it is taking this much effort to get the message through to the FUCKWITS that are running this country. This 2013, not 1965. We know these pesticides are killing bees and other invertebrates that are essential to the proper functioning of the ecosystem, not to mention the ECONOMY OF THE UK. We still have farms, right? :roll:

Owen Paterson is currently heading for a special place in the history of ECOLOGICAL FUCKWITTERY.
Given the blatantly obvious danger these pesticides pose to pollinators one can only suspect the powerful hidden lobbying hand of big-pharma behind the UK government's current intransigence.

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 7:24 am
by biffvernon
stevecook172001 wrote:Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?
No. But there is a chemical reason why the two words share a number of letters.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonicotinoid

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 8:25 am
by Little John
biffvernon wrote:
stevecook172001 wrote:Are neonicotinoids the same as nicotine?
No. But there is a chemical reason why the two words share a number of letters.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonicotinoid
Well, now, you may be surprised to learn I'd already reasonably surmised they might be related B. My question was whether they are the same. Whilst you have answered that question with the first part of your post (though a little more expansion on "no" would have been welcome) the second part of your post is, as usual, unnecessarily patronising.

That's a fairly hefty ego you're lugging around with you there B. Either that, or you really do need to work on your communication skills.

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:09 pm
by biffvernon
Bloody Hell Steve, calm down.

There were three bits to my response.
1. the 'No', was just a neat statement of fact, answering your question.
2. I then qualified that by pointing out that there was a reason why the two words had a similarity.
3. I then posted a link that explained what that similarity was and how it arose.
I was trying to be helpful, giving you a short answer to your sensible question and pointing you in the direction of a longer answer should you want it. What more could you have wanted?

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:08 pm
by Little John
biffvernon wrote:Bloody Hell Steve, calm down.

There were three bits to my response.
1. the 'No', was just a neat statement of fact, answering your question.
2. I then qualified that by pointing out that there was a reason why the two words had a similarity.
3. I then posted a link that explained what that similarity was and how it arose.
I was trying to be helpful, giving you a short answer to your sensible question and pointing you in the direction of a longer answer should you want it. What more could you have wanted?
Fair enough B. My mistake was in assuming that it would be blindingly obvious to you I was not so unutterably thick as to not already realize that "neonocotinoid", being linguistically very similar to "nicotine", would be obviously related and that my question was, therefore, about whether or not they were essentially synonymous terms.

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:31 pm
by RenewableCandy
Which begs the question:

Bee forages on tobacco-plant flowers. What happens next? Does the bee snuff it (or get lost, or whatever)? And if so, is this a rather serious evolutionary drawback for said tobacco plant?

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:34 pm
by Little John
RenewableCandy wrote:Which begs the question:

Bee forages on tobacco-plant flowers. What happens next? Does the bee snuff it (or get lost, or whatever)? And if so, is this a rather serious evolutionary drawback for said tobacco plant?
That's exactly what I was wondering about. If true, then one might surmise that the flowers do not contain nicotine. Either that, or nicotine, though a related substance, is not the same as nicotinoids. Nevertheless, I am sure you will have heard of using nicotine from a packet of rolling tobacco as a very effective insecticide, so I'm not sure at all.

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:38 pm
by RenewableCandy
Yes, I do believe my grandfather (a keen gardener) used to do just that.

I mean, I'm assuming baccy plants aren't wind-pollinated?

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:49 pm
by UndercoverElephant
RenewableCandy wrote:Yes, I do believe my grandfather (a keen gardener) used to do just that.

I mean, I'm assuming baccy plants aren't wind-pollinated?
Insect pollinated. That's why they smell so nice (the flowers). Moths probably, because they smell at night.

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 4:52 pm
by UndercoverElephant
My guess was right - normal pollinators are moths:

http://phenomena.nationalgeographic.com ... mingbirds/

Posted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:09 pm
by biffvernon
Image

Posted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:45 pm
by RenewableCandy
But...if Nicotine's an insecticide, doesn't it kill (or at least damage) the moths?